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Thread: VA-ALERT: Wah-hoo! SC changes reciprocity laws!!!

  1. #1
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    Hot off the press - http://www.vcdl.org

    ----------------------------------------
    VCDL's Gun Dealer Legal Defense Fund -- help fight Mayor Bloomberg's
    scheme to cripple Virginia firearms dealers. See:
    http://www.vcdl.org/index.html#DefenseFund
    ----------------------------------------
    VCDL's meeting schedule: http://www.vcdl.org/meetings.html
    ----------------------------------------



    The Governor of South Carolina has just signed a bill that will open up reciprocity to any state that honors South Carolina!

    The law becomes effective IMMEDIATELY and is now in force.

    Virginia ALREADY honors South Carolina, so formal reciprocity should be a slam-dunk!!!

    HOWEVER, it is not in affect yet. So **DO NOT carry concealed** in South Carolina until I put the word out (Virginia and South Carolina have to sign a reciprocity agreement first).

    I have left a voice message with Tom Lambert who does reciprocity work for the Virginia State Police. Hopefully the State Police will jump on this quickly.

    As soon as we can begin carrying, there will be an alert going out to let you know.

    Many thanks to Jim Mullins, my counterpart in the West Virginia Citizens Defense League (wvcdl.org), for staying on top of this and letting me know the new law was coming.

    And of course, a big thanks to the gun organizations in South Carolina for continuing to fight for this law tirelessly over the years!

    --

    VCDL is getting some new hardware and software. The VCDL site will be down for a while tonight and the VA-ALERT list server will down for a while, too.



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    ************************************************** *************************
    VA-ALERT is a project of the Virginia Citizens Defense League, Inc.
    (VCDL). VCDL is an all-volunteer, non-partisan grassroots organization
    dedicated to defending the human rights of all Virginians. The Right to
    Keep and Bear Arms is a fundamental human right.

    VCDL web page: http://www.vcdl.org
    ************************************************** *************************

    Does anybody know if this will open up a channel to OC in SC now? I noticed it is a "non-permissive open carry" state.



    Edited to add OC content.

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    Well, it depends on who you believe. There are even conflicting accounts of the effect of H. 3212. Here is what SLED says http://www.sled.sc.gov/Reciprocity1.aspx?MenuID=CWP

    SC gun laws are here http://www.scstatehouse.net and include


    SECTION 16-23-20. Unlawful carrying of handgun; exceptions.

    It is unlawful for anyone to carry about the person any handgun, whether concealed or not, except as follows, unless otherwise specifically prohibited by law:[ ...]
    followed by sixteen exceptions. But you can wait for the NRA version from one of its member dicks that hang around here.


    Either we are equal or we are not. Good people ought to be armed where they will, with wits and guns and the truth. NRA TSA *******







  3. #3
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    Update from VA-Alert:



    I have been overwhelmed with emails requesting to know the states that currently honor Virginia Concealed Handgun permits.

    Here is the list of states that honor our permits (but not necessarily the other way around):

    Alaska
    Arizona
    Arkansas
    Florida
    Kentucky
    Louisiana
    Michigan
    Missouri
    Montana
    New Mexico
    North Carolina
    Ohio
    Oklahoma
    Pennsylvania
    Tennessee
    Texas
    Utah
    Vermont (no permit required)
    West Virginia

    --

    IMPORTANT NOTES ON THE NEW SOUTH CAROLINA RECIPROCITY LAW

    The South Carolina law requires training to be mandatory for the reciprocal state (which it is in Virginia, but will cut out a lot of other states that don't require training).

    However, it is not clear about the type, or the amount, of training required and Tom Glaab tells me that GrassRoots South Carolina has some issues with the final law as passed because of that.

    Tom fears that SLED (which is the government agency that does reciprocity for South Carolina) might interpret the law so narrowly as to exclude most states, perhaps including Virginia. SLED has been a roadblock in states getting reciprocity with South Carolina for years. :-(

    We will just have to watch and see what happens over the next few weeks.

    Here is a link to the bill and its status:

    http://tinyurl.com/5vf8gy

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    If you get your FL permit it opens up the entire south to carry!

    Nice.

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    xd.40 wrote:
    Update from VA-Alert:



    I have been overwhelmed with emails requesting to know the states that currently honor Virginia Concealed Handgun permits.

    Here is the list of states that honor our permits (but not necessarily the other way around):

    Alaska
    Arizona
    Arkansas
    Florida
    Kentucky
    Louisiana
    Michigan
    Missouri
    Montana
    New Mexico
    North Carolina
    Ohio
    Oklahoma
    Pennsylvania
    Tennessee
    Texas
    Utah
    Vermont (no permit required)
    West Virginia

    --

    IMPORTANT NOTES ON THE NEW SOUTH CAROLINA RECIPROCITY LAW

    The South Carolina law requires training to be mandatory for the reciprocal state (which it is in Virginia, but will cut out a lot of other states that don't require training).

