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Thread: New to this, a bit scared, I have many questions

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    Alright, I am new here very interested. This is our right, after all. I have many questions regarding open carry both in a vehicle, on a motorcycle, and just plain around town. I've read tons of posts already.

    I have my Concealed Carry here in Ohio. Dont really do it much, if any, but I like having it in case I walk the dog at night or go to a bigger town.

    Anyway, on a motorcycle what is the procedure. And, just for clarification, open carry is holstered pistol that is loaded and chambered? If I'm on my motorcycle, what do I need to know? Same goes for in a car.

    Walking around or into businesses....I really cant belive people are doing this but it just shows how our society has forgotten about this right. Are you all saying that in any business that does not have the "sign" posted, you can just walk right in with a loaded, holstered pistol?

    What about schools? Not asking about carrying in a school or on school property, but how far must I keep away from a schoolor school property to be legal?

    Is there any document or something that I couldcarry with me that might help explain what law enforcement might not understand about this being legal?

    I see many have the ability to record, which is a great idea. Can someone post a reply with where we can go to get an inexpensive yet working audio recorder?

    Yesterday I read a bunch of posts. Called my sherrif's dept to ask about carrying on a motorcycle to the range. They told me I could NOT carry a firearm openly and especially not loaded. I then called the State Patrol and a gentleman told me that I cannot carry openly loade, and ammunition must be kept seperate, and the firearm cannot be within reach. I said I would be riding a bike and that is when he blew up saying that I better not use his name if I'm pulled over for openly carrying.

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    Kungfu wrote:
    Called my sherrif's dept to ask about carrying on a motorcycle to the range. They told me I could NOT carry a firearm openly and especially not loaded. I then called the State Patrol and a gentleman told me that I cannot carry openly loade, and ammunition must be kept seperate, and the firearm cannot be within reach. I said I would be riding a bike and that is when he blew up saying that I better not use his name if I'm pulled over for openly carrying.
    Never ask police for legal advice, especially on gun laws.

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    You stated you have an OH permit to carry. That gives you many options that non-permitees have as far as vehicle carry. You would be legal to carry it on your person in a holster while driving any vehicle in Ohio, motorcycle or auto. Loaded and one in the chamber is no problem. You also have more options as far as vehicle carry, but I wont try to explain them all here.

    Yes, you have the legal right to walk into almost any store not posted no firearms allowed with it loaded and openly carrying or concealed. You do need to leave if they ask you to, but I havent had any problems at all doing this in S.E. Ohio.

    I suggest you get one of the booklets (you were supposed to be given one by your conceal carry course instructor) published by the Attorney Generals office of Ohio that explains the laws concerning carrying firearms or look it up online at http://www.ag.state.oh.us/le/prevent...arry/index.asp and read it to answer more of your questions.

    Walmart sells a few digital voice recorders for under $45.00

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    Thank you both for the advice so far. I'll head up to the sherrif's dept and grab a book....mine is about 4 years old and look at it and see if it answerssome of myquestions.

    ...ok, so on page 9 the list of places where you cannot carry a concealed handgun is basically where you also cannot carry openly,correct?

    One other question I do have is what literature or paperwork (maybe printoffsfrom Revised Code) should I carry with me in case I'm confronted by LEO?

    Is there a real danger of being arrested for open carrying, if I am just doing it by the book, ina non-threatening way? While it wouldjust a really nice way to exercise my rights, I dont want to put my family through the stress of being locked up, even if fora few hoursor worse, aday. What I've read on here is that just open carrying is not"inducing panic" and that it is allowed anywhere that it is not posted or agovernment building. I'm guessing it is ok in the park?

    Is there a list of open carry attorneys and/orwho is theregional law enforcement person who would be responsiblefor educating my sherrifs dept or city police dept?

    What would I expect if I was stopped on foot or pulled over, and what is the generally acceptable way of resolving the situation?

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    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/attachment.php?id=1456

    Thats a link to a Memo that the Akron Police Dept. put out about Open Carry being legal, plus ORC 9.68 all in a convenient wallet sized print off.

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    Thank you thank you thank you. That is great!

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    Don't bother printing our the relevant sections of the Ohio Revised Code. They either won't care to look, if you're lucky, or will respond with hostility if they think you're some smart-ass/know-it-all telling them their jobs (I made the mistake of telling a detective that I wasn't telling him his job, just the law, which apparently had little enough to do with his job. Wrong answer.)

    Ohio doesn't certify specialties of legal practice, and most lawyers will take what work they can get (out of necessity - there are so many of them), so just try to find one who is competent with criminal defense work generally. One who is him/herself a gun enthusiast might bea plus.

    Welcome to the forum.

    -ljp


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    I guess the good thing is that my county sherrifhas done all myNFA signoffs, so I've spoken with him and know his secretary pretty well though that process over the past 10 years.A few of the deputies are old high school buddies. One of the city police is a fellow shooter and a member of the same gun club.

