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Thread: slightly nervous

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    I'll be turning 18 this upcomming February and I'm looking forward to purchasing a handgun and exercising my newfound right as a legal adult. Despite my enthusiasm, buisness comes first. I am very certain of the legality of an 18-year-old carrying a pistol (thanks to other members of this forum)but I'm still a bit nervous about the purchasing a handgun legally part.

    1. Is it legal for an 18-year-old to obtain a P.P.P. (pistol purchase permit)?

    2. At what point of a transaction should I get a P.P.P.? After I've found a seller willing to work with me?

    3. does a P.P.P. cost anything?

    4. What do they do for the saftey inspection/registration?

    5. Is there any waiting period?



    any help offered would be much appreciated as I'm new to handguns and want this to go as smooth as possible


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    You'll have to be 21 to purchase a handgun, unless your state allows you to purchase one in a private (non-dealer) transaction.

    Otherwise, you'll have to exercise your right with, say, a nice 12 ga. shotgun, preferably with a sharp bayonet attached.... :P
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    From what i've read, at the age of 18 you're allowed to purchase from a private dealer as long as the buyer has a CPL or a purchase permit issued by the local pd/sherrif...i'm just not 100% if they'll issue a licence to purchase to an 18-year-old

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    Seif5034 wrote:
    From what i've read, at the age of 18 you're allowed to purchase from a private dealer as long as the buyer has a CPL or a purchase permit issued by the local pd/sherrif...i'm just not 100% if they'll issue a licence to purchase to an 18-year-old
    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum30/11243.html



    Seif, you must be 21 years of age or older to obtain a CPL and to buy a handgun from a FFL. 18-20 years of age must obtain a "License To Purchase" from your local PD. If your city, village does not have a local PD, then you must go to your local sheriff's dept. (your county).

    If you're 21 or older with a CPL, a "License To Purchase" is not required (See Link).

    http://www.michigan.gov/msp/0,1607,7...6241--,00.html


    RI-60 (Pistol Sales Record) must be filled-out by seller. (3)Three copies, you get one, the seller retains one, and the seller must mail the third to MSP.

    http://www.michigan.gov/documents/ri-060_6454_7.pdf







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    Seif5034 wrote:
    I'll be turning 18 this upcomming February and I'm looking forward to purchasing a handgun and exercising my newfound right as a legal adult. Despite my enthusiasm, buisness comes first. I am very certain of the legality of an 18-year-old carrying a pistol (thanks to other members of this forum)but I'm still a bit nervous about the purchasing a handgun legally part.

    1. Is it legal for an 18-year-old to obtain a P.P.P. (pistol purchase permit)?

    2. At what point of a transaction should I get a P.P.P.? After I've found a seller willing to work with me?

    3. does a P.P.P. cost anything?

    4. What do they do for the saftey inspection/registration?

    5. Is there any waiting period?



    any help offered would be much appreciated as I'm new to handguns and want this to go as smooth as possible
    As Springer said. You can get a permit to purchase at 18. The permits do not cost anything. The issuing department can charge up to $10 for the notary fee if you wish to have them notorize it for you, but it isn't required that you have them do it, just that it be done.

    To answer:

    1. Yes

    2. The permits are good for only 10 days. It's your choice depending on how well you know the seller and the circumstances. However, you need to have the permit before the transaction.

    3. No, see my above statement.

    4. It's been known to vary from department to department.

    5. Not legaly, but some departments do it anyway.

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    ghostrider wrote:
    Seif5034 wrote:
    I'll be turning 18 this upcomming February and I'm looking forward to purchasing a handgun and exercising my newfound right as a legal adult. Despite my enthusiasm, buisness comes first. I am very certain of the legality of an 18-year-old carrying a pistol (thanks to other members of this forum)but I'm still a bit nervous about the purchasing a handgun legally part.

    1. Is it legal for an 18-year-old to obtain a P.P.P. (pistol purchase permit)?

    2. At what point of a transaction should I get a P.P.P.? After I've found a seller willing to work with me?

    3. does a P.P.P. cost anything?

    4. What do they do for the saftey inspection/registration?

    5. Is there any waiting period?



    any help offered would be much appreciated as I'm new to handguns and want this to go as smooth as possible
    As Springer said. You can get a permit to purchase at 18. The permits do not cost anything. The issuing department can charge up to $10 for the notary fee if you wish to have them notorize it for you, but it isn't required that you have them do it, just that it be done.

    To answer:

    1. Yes

    2. The permits are good for only 10 days. It's your choice depending on how well you know the seller and the circumstances. However, you need to have the permit before the transaction.

    3. No, see my above statement.

    4. It's been known to vary from department to department.

    5. Not legaly, but some departments do it anyway.
    Just to add some of my experiences: (Genesee County, other counties may/do vary)

    1.