    However, it is not clear about the type, or the amount, of training required and Tom Glaab tells me that GrassRoots South Carolina has some issues with the final law as passed because of that.

    Tom fears that SLED (which is the government agency that does reciprocity for South Carolina) might interpret the law so narrowly as to exclude most states, perhaps including Virginia. SLED has been a roadblock in states getting reciprocity with South Carolina for years. :-(

    We will just have to watch and see what happens over the next few weeks.

    Here is a link to the bill and its status:

    http://tinyurl.com/5vf8gy
    I believe that Idaho, Indiana, and South Dakota honors a VA permit as well unless something has changed in the past year.

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    hsmith wrote:
    If you get your FL permit it opens up the entire south to carry!

    Nice.
    I was under the impression SC didn't recognize non resident permits except for SC non resident permits.

    SC non resident permits require you to own property there though, at least IIRC.

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    Skeptic wrote:
    hsmith wrote:
    If you get your FL permit it opens up the entire south to carry!

    Nice.
    I was under the impression SC didn't recognize non resident permits except for SC non resident permits.

    SC non resident permits require you to own property there though, at least IIRC.
    If you have a VA permit and are a VA resident it should be valid in SC was the way I took this comment. If you get a FL permit then it will cover about everywhere but you are correct that SC is still for resident permits only.

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    Skeptic wrote:
    hsmith wrote:
    If you get your FL permit it opens up the entire south to carry!

    Nice.
    I was under the impression SC didn't recognize non resident permits except for SC non resident permits.

    SC non resident permits require you to own property there though, at least IIRC.
    Well if we get reciproicty, GA is the only other southern state that doesn't have it with VA - so I would assume things would be good then.

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    hsmith wrote:
    Skeptic wrote:
    hsmith wrote:
    If you get your FL permit it opens up the entire south to carry!

    Nice.
    I was under the impression SC didn't recognize non resident permits except for SC non resident permits.

    SC non resident permits require you to own property there though, at least IIRC.
    Well if we get reciproicty, GA is the only other southern state that doesn't have it with VA - so I would assume things would be good then.
    AL and MS don't have reciprocity/recognition with VA either. FL, UT, or NH non-res CHPs fix that.


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    PT111 wrote:
    Skeptic wrote:
    hsmith wrote:
    If you get your FL permit it opens up the entire south to carry!

    Nice.
    I was under the impression SC didn't recognize non resident permits except for SC non resident permits.

    SC non resident permits require you to own property there though, at least IIRC.
    If you have a VA permit and are a VA resident it should be valid in SC was the way I took this comment. If you get a FL permit then it will cover about everywhere but you are correct that SC is still for resident permits only.
    Ahh that makes sense.

    I am sort of in the camp that doesn't think the new bill will actually give reciprocity with VA, because it still gives SLED leeway, and in fact might even give them more discretion than it had before.

    Time will tell and I hope SLED does the right thing


    I canceled my vacation in SC for this year and went to NC instead. Maybe next year SC will be on the table (depending on gas prices lol )

  11. #11
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    Subscribing and hoping this will be resolved by the end of the month since I will be vacationing in SC.

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    i'm a little skeptical of the way the new law was worded also. the original made i legal to carry if you had a resident permit from any state without any list. the new law has that "reciprical" statement in it so even if your state meets the requirements, it wont be a reciprical state unless put on the list by the sled. sounds like semantics with the sled having the same power as before by default. we just have to wait and see what happens. going to sc for a week in late july, hope its resolved by then.

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    AN ACT TO AMEND SECTION 23-31-215, AS AMENDED, CODE OF LAWS OF SOUTH CAROLINA, 1976, RELATING TO THE ISSUANCE OF CONCEALABLE WEAPONS PERMITS, SO AS TO PROVIDE THAT VALID OUT-OF-STATE PERMITS TO CARRY CONCEALABLE WEAPONS BY A RESIDENT OF A RECIPROCAL STATE MUST BE HONORED IF THE RECIPROCAL STATE REQUIRES A CRIMINAL BACKGROUND CHECK AND A FIREARM TRAINING AND SAFETY COURSE AND TO DELETE THE REQUIREMENT THAT SLED DETERMINE WHICH STATES MEET THIS STANDARD.
    Be it enacted by the General Assembly of the State of South Carolina:
    Concealable weapons permits, reciprocal agreements
    SECTION 1. Section 23-31-215(N) of the 1976 Code, as last amended by Act 347 of 2006, is further amended to read:
    "(N) Valid out-of-state permits to carry concealable weapons held by a resident of a reciprocal state must be honored by this State, provided, that the reciprocal state requires an applicant to successfully pass a criminal background check and a course in firearm training and safety. A resident of a reciprocal state carrying a concealable weapon in South Carolina is subject to and must abide by the laws of South Carolina regarding concealable weapons. SLED shall maintain and publish a list of those states as the states with which South Carolina has reciprocity."


