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Harbor Park

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GLENGLOCKER

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558
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VA Beach, Virginia, USA
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I had thought about that same thing last year when I started OCing. I'm not sure if Harbor Park is city owned or not. I'm willing to bet it's privately owned since that's how most ballfields and stadiums are. (even though most are tax payer funded)There also are not any signs saying not to carry weapons. I don't know if you've ever been to the park, the seats are not that big and I don't think sitting in one of them with a gun on your hip would be very fun. There is a picnic area that can be rented for groups by the scoreboard but there's no shade there. I did over hear a convo between a teenager selling pretzels and a Norfolk PO and the kid was talking about CCing and the teenager said "well I could just open carry" and the officer basically didn't answer the question.
 
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Chkultr

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Virginia Beach, Virginia, USA
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GLENGLOCKER wrote:
I had thought about that same thing last year when I started OCing. I'm not sure if Harbor Park is city owned or not. I'm willing to bet it's privately owned since that's how most ballfields and stadiums are. (even though most are tax payer funded)There also are not any signs saying not to carry weapons. I don't know if you've ever been to the park, the seats are not that big and I don't think sitting in one of them with a gun on your hip would be very fun. There is a picnic area that can be rented for groups by the scoreboard but there's no shade there. I did over hear a convo between a teenager selling pretzels and a Norfolk PO and the kid was talking about CCing and the teenager said "well I could just open carry" and the officer basically didn't answer the question.
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The facility is owned by the City of Norfolk and the Tides have a 20-year lease. Its construction was financed by rent paid by the Tides and other revenue from non-baseball events held in the facility. The total cost of construction for the stadium exceeded $16 million. Harbor Park was selected by Baseball America as the finest minor league facility in the land in 1995.

Got the above info off the norfolk tides web site. I also looked at the policies and they forbid a lot of things but no where does it mention firearms/weapons!

I am pretty skinny and it has been a long time since I have been to the park! Not a huge baseball fan to begin with but looking at my options here!
 
R

Renegade

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Jan 17, 2007
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Yorktown, VA, ,
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Situations like these have begun to worry me.

The City builds a park or stadium with public money...and then enteres into a longterm lease with a "private" company who decides that they do not wish for us to lawfully carry firearms - where does that leave us?

What's to keep the city from building a new City Hall, or downtown library, or public park, and then entering into a longterm lease with a "private" company that will manage the property?

We need something that prevents a private corporation or business interest from invaiding, occupying, and rewriting the rules on our public lands.
 
M

mobeewan

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Hampton, Va, ,
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Renegade wrote:
Snip
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What's to keep the city from building a new City Hall, or downtown library, or public park, and then entering into a longterm lease with a "private" company that will manage the property?
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In this case the public building (city hall, library, public park)is still being used for public purposes and is only being "managed" by a private company for the city then they would be acting as an agentforthe city. Therefore under the preemption law could not ban firearms for the same reason an airport authority cannot ban firearms on the property outside the terminal like the airport authority in NorVa tried to do on the roadways.
 
G

GLENGLOCKER

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Renegade wrote:
Situations like these have begun to worry me.

The City builds a park or stadium with public money...and then enteres into a longterm lease with a "private" company who decides that they do not wish for us to lawfully carry firearms - where does that leave us?

What's to keep the city from building a new City Hall, or downtown library, or public park, and then entering into a longterm lease with a "private" company that will manage the property?

We need something that prevents a private corporation or business interest from invaiding, occupying, and rewriting the rules on our public lands.
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Start here. http://lp.org/
 
K

kerchaulk

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Virginia Beach, Virginia, USA
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Chkultr wrote:
Has anyone carried at Harbor Park? CC or OC! I searched some old threads but did not find where someone actually said they carried in the park!
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It would have to be OC wouldn't it? Harbor Park serves beer on the premises.

§18.2-308 (J.3.): No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.
 
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roscoe13

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Apr 18, 2007
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Catlett, Virginia, USA
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kerchaulk wrote:
Chkultr wrote:
Has anyone carried at Harbor Park? CC or OC! I searched some old threads but did not find where someone actually said they carried in the park!
Click to expand...

It would have to be OC wouldn't it? Harbor Park serves beer on the premises.

§18.2-308 (J.3.): No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.
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G

GLENGLOCKER

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Joined
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Messages
558
Location
VA Beach, Virginia, USA
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kerchaulk wrote:
Chkultr wrote:
Has anyone carried at Harbor Park? CC or OC! I searched some old threads but did not find where someone actually said they carried in the park!
Click to expand...

It would have to be OC wouldn't it? Harbor Park serves beer on the premises.

§18.2-308 (J.3.): No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.
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That's the wierd thing. Harbor is not a club or restaurant. The have a restaurant called Hits at The Park. I would venture a guess say cc is ok in the park as long as you don't enter the restaurant??
 
K

kerchaulk

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Aug 30, 2007
Messages
56
Location
Virginia Beach, Virginia, USA
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roscoe13 wrote:
kerchaulk wrote:
Chkultr wrote:
Has anyone carried at Harbor Park? CC or OC! I searched some old threads but did not find where someone actually said they carried in the park!
Click to expand...

It would have to be OC wouldn't it? Harbor Park serves beer on the premises.

§18.2-308 (J.3.): No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.
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restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100

"Restaurant" means, for a beer, or wine and beer license, any establishment provided with special space and accommodation, where, in consideration of payment, meals or other foods prepared on the premises are regularly sold.

"Restaurant" means, for a mixed beverage license, an established place of business (i) where meals with substantial entrees are regularly sold and (ii) which has adequate facilities and sufficient employees for cooking, preparing, and serving such meals for consumption at tables in dining areas on the premises, and includes establishments specializing in full course meals with a single substantial entree.

So, I can see where the 2nd definition applies to Hits at the Park. But, depending on what "special space and accomodatin" means, couldn't the 1st apply to the ball park itself?

I don't see any definition of what is meant by "special space and accomodatin".
 
vt357

vt357

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Joined
Dec 16, 2006
Messages
490
Location
Richmond, Virginia, USA
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kerchaulk wrote:

restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100

"Restaurant" means, for a beer, or wine and beer license, any establishment provided with special space and accommodation, where, in consideration of payment, meals or other foods prepared on the premises are regularly sold.

"Restaurant" means, for a mixed beverage license, an established place of business (i) where meals with substantial entrees are regularly sold and (ii) which has adequate facilities and sufficient employees for cooking, preparing, and serving such meals for consumption at tables in dining areas on the premises, and includes establishments specializing in full course meals with a single substantial entree.

So, I can see where the 2nd definition applies to Hits at the Park. But, depending on what "special space and accomodatin" means, couldn't the 1st apply to the ball park itself?

I don't see any definition of what is meant by "special space and accomodatin".
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Does anyone know about the eating areas for groups. Like the pregame picnic pavilion at the Diamond?

http://www.rbraves.com/pagebank/index.html?id=2031

It would appear they have a "beer license" and not a "mixed beverage license." So would the pavilion meet the criteria of a "special place and accomodation" to make it a restaurant?
 
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