    2.

    3.License to Purchase:MCL 28.423was repealed by PA 381 of 2000 eliminating the $5 processing fee for obtaining a License to Purchase. However, you may be charged a fee to notarize the application for a License to Purchase.
    Safety Inspection Certificate (registration):MCL 28.429There is no charge for the Safety Inspection Certificate.
    License to Carry a Concealed Pistol:MCL 28.425b(5)The application fee is $105 payable to the county clerk at the time the application is filed. Fingerprinting at the county sheriff's office is included in this cost. If you choose to be fingerprinted by alocal police agency, that agencymay charge an additional fee up to $15 for fingerprinting costs.


    For Genesee County I payed $105, but the fingerprinting I was not charged for and no notarizing fee.

    4. The three times I went in for "Safety Inspection", they just asked what the serial number is and how long the barrel is. The other info they needed for the "Green Card" came from my CPL and "Pistol Sales Record".

    5. Before I had my CPL, I had to wait 2 of 3 days before they issued me the license to purchase.

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    Okay. Thanks for the replies. I understand it now. $105 is kinda pricey though...oh well, It's worth it

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    Seif5034 wrote:
    Okay. Thanks for the replies. I understand it now. $105 is kinda pricey though...oh well, It's worth it
    Yes it is. Think of it this way, the CPL is good for approximately 5 years, that's about $1.75 a month. A large coffee and breakfast burrito at the golden arches cost more than that...a day.

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    The $105 mentioned is for the CPL. As you will be 18, that will not apply because you will not be obtaining one.
    Springer, If you do not have a CPL, you still have to take the test and get at least a 70% score, correct?

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    67390FE wrote:
    The $105 mentioned is for the CPL. As you will be 18, that will not apply because you will not be obtaining one.
    Springer, If you do not have a CPL, you still have to take the test and get at least a 70% score, correct?



    Yes. But if you fail, you're allowed to take it again.

    The PD or Sheriff's Dept. may not allow you to repeat the test that same day depending on who is at the desk and how busy they are. I personally, have not met anyone who has failed.

    I don't remember exactly howmany questions there are on the test, I think it's about 15 plus or minus. Anyway, you're allowed to miss 4 or 5 to pass.


    Edit to add: This is for Genesee County, I don't know if there'svariations (test) from county to county.


    http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(2vd...ame=mcl-28-422

    In pertinent part:

    (i) The person correctly answers 70% or more of the questions on a basic pistol safety review questionnaire approved by the basic pistol safety review board and provided to the individual free of charge by the licensing authority. If the person fails to correctly answer 70% or more of the questions on the basic pistol safety review questionnaire, the licensing authority shall inform the person of the questions he or she answered incorrectly and allow the person to attempt to complete another basic pistol safety review questionnaire. The person shall not be allowed to attempt to complete more than 2 basic pistol safety review questionnaires on any single day. The licensing authority shall allow the person to attempt to complete the questionnaire during normal business hours on the day the person applies for his or her license.

    (4) Applications for licenses under this section shall be signed by the applicant under oath upon forms provided by the director of the department of state police. Licenses to purchase, carry, or transport pistols shall be executed in triplicate upon forms provided by the director of the department of state police and shall be signed by the licensing authority. Three copies of the license shall be delivered to the applicant by the licensing authority.

    (5) Upon the sale of the pistol, the seller shall fill out the license forms describing the pistol sold, together with the date of sale, and sign his or her name in ink indicating that the pistol was sold to the licensee. The licensee shall also sign his or her name in ink indicating the purchase of the pistol from the seller. The seller may retain a copy of the license as a record of the sale of the pistol. The licensee shall return 2 copies of the license to the licensing authority within 10 days following the purchase of the pistol.

    (6) One copy of the license shall be retained by the licensing authority as an official record for a period of 6 years. The other copy of the license shall be forwarded by the licensing authority within 48 hours to the director of the department of state police. A license is void unless used within 10 days after the date of its issue.

    (7) This section does not apply to the purchase of pistols from wholesalers by dealers regularly engaged in the business of selling pistols at retail, or to the sale, barter, or exchange of pistols kept as relics or curios not made for modern ammunition or permanently deactivated. This section does not prevent the transfer of ownership of pistols that are inherited if the license to purchase is approved by the commissioner or chief of police, sheriff, or their authorized deputies, and signed by the personal representative of the estate or by the next of kin having authority to dispose of the pistol.

