OpenCarry.org mentioned in Basic Safety Class

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SlacK wrote:

the one good part about only the employees OCing, is that when i go there
i always know who the employees are, since they don't seem to wear
any other type of ID, or uniform.

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A nametag with the company name or logo and their name on it would seem appropriate rather than a gun.

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i was thinking that too, but then i started thinking how much i would love
to be able to just wear a side-arm, instead of a nametag at work. That'd be cool

Wonder if anyone at the nursing home where i work, would care?

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I don't see OC ever being accepted at either Sharp Shooters or the Spokane Rifle Club.

I think it has more to do with liability, real or perceived, than anything else. All it would take is one negligent dischargewhile someone is unholstering their gun, a person to be hit by the bullet, and a bottom feeding lawyer to sue for enough money to force them out of business forever. I don't care how much insurance the facility carries, you can always be sued for more than the insurance will cover and end up taking the hit yourself.

Although, if a person is just coming in to shop, and not use the range, there is no reason under the sun that OC should be disallowed.

There are those who support the 2A, and then there are those who practice the 2A, I think Robin does an outstanding job supporting the 2A, she just wants to restrict its practice in her store.

Oh well, there are plenty of other guns shops in town that are more than happy to allow me to carry while I shop, and they will be getting my money.

bob

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BobR wrote:

Oh well, there are plenty of other guns shops in town that are more than happy to allow me to carry while I shop, and they will be getting my money.

bob

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Stores... Yes

Ranges... No...

Unfortunately Sharpshooting and the Spokane Rifle Club are basicly the only range choices in Spokane. Another member did bring up a public outdoor range that is basically just open property that only costs 3 bucks... But it is more than a 30 min drive and unless I am going to go with a group of people in one vehicle, it ends up costing more just for gas in my car.

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BobR wrote:

I don't see OC ever being accepted at either Sharp Shooters or the Spokane Rifle Club.

I think it has more to do with liability, real or perceived, than anything else. All it would take is one negligent dischargewhile someone is unholstering their gun, a person to be hit by the bullet, and a bottom feeding lawyer to sue for enough money to force them out of business forever. I don't care how much insurance the facility carries, you can always be sued for more than the insurance will cover and end up taking the hit yourself.

Although, if a person is just coming in to shop, and not use the range, there is no reason under the sun that OC should be disallowed.

There are those who support the 2A, and then there are those who practice the 2A, I think Robin does an outstanding job supporting the 2A, she just wants to restrict its practice in her store.

Oh well, there are plenty of other guns shops in town that are more than happy to allow me to carry while I shop, and they will be getting my money.

bob

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If it was aliability issue then CC would not be allowed either, but it is OK. It's because they want the money from the gun people, but they don't really like guns or understand the gun owner's mind.

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Well my gun is afraid of the dark so I can't conceal and it's afraid to be alone, so I OC everywhere. We go for walks together and have become very close. If my little buddyisn't welcome "openly", then I'm not welcome.

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BobCav wrote:

Well my gun is afraid of the dark so I can't conceal and it's afraid to be alone, so I OC everywhere. We go for walks together and have become very close. If my little buddyisn't welcome "openly", then I'm not welcome.

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I don't know if I should laugh out loud at the humor of that statement, or nervously chuckle at the creepiness hidden in there

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If it was aliability issue then CC would not be allowed either, but it is OK.

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You are right, I hadn't thought of that. Also the statement of guns being openly carried may scare people borders on the ridiculous. It is a gun store, if people were that hoplophobic, then they wouldn't be there in the first place.

I still don't expect a change in the policy at either place. The Spokane Rifle club is a social organization, and has a board of directors and a voting membership. I don't see action being taken on OC there for a long time if forever.

As far as Sharp Shooting Indoor Range and Gun Shop, maybe they should just post a sign on the doorinforming people that there is limited acknowledgement of their 2A rights under the US and State of WA Constitutions,and that if they wish to exercise their right to carry openly they are not welcome until they give up that right and disarm themselves or cover their gun.


This whole deal of piecemeal acknowledgement of our rightshas probably bothered me more than I should let it, but it just spins me up. A gun shop not allowing you to wear your gun openly, who would've figured that?



United States Constitution, Second Amendment

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

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Washington State Constitution, Article 1, Section 24 Right to Bear Arms

The right of the individual citizen to bear arms in defense of himself, or the state, shall not be impaired, but nothing in this section shall be construed as authorizing individuals or corporations to organize, maintain or employ an armed body of men.

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I doubt my meager spendings will be missed, but if there are 100 people like me who refuse to spend money there, perhaps we can force businesses to see the folly of restrictive practices.