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    i read and understand the new law. however, there is a difinitive list of "reciprical" states made up by the sled. that is the same old problem.

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    Doesn't look like the concealed carry reciprocity will be worked out by this Friday, huh?

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    Any updates on South Carolina?

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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    AN ACT TO AMEND SECTION 23-31-215, AS AMENDED, CODE OF LAWS OF SOUTH CAROLINA, 1976, RELATING TO THE ISSUANCE OF CONCEALABLE WEAPONS PERMITS, SO AS TO PROVIDE THAT VALID OUT-OF-STATE PERMITS TO CARRY CONCEALABLE WEAPONS BY A RESIDENT OF A RECIPROCAL STATE MUST BE HONORED IF THE RECIPROCAL STATE REQUIRES A CRIMINAL BACKGROUND CHECK AND A FIREARM TRAINING AND SAFETY COURSE AND TO DELETE THE REQUIREMENT THAT SLED DETERMINE WHICH STATES MEET THIS STANDARD.
    Be it enacted by the General Assembly of the State of South Carolina:
    Concealable weapons permits, reciprocal agreements
    SECTION 1. Section 23-31-215(N) of the 1976 Code, as last amended by Act 347 of 2006, is further amended to read:
    "(N) Valid out-of-state permits to carry concealable weapons held by a resident of a reciprocal state must be honored by this State, provided, that the reciprocal state requires an applicant to successfully pass a criminal background check and a course in firearm training and safety. A resident of a reciprocal state carrying a concealable weapon in South Carolina is subject to and must abide by the laws of South Carolina regarding concealable weapons. SLED shall maintain and publish a list of those states as the states with which South Carolina has reciprocity."
    IANAL but I do not read this as SLED determining which states meet the requirements of the newly worded law. Only that SLED maintains and publishes the list. Not sure who in SC is responsible for determining reciprocity between SC and other states.

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    sccrref wrote:
    Doug Huffman wrote:
    AN ACT TO AMEND SECTION 23-31-215, AS AMENDED, CODE OF LAWS OF SOUTH CAROLINA, 1976, RELATING TO THE ISSUANCE OF CONCEALABLE WEAPONS PERMITS, SO AS TO PROVIDE THAT VALID OUT-OF-STATE PERMITS TO CARRY CONCEALABLE WEAPONS BY A RESIDENT OF A RECIPROCAL STATE MUST BE HONORED IF THE RECIPROCAL STATE REQUIRES A CRIMINAL BACKGROUND CHECK AND A FIREARM TRAINING AND SAFETY COURSE AND TO DELETE THE REQUIREMENT THAT SLED DETERMINE WHICH STATES MEET THIS STANDARD.
    Be it enacted by the General Assembly of the State of South Carolina:
    Concealable weapons permits, reciprocal agreements
    SECTION 1. Section 23-31-215(N) of the 1976 Code, as last amended by Act 347 of 2006, is further amended to read:
    "(N) Valid out-of-state permits to carry concealable weapons held by a resident of a reciprocal state must be honored by this State, provided, that the reciprocal state requires an applicant to successfully pass a criminal background check and a course in firearm training and safety. A resident of a reciprocal state carrying a concealable weapon in South Carolina is subject to and must abide by the laws of South Carolina regarding concealable weapons. SLED shall maintain and publish a list of those states as the states with which South Carolina has reciprocity."
    IANAL but I do not read this as SLED determining which states meet the requirements of the newly worded law. Only that SLED maintains and publishes the list. Not sure who in SC is responsible for determining reciprocity between SC and other states.
    And if the law doesn't say who that person is, it falls to SLED to do that too since they have the list.

    Nearly 2 weeks after the biill became effective, and I haven't seen an update to that list, or even an acknowledgement by SLED that the list will ever be updated.

  19. #19
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    I decided not to carry or bring any of my handguns while I'm in SC.

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    Harvdog wrote:
    I decided not to carry or bring any of my handguns while I'm in SC.
    You may carry in your car's glove box or center console, in your hotel room, and when transporting your guns between your car & hotel room See S.C. Code § 16-23-20(8), (9), and (15) and § 23-31-230.
    James M. "Jim" Mullins, Jr., Esq.
    Admitted to practice in West Virginia and Florida.

    Founder, Past President, Treasurer, and General Counsel, West Virginia Citizens Defense League, Inc.
    Life Member, NRA

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    Harvdog wrote:
    I decided not to carry or bring any of my handguns while I'm in SC.
    I choose not to vacation ordo any business as I travel through the state. I make sure I have filled the gas tank and emptied my tanks before I get to SC. I do just put the gun in the center console to be legal as I pass through the state on my way to and from FL. Looking forward to the day when I do not have to do that.

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    Yeah, I go to SC every other weekend to see my daughter who lives in Columbia. It sucks to have to leave it in the glove box all the time; but at least for that.

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