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    Michigan, and I am sure that this happens in other states as well, is goofy when it comes to an 18 year old purchasing a handgun. You may obtain a purchase permit, however, you can only buy a hand gun from a private party which means you can not go into a gun store to make the purchase. FFL holders can not sell handguns to any person unless they are at least 21 years old. Now, your father or mother could buy a handgun then gift the pistol to you at some point. You would still need to get the required purchase permit. Buying a firearm as a gift is not a straw purchase unless the 4473 purchaser knows that the person getting the gift would not be able pass the instant background check.

    A handgun would make a lovely birthday present for any deserving young son.



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    DickTracy1953 wrote:
    A handgun would make a lovely birthday present for any deserving young son.
    Or daughter...



    But seriously, you can take 2 of those basic pistol tests a day? If you can't get 70%, you might want to get some training before you buy a handgun.

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    DickTracy1953 wrote:
    Michigan, and I am sure that this happens in other states as well, is goofy when it comes to an 18 year old purchasing a handgun. You may obtain a purchase permit, however, you can only buy a hand gun from a private party which means you can not go into a gun store to make the purchase. FFL holders can not sell handguns to any person unless they are at least 21 years old. Now, your father or mother could buy a handgun then gift the pistol to you at some point. You would still need to get the required purchase permit. Buying a firearm as a gift is not a straw purchase unless the 4473 purchaser knows that the person getting the gift would not be able pass the instant background check.

    A handgun would make a lovely birthday present for any deserving young son.

    Your father or mother, unless they have a CPL, would be required to obtain the "License to Purchase" to buya handgun from a FFL or otherwise. On the plus side, if buying from a FFL, you don't have to deal with the RI-60 forms (Pistol Sales Record)-the seller (FFL in this case) must complete the forms.

    Edit to add:

    The 4473 form (ATF) is required only if the purchase is through a FFL.

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    i planned on finding someone on migunowners.com and setting up a FTF transaction. I thought about having my dad get me one as a B-day present but he doesn't have a cpl and knows less than me about guns so it'd just be easier for me to do it

    i'm glad i don't have to pay the $105 i thought that was for every "license to purchase" applicant:celebrate

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    Seif5034 wrote:
    i planned on finding someone on migunowners.com and setting up a FTF transaction. I thought about having my dad get me one as a B-day present but he doesn't have a cpl and knows less than me about guns so it'd just be easier for me to do it

    i'm glad i don't have to pay the $105 i thought that was for every "license to purchase" applicant:celebrate
    Yeah, if that was the case, the "Brady Bunch" would be very pleased...you know, just another way to hinder law abiding citizens from owning handguns (Feel Good Law).

    I suspect, from reading your post(s), you may have some concern about the "test"?

    Don't be. Igot a100% on the test this was my first and only time with it. At that time I had no knowledge of what was required for the license to purchase. I just went in to my local PD and told the person at the desk my intent and went from there. That whole test (all questions) is just common sense.

    For example, one of the questions: Is is illegal to be under the influence of alcohol while carrying a gun? Yes or No.

    I may not have worded that question exactly, but you get the idea.

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    i figured it'd be simple no-brainers like that but you never know. I just like to be prepared.

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    How about the question that reads something like this: Before attempting to clean your firearm should you first check to see if it is loaded, Yes or No.

    Now the correct answer is: before attempting to clean your firearm you should first check to see if you have the proper cleaning supplies on hand.


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    If I remember correctly, one of them was worded funny, it was like "Never store a loaded gun in a safe place" or something weird like that...

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    The question I always found strange was, "If a hand gun is stolen or lost, you should report it within a year."

    The answer is "false" because the requirement is one week however, technically it is within a year.

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    ghostrider wrote:
    The question I always found strange was, "If a hand gun is stolen or lost, you should report it within a year."

    The answer is "false" because the requirement is one week however, technically it is within a year.

    That's what I told them! That question is patently wrong.

    About the you don't have to have them notarize it thing,

    Bastids. I would have had my friend at the credit union do it. But what the hell, I don't care anymore. I don't have to get any more permits or any other crap, and I can OC in the car, and dang near whereever else I want to.:celebrate:celebrate:celebrate:celebrate

    Only thing that will suck is if I come back to Michigan I'll need a CPL to carry, and I definitely plan to try to organize an OC meet around my visit.
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    ghostrider wrote:
    The question I always found strange was, "If a hand gun is stolen or lost, you should report it within a year."

    The answer is "false" because the requirement is one week however, technically it is within a year.


    28.430 Theft of firearm; report required; failure to report theft as civil violation; penalty.

    Sec. 10. (1) A person who owns a firearm shall, within 5 days after he or she knows his or her firearm is stolen, report the theft to a police agency having jurisdiction over that theft.

    (2) A person who fails to report the theft of a firearm as required under subsection (1) is responsible for a civil violation and

    may be fined not more than $500.00.

    History:
    Add. 1990, Act 320, Eff. Mar. 28, 1991.

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