    I wouldnt come across as a know-it-all but I think a paper such as the akron thingcouldnt hurt, I also saved a little thing from the Columbus Dispatch that would be nice wallet size reference, if they would care. It is nice to knowthey would probably need to check revised code and more than likelycall a supervisor before doing anything crazy. A small town like this, who knows.

    The lawyer thing is a great idea though. I agree, I think it would be wisefor me to find onethat is pro-gunsoon if this issomething I'm looking toexercise. Best to have all the ducks lined up in a row as soon as possible just in case anythinghappens. Again, I dont want to put any stress on my family...that would reallybother me. My wifeand I spoke about it today and I'm going to take it really slow, like justOC to the range on mybike or in my car and maybe out of town if I'm going to a different town. The perception and attentioncould be negative, which is really the result of this guns are bad mentality everyone has been brought up on andfed over the years, which isa real shame.

    Legba, you're pretty close to my town. If you know of any pro-gun attorneys, please let me know. I'll do a local search next week and see what pops up. Funny thing about the whole firearms thing.....when concealed carry first came out and I got my license, I wrote to our prosecuting attorney asking about if being on a motorcycle was considered the same as being in a carto which he finally replied(after numerous calls) that it wasnt his responsibility to interpret the law! Anyway, this fixes all that.

    Thank you all for thehelp so far. I appreciate all the input! Its good to be here.

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    Good to have you here grasshopper. Loved your show!

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    One of the Schiavone brothers (Mike, I think) is a pro-gun attorney who works in Hamilton (he lives in Middletown but his business address is in the Key Bank Building in downtown Hamilton if you want to consult the phone book under 'attorneys'). I don't know that he particularly specializes in firearms-related cases, but he used to teach the CCW classes, so he's a good contactfor Butler County anyway. Richard Koehler is my lawyer for Hamilton (I have an army of them all over the state) and he's just down the hall in the same building. Again, not particuarly a criminal lawyer, but good overall knowledge and personable (that and his dad was a judge and he fills in occasionally as a municipal court magistrate, so he knows everybody).

    -ljp

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    I'm assuming...Greenville, Ohio.. just up the road from Englewood, Ohio..??



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    Yeah, I just noticed that. You're closer to Lthrnck in Montgomery County than to me. You'd do better to get a referral from the NRA or the Ohio Bar Association for a gun lawyer in Montgomery. I'm not sure I'd recommend my last one - we'll see how my still-unresolved civil suit works out. ;-/

    -ljp

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    Legba wrote:
    Don't bother printing our the relevant sections of the Ohio Revised Code. They either won't care to look, if you're lucky, or will respond with hostility if they think you're some smart-ass/know-it-all telling them their jobs (I made the mistake of telling a detective that I wasn't telling him his job, just the law, which apparently had little enough to do with his job. Wrong answer.)

    Ohio doesn't certify specialties of legal practice, and most lawyers will take what work they can get (out of necessity - there are so many of them), so just try to find one who is competent with criminal defense work generally. One who is him/herself a gun enthusiast might bea plus.

    Welcome to the forum.




    -ljp
    I don't think Kung Fu's Open Carry question or act is anything like your case Legba, it is Apples to Oranges from Open Carry to your case of a loaded Magazine and Pistol in the same vehicle without a CCW Permit.

    I WOULD print the Akron PD memo out and carry it with me and present it to ANY Police Officer that confronted me about OC Laws, if Kung Fu is arrested or harassed he can go to Court stating that he presented the law in Black and White to the Officer and the Officer STILL harassed Kung Fu and THAT is a Law Suit, ALL Police Depts. need to learn the Laws or go broke breaking the laws themselves which would be the case if Kung Fu is arrested or harassed.

    Good Luck and have fun Kung Fu and Legba, I hope your case turns out good as well, I think the MOST you should have been charged with is mistransportation of a firearm and that is ALL but some DA's are self ruling and our local DA is getting sued and she will pay through the nose for her misdeeds, well the County Tax Payers will pay through the nose, not the guilty DA

    Moon Doggie

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    Well, today was my first time out OC and it was good and bad. I laminated tiny wallet size versions of the Columbus Dispatch gun laws, then Ohio Revised Code 9.68, and finally the Akron letter...put them in my motorcycle glove box. Strapped my Springfield XD (loaded) on my hip holster, threw my S&W 22A (unloaded) in the trunk along with an unopened box of Federal .22 and a couple of mags and headed out to the range.

    The ride through town was LIBERATING! Scary & liberating at the same time. I was dreading seeing a police officer....visions of getting tazed or cuffed and stuffed, my wife having a mental breakdown and my son doing the "why's daddy in jail" went through my head.

    Anyway, made it through town and yeah, got some looks. Range is about 20 miles away and it went without problems although the last town New Madison has a school right along the road I needed to get to the range so I had to go wayyyyyyyyyy out in the country to bypass it by 1,000ft.

    THE BAD : Got to the range and pulled in and guess what? City of Dayton police officer (didnt catch the name, didnt ask) told me if he saw me riding like that, especially if it was loaded, he'd cuff and stuff me and let me prove I'm innocent in court. I showed him the 9.68, the gun laws, and the Akron letter. Unbelieveable! So here I made it through town, down the road, and AT THE RANGE of all places I get the whole I'm being illegal thing. He said he was a police officer for the City of Dayton.

