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Thread: Friday Night Live/Herndon Festival - Herndon, VA

  1. #1
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    At least the RULES look promising.. have any of you OC'ed there?


    http://www.herndonrocks.com

    Friday Night Live! Rules and Regulations


    The following is a list of rules at Friday Night Live! which are intended to keep us all safe and legal at this free summer event. The Herndon Dulles Chamber of Commerce, the Town of Herndon , Friday Night Live! staff, sponsors, and volunteers thank you for your adherence to these rules.

    1. No alcoholic beverages may be brought into the event - Virginia ABC rules prohibit bringing alcoholic beverages into events where alcohol is sold.
    2. Coolers and bags will be searched.
    3. No alcoholic beverages may be taken outside of the Friday Night Live!
      concert area.
    4. The Restrooms are located outside of the concert venue; so alcoholic beverages may not be carried to that area.
    5. You must be 21 to purchase and consume alcoholic beverages
    6. Everyone must present a valid ID and obtain a wristband prior to purchase and in order to consume alcoholic beverages.
    7. No more than 2 alcoholic beverages may be purchased by an individual at one time.
    8. Alcohol sales will end at 9:30 PM at each event, except July 4th it is 10:00 PM.
      Other Rules and Conditions
    9. No Pets are allowed at Friday Night Live!
    10. No skating or biking is allowed on the premises.
    11. No solicitation is allowed at Friday Night Live!
    Thanks for your cooperation!

    Hope to see you at FRIDAY NIGHT LIVE!

    Carry On.

    Ed

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  2. #2
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    I haven't, thought about it as the family does enjoy attending though it's been a few years since we've gone. This summer is looking to be fairly crazy so I don't know if we'll hit some but I've thought about it.

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    A few weeks ago I was driving through Herndon on a Friday and they were having some event for which they had blocked some of the streets. People were everywhere. They had cops everywhere and ATF agents at what looked like the entrance to the event. I'm not sure how friendly they would have been to someone OCing.

    Might be interesting to find out....perhaps a few of us should get together and attend one of these?

  4. #4
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    Just sent this mail I will advise of any response

    Mr. Kaufman is the town attorney for Herndon.

    - - - -
    To: richard.kaufman@herndon-va.gov
    CC: town.clerk@herndon-va.gov, herndon.police@herndon-va.gov
    Sent: 6/20/2008 11:07:43 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time
    Subj: Rules - Friday Night Live

    I read the intro to your "Friday Night Live" page and your rules.. "which are intended to keep us all safe and legal at this free summer event." I want to be safe and legal as well. To do so, I carry a firearm. Sometimes concealed (with my concealed handgun permit) and sometimes I Open Carry. First, I commend you for not illegally listing "No Firearms Allowed" on you list of rules. I further wanted to ask you about "coolers and bags will be searched". If they check my bag (if I chose not to open carry) they might see a firearm (which I would advise them of before they looked in the bag as to not startle anyone). I just wanted to ask you if the Herndon Police and "any other" security personnel were up to speed on Virginia's handgun laws before I come to the event.

    Thanks,

    Ed Levine



    (edited for formatting errors)
    Carry On.

    Ed

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  5. #5
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    I've been before (before I started carrying) and it was a good time. Lots of kids running around, just keep your awareness on the up, there are just lots and lots of people around.

    Get there early and get a good seat in the lawn.

    Have fun!

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    Remember that alcohol will be sold for on site consumption, so taking your firearm concealed in that bag would be a violation of the law (as I interpret it, but I'm not a lawyer). So open carry in and you should be fine.

  7. #7
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    Fast Response.. (short too) lol.

    - - - -

    In a message dated 6/20/2008 11:22:18 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, richard.kaufman@herndon-va.gov writes:
    Received. Noted. Richard
    Richard B. Kaufman, Town Attorney

    Carry On.

    Ed

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  8. #8
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    xd.40 wrote:
    Remember that alcohol will be sold for on site consumption, so taking your firearm concealed in that bag would be a violation of the law (as I interpret it, but I'm not a lawyer). So open carry in and you should be fine.
    IANALE

    But.. it is not a club or restaurant that "regularly" serves meals
    Carry On.

    Ed

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    Yeah, I remember a thread discussing that thin line. I guess you have to make that decision on your own though .

  10. #10
    Regular Member IanB's Avatar
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    This has been covered before. There are manytypes of ABC licenses. The only ones that count against concealed carry are "restaurants" and "clubs". An "outdoor music festival" is not a restaurant or club, and the streets of Herndon are not areas where "entrees are regularly sold ". Also, the City of Herndon or the agent selling alcohol on site would have a temporary special event license for this event, not a permanent club or restaurant license. I just got off the phone with VA ABC and they confirmed. However, the individual I spoke with (an enforcement officer) made it very clear that this was his opinion after reading the code and he is not a lawyer or able to provide legal opinions or speak on behalf of VA ABC.



    • § 18.2-308. Personal protection; carrying concealed weapons; when lawful to carry.
      • J3. No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia; however, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.
    • § 4.1-100. Definitions.
      • "Club" means any private nonprofit corporation or association which is the owner, lessee, or occupant of an establishment operated solely for a national, social, patriotic, political, athletic, or other like purpose, but not for pecuniary gain, the advantages of which belong to all of the members. It also means the establishment so operated. A corporation or association shall not lose its status as a club because of the conduct of charitable gaming conducted pursuant to Article 1.1:1 (§ 18.2-340.15 et seq.) of Chapter 8 of Title 18.2 in which nonmembers participate frequently or in large numbers, provided that no alcoholic beverages are served or consumed in the room where such charitable gaming is being conducted while such gaming is being conducted and that no alcoholic beverages are made available upon the premises to any person who is neither a member nor a bona fide guest of a member.
      • "Restaurant" means, for a beer, or wine and beer license or a limited mixed beverage restaurant license, any establishment provided with special space and accommodation, where, in consideration of payment, meals or other foods prepared on the premises are regularly sold.

