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NAA Mini Belt Buckle Carry CC or OC?

Is the NAA belt buckle Concealed or Open Carry?

  • Concealed Carry

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Open Carry

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Don't Know

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Don't Want to Be a Test Case

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    0

longwatch

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So I have a new toy, the NAA belt buckle for my NAA Mini Revolver.
http://www.naaminis.com/custcry.html
It's purely for fun but the discussion as I wore it tended to whether it was OC or CC. I believe the buckle could be construed as CC as it tends to obscure the true nature of the weapon. What say you?

Here is the relevant code:
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+18.2-308

A. If any person carries about his person, hidden from common observation, (i) any pistol, revolver, or other weapon designed or intended to propel a missile of any kind by action of an explosion of any combustible material; (ii) any dirk, bowie knife, switchblade knife, ballistic knife, machete, razor, slingshot, spring stick, metal knucks, or blackjack; (iii) any flailing instrument consisting of two or more rigid parts connected in such a manner as to allow them to swing freely, which may be known as a nun chahka, nun chuck, nunchaku, shuriken, or fighting chain; (iv) any disc, of whatever configuration, having at least two points or pointed blades which is designed to be thrown or propelled and which may be known as a throwing star or oriental dart; or (v) any weapon of like kind as those enumerated in this subsection, he shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor. A second violation of this section or a conviction under this section subsequent to any conviction under any substantially similar ordinance of any county, city, or town shall be punishable as a Class 6 felony, and a third or subsequent such violation shall be punishable as a Class 5 felony. For the purpose of this section, a weapon shall be deemed to be hidden from common observation when it is observable but is of such deceptive appearance as to disguise the weapon's true nature.
 

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ed

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longwatch wrote:
a weapon shall be deemed to be hidden from common observation when it is observable but is of such deceptive appearance as to disguise the weapon's true nature.

If you get busted for it.. then you just proved your case! It's OPEN carry! IAMAL but to ME a deceptive appearance is like a CELL PHONE gun.. Looks like a cell phone but is a gun. Yours looks like a gun in a belt buckle and is really a gun in a belt buckle.

gun-phone.jpg


Edited to add pic of a PEN GUN:
braverman_22.jpg
 

nova

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ed wrote:
longwatch wrote:
a weapon shall be deemed to be hidden from common observation when it is observable but is of such deceptive appearance as to disguise the weapon's true nature.

If you get busted for it.. then you just proved your case! It's OPEN carry! IAMAL but to ME a deceptive appearance is like a CELL PHONE gun.. Looks like a cell phone but is a gun. Yours looks like a gun in a belt buckle and is really a gun in a belt buckle.

gun-phone.jpg


Edited to add pic of a PEN GUN:
braverman_22.jpg

I had always wondered what would happen if someone who had a gun under their shirt was busted for carrying concealed, only to bring up the point that if the gun was hidden from common observation, how did the officer spot it in the first place :D

But I don't want to be a test case either! :lol:
 

zoom6zoom

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I can't find the citation at the moment to link to, but I remember reading about someone being charged and I believe convicted. The belt buckle gun was indeed considered CC, being as you said "concealing it's true nature".
 

Neplusultra

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zoom6zoom wrote:
I can't find the citation at the moment to link to, but I remember reading about someone being charged and I believe convicted. The belt buckle gun was indeed considered CC, being as you said "concealing it's true nature".
Yea, it looks like a toy or a piece of jewelry, not a weapon.
 

ed

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Sandy is NAA President.

In a message dated 6/7/2008 5:11:33 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, Sandy@SandyChisholm.com writes:
Ed - Thanks for your note. It is very interesting how different states deal with issues surrounding personal protection and open/concealed carry. I haven't heard anything from my customers regarding what you're describing. I'm sure you can understand that we would NEVER attempt to offer anyone any legal advice regarding the carry of our products; the laws are so varied and we have no legal skills to share. "Please consult your attorney" as there is absolutely nothing we can say on this matter. I appreciate your understanding. - Sandy
----- Original Message ----- From: ed To: wayne@northamericanarms.com ; sandy@northamericanarms.com Sent: Saturday, June 07, 2008 4:54 PM Subject: Concealed in plain view?
Hi Wayne & Sandy- In Virginia we can OC (Open Carry) a firearm and walk down the street. To CC (Concealed Carry) You must have a permit and also MUST OC when in a restaurant that serves alcohol. Have you heard of any customers of yours that have had problems wearing a belt buckle with a mini because the police said the buckle "hid the true nature" of the firearm? Thanks, Ed Here is the relevant VA code:
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+18.2-308

A. If any person carries about his person, hidden from common observation, (i) any pistol, revolver, or other weapon designed or intended to propel a missile of any kind by action of an explosion of any combustible material; (ii) any dirk, bowie knife, switchblade knife, ballistic knife, machete, razor, slingshot, spring stick, metal knucks, or blackjack; (iii) any flailing instrument consisting of two or more rigid parts connected in such a manner as to allow them to swing freely, which may be known as a nun chahka, nun chuck, nunchaku, shuriken, or fighting chain; (iv) any disc, of whatever configuration, having at least two points or pointed blades which is designed to be thrown or propelled and which may be known as a throwing star or oriental dart; or (v) any weapon of like kind as those enumerated in this subsection, he shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor. A second violation of this section or a conviction under this section subsequent to any conviction under any substantially similar ordinance of any county, city, or town shall be punishable as a Class 6 felony, and a third or subsequent such violation shall be punishable as a Class 5 felony. For the purpose of this section, a weapon shall be deemed to be hidden from common observation when it is observable but is of such deceptive appearance as to disguise the weapon's true nature.

 

longwatch

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I never even thought to ask NAA, but its cool the president replied. Still nothing confirmed either way IMHO.
 

Marco

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Well, if you have a CHP it is a non issue except when in a restaurant that servers alcohol.


There are belt holsters for those http://www.naaminis.com/mr_hol.html
mrh_hcd.jpg


I would try and make one before purchasing one, those belt slots look small.

I like the new NAA Pug and will be getting one soon.
 

ed

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just got this e-mail too:

In a message dated 6/9/2008 11:14:58 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, jennifer@naaminis.com writes:

I know from a similar law in Florida, that as long as you do not let your shirt cover the buckle- you are OC. If the shirt covers the buckle you are CC- and would then need the permit.

Jennifer Plante
North American Arms
1-800-821-5783 x 211
 

Decoligny

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ed wrote:
just got this e-mail too:

In a message dated 6/9/2008 11:14:58 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, jennifer@naaminis.com writes:

I know from a similar law in Florida, that as long as you do not let your shirt cover the buckle- you are OC. If the shirt covers the buckle you are CC- and would then need the permit.

Jennifer Plante
North American Arms
1-800-821-5783 x 211
Don't see as that answers anything as IIRC Open Carry is illegal in Florida. So basically if you have this in Florida you have to have a permit to conceal and must not let the gun show at all.
 

OBXMIKE

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Something is jingling bells in my head about it being in the AOW category.....kinda like the old "shooting wallets" that were made for the high standard .22 deringers. Neither one by itself flagged a violation, but put 'em together and you have an AOW. Can anybody validate/invalidate this?

As to your poll, one things for sure.... if my shirt wasn't covering it up my belly certainly would......I'd need a permit in EITHER case here! :lol:
 

longwatch

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A disguised weapon that can be fired in that state would be an AOW. The NAA walet holsters are out there but it doesn't seem worth it to make the effort to register one.
 
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