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Thread: Fan Mail

  1. #1
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    I just e-mailed this to the Public Affairs officer of the local police department. Will post their response when I receive it. Whatever they say, I thought it would be worthwhile for them to devote some thought to this before the fact. I put it in the Ohio section as it only pertains to this one department.

    -ljp

    ----

    I work in the gun department of the pawn shop downtown, and I have had customers express concerns over the possibility of a hurricane Katrina-like situation arising where, in the wake of some natural disaster, say, the police take the measure of forcibly removing people from their homes, and even confiscating weapons in the ostensible interest of public safety. These emergencies are situations where police are compromised in their ability to respond normally, and where there is an increased propensity to lawlessness - in short, times when people might most need to have firearms to protect themselves.

    My question is whether the Hamilton Municipal Police have any established policy with regard to disaster response, vis firearms rights.

    I have also been asked by patrons to inquire as to whether the local police have any policy regarding the "open carry" of a firearm (without regard to carry permit status). This is not itself illegal as the law stands - the "inducing panic" and "disorderly conduct" laws do not prohibit this by itself, absent additional attendant criminality. Apart from the question of whether one would with to encourage this behavior or not, is there any departmental policy concerning the handling of reports of armed people not otherwise committing crimes?

    Thanks for your time.

    ----

    Well, I already got a response by phone and the guy said that they did have a policy with regard to disasters - without elaborating what the policy was or where I could see a copy of it. He further said that anyone open carrying was taking their chances and that it was up to the individual responding officer's discretion as to whether they might be arrested for "inducing panic" or "disorderly conduct." He emphasized that it would depend on the circumstances and the reasonableness of the explanation they got, but I was left with the impression that anyone carrying who did not supply a reason to their satisfaction would likely get arrested. Not an entirely satisfactory exchange, but the guy did express interest in seeing the shop, so I hope to be able to continue this conversation later.


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    Legba wrote:
    Well, I already got a response by phone and the guy said that they did have a policy with regard to disasters - without elaborating what the policy was or where I could see a copy of it. He further said that anyone open carrying was taking their chances and that it was up to the individual responding officer's discretion as to whether they might be arrested for "inducing panic" or "disorderly conduct." He emphasized that it would depend on the circumstances and the reasonableness of the explanation they got, but I was left with the impression that anyone carrying who did not supply a reason to their satisfaction would likely get arrested. Not an entirely satisfactory exchange, but the guy did express interest in seeing the shop, so I hope to be able to continue this conversation later.
    :shock: Not the popo, they're on our side!

    Sorry. I just can't help it.

  3. #3
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    Maybe this Officer needs to read some of these Forums where ALL of the Lawsuits Pending are at the top of the pages.

    They think because they carry a badge and gun that THEY get to decide what a law means, the OC Law in Ohio is cut and dried, it IS lawful to OC in Ohio if you are allowed to own a firearm, I doubt if many felons try to OC but there is occasionally a REALLY dumb felon out there that thinks he still has Gun Rights :shock:

    Moon Doggie

    ETA: Didn't the Castle Doctrine address the confiscation of firearms during a natural disaster such as the Katrina fiasco?


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    Regular Member IanB's Avatar
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    Legba wrote:
    "they did have a policy with regard to disasters - without elaborating what the policy was or where I could see a copy of it.
    Sounds like you or someone else should FOIA that policy.


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    Actually there isn't any laws in Ohio that makes OC'ing legal.

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    Well, that's my concern - that there may be discrepancies between the letter of the law and their internal policy memos about how to handle riots, say.

    -ljp

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    Lthrnck wrote:
    Actually there isn't any laws in Ohio that makes OC'ing legal.
    So you are saying that there are no laws that make OC'ing "Illegal" +1 from me!

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    Lthrnck wrote:
    Actually there isn't any laws in Ohio that makes OC'ing legal.
    Well there isn't a law allowing us to wear blue shirts either, but if there isn't a law AGAINST it, I wear a blue shirt and when a Police Dept. sends a Dept. wide memo stating it IS legal, I think precedence has been set or at least legitimized

    Moon Doggie

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    There are no laws in Ohio saying specificallyit's legal or illegal to Open Carry a firearm.

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    Lthrnck wrote:
    There are no laws in Ohio saying specificallyit's legal or illegal to Open Carry a firearm.
    When there is no law making somthing illegal, then that something is legal by default.

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    PA-Carry wrote:
    When there is no law making somthing illegal, then that something is legal by default.
    Right!



    When it comes to the law, if it doesn't say you can't, then you can.

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    It is all very simple if we avoid gray-ing the issue...

    The exact same "law", the Ohio Constitution, that permits the legislature to write statutes; the executive to enforce them (all po-po's are under jurisdiction here) and the judicial to interpret them...allows that:

    ยง 1.04 Bearing arms; standing armies; military powers (1851)
    [ View Article Table of Contents ]
    The people have the right to bear arms for their defense and security;

    Just because we've given up the high ground and allowed "concealed" carry rules, doesn't mean we've given up the whole kit & kaboodle.

    IF WE don't have the right to "bear arms" then THEY don't have the right or permission to write laws, enforce them or decide the winning side upon disagreement.

    IMmHOoc.

    UnIrWe
    We The People.

  13. #13
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    Look up the Ohio Supreme Court Decision of Klein vs Leis:

    Open Carry is Legal by judicial precedent.


    Open carry is without a doubt 100% legal in Ohio.

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    I know it's legal. My question was whether the local police know it's legal and to what extent the respect the right of people to go about armed, with particular regard to a Katrina-like disaster situation. Just thought I'd share their take on it. Typical, I'm afraid.

    -ljp

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    You should foward a copy of the memo from former Hamilton County prosecutor Mike Allen that talks about open carry.
    I have a feeling,unforchently, many other agencys (Fairfield, West Chester, etc) would be the same way.

  16. #16
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    I recently sent off an email to the local police...awaiting response.

  17. #17
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    Jacksnack wrote:
    I recently sent off an email to the local police...awaiting response.
    I recd a response from the local PD.



    It basically says we are aware of the OC issue and really can't disagree with my interpretation regard the legalities.

    Sounds good...no threats of menacing of IP.:celebrate

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