    I went ahead and shot my S&W 22A...what an accurate gun...it can take a pop can at 100yds all day no joke.

    Now on the way home I was all freaked out, took every backroad there was and pulling into the garage was like I just escaped from Alcatraz. I promptly called my sherrifs dept and left a message w the CCW license guy. I'm going to have to get started on seeing if thedept (both the sherrif and city) are up to speed on it starting onMonday.

    The sad part is that I was at Wallyworld earlier and I looked the digital audio recorders and cheaped out since they were $30. If I had only bought it and had it with me! Anyway, next time at Walmart (every day isnt it) I'll pick it up, just wish I had bought it in the first place.

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    Dayton police... why am I not surprised. I am certain that he is not kidding. They have acted psychotically hateful towards me, certainly (it was their "street crimes unit" detectives that busted me last fall, complete with a threat to "kick the **** out of [me]" from a uniform). I wouldn't put it past them to kick your ass and then plant dope on you additionally, while running you in on some gun charge (that's called "crumbing" someone).

    The back roads aren't necessarily any better. I've had ugly stops in Germantown andin unincorprated parts of Montgomery as well (cops have told me that they consider Route 4 a "major artery" for drug running). I've gone to taking the long way to the public range by Xenia (going north from Lebanon) just to avoid Montgomery County altogether.

    -ljp

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    I am SO GLAD that I live in "Hilljack" Country, my family moved out of Akron when I was 12, I didn't like it at first, going from a pretty big city out to hay fields everywhere, but when I turned 13 and started hunting, you couldn't hardly get me to visit my Grandma in Akron anymore and today, you would have to kill me to get me to live in a City anymore

    Sounds like Dayton needs an OC Picnic or march, obviously they DON'T know the Laws in this Great State of Ohio, as people say, there IS safety in numbers

    Moon

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    The range, by the way, was the Darke County Fish and Game club... I dont know what he was doing so far from Dayton, but omg that digital recorder would have paid for itself right then and there! If only I had asked his name or written that license plate down! Ahhhhhh.



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    Kungfu, what kind of motorcycle do you ride? I've been riding my '04 Yamaha YZF-R6 down in KY doing OC for the whole week. Can't wait to get my permit so I can ride that way in OH too. Funny, as the law used to be OC ONLY for vehicle transport with CC. No LEO encounter with motorcycle OC yet. Heck, that's how I rode to (and from) my CC class in KY.

    I just went and bought a paddle holster for my XD .45 Compact and told the guy that I was waiting on my CCDW. He said "Yeah, then you'll get to use this." I told him that when I got it I was going to CC my wife's .22 that we can't find a holster for and she was going to OC my 45. I guess he missed the fact that I was OC.

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    I have a Honda Pacific Coast. Hopefully the picture will work. A little off subject, but I love the bike...windshield, trunk space, seat and upright position make it a dream to ride. I should also mention self-cancelling turn signals and a gas gauge which I have not had before.

    I'm kinda wondering if anyone knows,if I carry OC and also have an unloaded pistol in the bike and ammunition, how am I supposed to keep it seperate, as I think I'm technically supposed to, or does the CCW overrule the transport thing for anything else in my vehicle?


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    IANAL, but I think you're OK because you have to "exit the vehicle" to get to your secondary weapon. On mine I have to use the ignition key to pop the seat, don't know about yours though.

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    Yes, I have to take the key out of the ignition, then use it to open a hatch which has the trunk release lever in it.

    Technically I should be able to keep it loaded in the trunk also since it is a "locked compartment", but I'm kinda taking it easy right now with just the OC part.

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    Kungfu wrote:
    New Madison has a school right along the road I needed to get to the range so I had to go wayyyyyyyyyy out in the country to bypass it by 1,000ft.
    That was unnecessary since you stated earlier that you have an Ohio CHL. As long as you don't enter on school property you are legal. The "1000 ft. school zone" doesn't apply to Ohio CHL licensees.

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    There's a difference between school safety zones as defined by federal law and state law. Last I heard, OH defines school safety zones as the school's real property, while federal is the 1000 ft rule. The most common use of the federal definition is Posession/Sale of a controlled substance within 1000 ft of a school, or any such crime.

    As OC isn't a crime, the 1000 ft rule doesn't apply, just don't go on school property.

    IANAL, this is just my interpretation.

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    That is great news! Thank you....that saves me a lot of time going out of the way to avoid it. Much appreciated!


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    I am new to this and so I'm pretty cautious. It took me, what about a week, but I spoke with a detectivewith mysheriff's dept yesterday and he reassured me that they all know that open carry, in or out of a vehicle, was legal since I have my CCW permit. This was a huge, hugereassurance to me. I felt it was better to make sure rather than to ride (or walk) and wonder if they would think I wasbreaking the law or causingpanic...andit is good to know they are on the same page on this subject.

    I have one call to make to the city police on my next day off work and that should wrap it up for me here locally!

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