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Thread: OC'er stopped in Riverdale Wal-mart

  1. #1
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    I was at Wal-mart just a little while ago, and observed an OC'er stopped by two Wal-mart security guys. The OC'er was wearing a Washington County Sheriff's Dept. polo shirt, and I heard him telling them that he was a police officer and was required to carry. I don't think he showed them any ID, but they believed him and let him go on his way. I also heard them telling him that they'd been "having problems" with people carrying firearms in the store -- I wonder if they were referring to me?

    I was concealing, not for any particular reason, just that I hadn't bothered to tuck my t-shirt in so it mostly covered my XD in its Serpa holster. Given that I was short on time and had a car full of kids waiting in the parking lot, I was glad that I didn't happen to be OC'ing at the moment.

    This is the same Wal-mart that has hassled me a couple of times before. I've been OC'ing there uneventfully a few times since the last time I was hassled, but what I saw made me wonder if the manager hasn't decided to "get tough" on OC (making an exception for LE, obviously).

    I'll make sure that I OC next time I go, but with a recorder, a couple copies of ScottyT's pamphlet (speaking of that, Scott, do you think you could make a version without the "But you may get hassled" language?), and I'd also like to be prepared with the name and phone number of the Wal-mart regional manager. Does anyone have that handy? I know it was mentioned in a thread here somewhere.

  2. #2
    State Researcher Kevin Jensen's Avatar
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    I don't know who your district manager is, but if you call the Orem Wal-Mart, Jim Curtis is the DM for Utah County. He may be able to tell you who your DM is.
    "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life." Robert A. Heinlein

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    I just relized the other day that the Orem Wal-Mart was possibility within a 1000 feet of UVU.
    Charles A. Hall, self-proclaimed Lone Eagle || Carry: Kahr CW40
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  4. #4
    State Researcher Kevin Jensen's Avatar
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    Outsider wrote:
    I just relized the other day that the Orem Wal-Mart was possibility within a 1000 feet of UVU.
    Soon, you will not need to worry. :celebrate
    "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life." Robert A. Heinlein

  5. #5
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    SGT Jensen wrote:
    Outsider wrote:
    I just relized the other day that the Orem Wal-Mart was possibility within a 1000 feet of UVU.
    Soon, you will not need to worry. :celebrate
    Yeah, if it ever gets here!
    Charles A. Hall, self-proclaimed Lone Eagle || Carry: Kahr CW40
    Lone Eagle Observer (http://www.charlesahall.us)
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  6. #6
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    Outsider wrote:
    SGT Jensen wrote:
    Outsider wrote:
    I just relized the other day that the Orem Wal-Mart was possibility within a 1000 feet of UVU.
    Soon, you will not need to worry. :celebrate
    Yeah, if it ever gets here!

    the longest 60 days


  7. #7
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    Outsider wrote:
    I just relized the other day that the Orem Wal-Mart was possibility within a 1000 feet of UVU.
    The front door of the Orem Wal-Mart is 1,191 feet from the center of the round-about at the entrance to UVU. I believe the law gives you 1000 feet away from school buildings? You should be good, but just barely -- and come in the back way...

  8. #8
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    ScottyT wrote:
    Outsider wrote:
    I just relized the other day that the Orem Wal-Mart was possibility within a 1000 feet of UVU.
    The front door of the Orem Wal-Mart is 1,191 feet from the center of the round-about at the entrance to UVU. I believe the law gives you 1000 feet away from school buildings? You should be good, but just barely -- and come in the back way...
    Both the federal and state laws say 1000 feet from the grounds!

    Here is the federal code:
    (25) The term “school zone” means— (A) in, or on the grounds of, a public, parochial or private school; or (B) within a distance of 1,000 feet from the grounds of a public, parochial or private school.
    Utah code:
    76-10-505.5. Possession of a dangerous weapon, firearm, or sawed-off shotgun on or about school premises -- Penalties.
    (1) A person may not possess any dangerous weapon, firearm, or sawed-off shotgun, as those terms are defined in Section 76-10-501, at a place that the person knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is on or about school premises as defined in Subsection 76-3-203.2(1).

    76-3-203.2. Definitions -- Use of dangerous weapon in offenses committed on or about school premises -- Enhanced penalties.
    (1) (a) As used in this section and Section 76-10-505.5, "on or about school premises" means any of the following:
    (i) in a public or private elementary, secondary, or on the grounds of any of those schools;
    (ii) in a public or private vocational school or postsecondary institution or on the grounds of any of those schools or institutions;
    (iii) in those portions of any building, park, stadium, or other structure or grounds which are, at the time of the act, being used for an activity sponsored by or through a school or institution under Subsections (1)(a)(i) and (ii); (iv) in or on the grounds of a preschool or child-care facility;
    and (v) within 1,000 feet of any structure, facility, or grounds included in Subsections (1)(a)(i), (ii), (iii), and (iv).


  9. #9
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    jaredbelch wrote:
    Both the federal and state laws say 1000 feet from the grounds!
    Keep in mind that the definition of "school" in the federal law doesn't include post-secondary schools, so that one doesn't apply.

    The state law does include universities, and I don't see any caveats in the state law that would allow a non CFP-holder to carry legally in a retail establishment that is within the school zone. I take 76-10-505.5(3)(c) to mean carry is allowed if it's to be used for a purpose approved by the school administrator, not just any lawful purpose. A different interpretation might be possible.

  10. #10
    Regular Member thx997303's Avatar
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    I would also like that information, could someone PM it to me?

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    Just got back from Wal-mart, and it appears they've gotten educated on the corporate policy. I've been there a few times without incident, but this morning my favorite anti-gun greeter was there. I was returning some things, so I had to go get a sticker from her, and she took the opportunity to tell me that I really shouldn't bring a gun into the store, but she didn't call a manager over and it was pretty clear she was just expressing her own opinion.

    I told her of course I should bring a gun, it makes everyone safer. She gave me a baffled look, but only said that she would let management know that I was there.

    While standing at the returns counter, another employee asked me if I was a police officer and when I responded negatively, if I had a permit. I told him that the chamber was unloaded, so under Utah law I didn't need a permit. He said "Oh, that's okay then" and commented that he has a CFP and wishes that he were allowed to carry while at work. I said I also have a CFP, but sometimes carry unloaded to make the point that it's legal.

    The woman standing behind me also asked me "You go shopping with a gun?". I gave her a grin and said "Sure, why not?". She smiled back and gave a little shrug as if to say "You're weird, but whatever."

    Anyway, the main point is that between the last time when a manager had to come discuss it with me and this time, the employees seem to have gotten educated on the fact that customers are allowed to carry in accordance with state law.

  12. #12
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    This Riverdale? I wish WVC would get the same lecture. Maybe we should all write Wal-Mart, Inc. in Arkansas and get it through to them.
    Charles A. Hall, self-proclaimed Lone Eagle || Carry: Kahr CW40
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    Outsider wrote:
    This Riverdale? I wish WVC would get the same lecture. Maybe we should all write Wal-Mart, Inc. in Arkansas and get it through to them.
    Yeah, that was Riverdale. I think Wal-mart corporate is very clear on their policy, what we have to do is to get the local stores to bother to ask what it is.

  14. #14
    Regular Member thx997303's Avatar
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    Wal-mart sucks.

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