At least that is the hope.



bob

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I don't know, i think if "gun" people start doing things like boycotting business's
that somewhat, but not completely agree with them. It will make people who
support 2A seem a lot more fragmented to the outsiders, and overall
probably weaken the progun position, in compairison to the anti-gun position
in the eyes of the people on the outside of either.

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It is boiling down basically to the seperation of groups of people that fall into a larger society...

Obviously the society being discussed is anyone pro 2cd am. But within that society you have people who are comfortable with their limits, forming smaller groups.

Sharpshootings policies just are based off of one persons beliefs for themselves and their store. Yes it would be great if we could convince them to change their beliefs (policies) but in the end people will always continue to do what they believe to be best for them and theirs.

Now it doesn't mean we have to go out and boycott this person who is already pro 2cd am just because they don't take it to the extent that we do... But it also doesn't mean I have to support their policies or spend my time in their facility...

I realise I am now blabbering without forming any sense outside of my own mind... In short... Do we boycott a non-oc gun facility? No... But do we have to support that business? Again no...

The owner has all the correct information now, she has taken it into consideration, she has educated her employees on what is legal, and she decided not to institute an OC allowed policy...

Leave it at that.

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SlacK wrote:

I don't know, i think if "gun" people start doing things like boycotting business's
that somewhat, but not completely agree with them. It will make people who
support 2A seem a lot more fragmented to the outsiders, and overall
probably weaken the progun position, in compairison to the anti-gun position
in the eyes of the people on the outside of either.

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IMHO, It is more about greed than anything else. They don't agree with us. They just want our money and will give just enough to get it.

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Well, I keep the "BIG List" (e.g., the DNP List) for those businesses that are "anti-gun" or "anti-weapon", not anti-OC. I see those businesses that allow CC and disallow OC as just another business in the multitude of "grey" businesses, neither for, nor against, full-2A rights. So, those businesses that are fully supportive get to be listed on the Pro-Gun List to show our appreciation for their willingness as private property owners to stand up for our rights as human beings.

The DNP List, Watch List, Pro-Gun Biz List, and the rules for putting a business on one of them can be found here: http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum55/3630.html

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Do we boycott a non-oc gun facility? No... But do we have to support that business? Again no...

The owner has all the correct information now, she has taken it into consideration, she has educated her employees on what is legal, and she decided not to institute an OC allowed policy...

Leave it at that.

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That is where I am going with this. I will still give her kudos for her pro 2nd stance, but I won't go so far as to support her business, unless it is directly related to the 2A.

For example, if she were to have a shoot where the entry fees went towards the NRA ILA I would support it and go. If the money goes into her pocket (business) I won't bother going there.

bob

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That's where I'm at. I like Robin, like her stance on the RKBA and appreciate all she has done for the cause.But I will not go disarmed or be discriminated against for my choice of carry.

She's in a difficult place right now and I can repsect that. She WANTS to educate the masses and "change the world" with regard to gun rights and safety and that's commendable! But for me and a growing number of us OC is the better choice for that and thatjust goes against everything she's believed all this time.

My question is this: What will she do when more and more and more people choose to OC as we've seen in the last 2 years? We're not going away and we're growing. I see a future where OC is the rule and CC is the exception. If she chooses to cater only to that "niche" instead of embracing the whole, that's fine.Bottom line is that it's her store, she sets the tone and theme as she sees fit. She can hold fast to her policy whileOC becomes more and more popular, or adapt to the changing environment.

I hope she adapts.

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Bear 45/70 wrote:

That's just pure BS, justifying the position she has taken. First off her people are wearing guns openly. If that doesn't scare the new shooter off then someone else wandering around open carrying isn't gonna scare them any worse. If she is having a problem with sloppy gun handlers, she needs to address those people on a one to one bases and not punish everyone else for what might happen or could happen. Her rules are just plain discriminatory from the word go. She assumes everyone one will do it wrong. Not an outfit I want to deal with or spend my money atwith their attitude. Sheis two faced at best, just like most gun shows. My local gun stores have no issue with CC or OC.

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+1

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I see a future where OC is the rule and CC is the exception

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Well, I've seen the future, and it's spelled VT/AK. These states are our model: anyone who can legally own a firearm can take it anywhere it's legal to do so, no permission needed. (Having an optional permit like AK, so we can interact with other states, is perfectly fine.) And then it's just CC or OC however it best suits you according to the circumstances.

No, I have no idea when (or even if) we'll get there, but that seems like reasonable long-term goal.