        "Restaurant" means, for a mixed beverage license other than a limited mixed beverage restaurant license, an established place of business (i) where meals with substantial entrees are regularly sold and (ii) which has adequate facilities and sufficient employees for cooking, preparing, and serving such meals for consumption at tables in dining areas on the premises, and includes establishments specializing in full course meals with a single substantial entree.

  11. #11
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    Another response to my e-mail...

    - - -

    From: toussaint.summers@herndon-va.gov
    To: FlyboyEd@aol.com
    Sent: 6/20/2008 2:43:39 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time
    Subj: Friday Night Live


    Flyboy, Herndon is a very safe community and I hope you enjoy your visit.
    Carry On.

    Ed

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    Campaign Veteran roscoe13's Avatar
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    ed wrote:
    Another response to my e-mail...

    - - -

    From: toussaint.summers@herndon-va.gov
    To: FlyboyEd@aol.com
    Sent: 6/20/2008 2:43:39 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time
    Subj: Friday Night Live


    Flyboy, Herndon is a very safe community and I hope you enjoy your visit.
    People said the same thing about Blacksburg until 4/16/07...
    "The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good." - George Washington

  13. #13
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    And my Resposne to Herndon Police Chief Summers:

    - - -

    In a message dated 6/20/2008 2:43:39 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, toussaint.summers@herndon-va.gov writes:
    Flyboy, Herndon is a very safe community
    Chief -

    Thanks for writing back... people said the same thing about Blacksburg until 4/16/07...

    and this seems pretty safe too.. (a couple months ago):

    A 42-year-old Herndon woman was robbed at gunpoint in the 2200 block of Gingell Place as she walked toward her home Feb. 1 around 10:30 p.m. Two men approached her, one displayed a handgun, and the woman surrendered her purse and ran. There were no injuries.

    Both suspects were described as Hispanic between 18 and 20 years old. The armed suspect was about 6 feet tall and wore a light-colored jacket. The other suspect was about 5 feet 7 inches tall and wore a dark jacket. The suspects are still at large. Anyone with information is asked to call Crime Solvers at 1-866-411-TIPS/8477, e-mail at www.fairfaxcrimesolvers.org or text TIP187 plus your message to CRIMES/274637. Or call Fairfax County Police at 703-691-2131.

    Carry On.

    Ed

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  14. #14
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    At least he answered.. unlike the Alex waterfront festival folks.. I give him credit for that.

    In a message dated 6/20/2008 4:13:18 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, toussaint.summers@herndon-va.gov writes:
    Flyboy, No community is immune from crime…but, I stand by my statement that Herndon is a safe community. It is a community effort to achieve a safe community. The Police and the community strive to work together.
    By the way the crime you include in your email DID NOT occur in the Town of Herndon but in Fairfax County. (That is not to say it could never happen in the Town)
    Again enjoy your visit.

    Carry On.

    Ed

    VirginiaOpenCarry.Org (Coins, Shirts and Patches)
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  15. #15
    Founder's Club Member Tess's Avatar
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    ed wrote:
    Another response to my e-mail...

    - - -

    From: toussaint.summers@herndon-va.gov
    To: FlyboyEd@aol.com
    Sent: 6/20/2008 2:43:39 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time
    Subj: Friday Night Live


    Flyboy, Herndon is a very safe community and I hope you enjoy your visit.
    So I don't see anything that says you can't carry. Carry on!

    Frankly, I have a problem with searching everyone. Nothing like being treated like a criminal from the get-go. It might be fun to stuff a backpack with sex toys, and another with, say, unpopped popcorn, and another with balloons, etc. just to watch their faces.
    Laws alone can not secure freedom of expression; in order that every man present his views without penalty there must be spirit of tolerance in the entire population. -Albert Einstein

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    Tess wrote:
    SNIP It might be fun to stuff a backpack with sex toys, and another with, say, unpopped popcorn, and another with balloons, etc. just to watch their faces.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Tess wrote:
    So I don't see anything that says you can't carry. Carry on!

    Frankly, I have a problem with searching everyone. Nothing like being treated like a criminal from the get-go. It might be fun to stuff a backpack with sex toys, and another with, say, unpopped popcorn, and another with balloons, etc. just to watch their faces.
    Just be careful which sex toys you wish to bring. Some are illegal in this state as I recall (and even worse in some of the southern states). Can't have freedom to have that kind of "fun" without the state peering into your bedroom!

    And if i get a chance tonight I will look up the code, i need to figure out how to word the query

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    Campaign Veteran roscoe13's Avatar
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    Tess wrote:
    So I don't see anything that says you can't carry. Carry on!

    Frankly, I have a problem with searching everyone. Nothing like being treated like a criminal from the get-go. It might be fun to stuff a backpack with sex toys, and another with, say, unpopped popcorn, and another with balloons, etc. just to watch their faces.
    Dirty socks...
    "The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good." - George Washington

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    Whenever I go someplace where they might be searching my baggage I always put a flyer with the 4th Ammendment printed on it in big letters on the top so it's the first thing they see when they open it.

  20. #20
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    Tomahawk wrote:
    Whenever I go someplace where they might be searching my baggage I always put a flyer with the 4th Ammendment printed on it in big letters on the top so it's the first thing they see when they open it.
    Great idea!
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Citizen wrote:
    Tomahawk wrote:
    Whenever I go someplace where they might be searching my baggage I always put a flyer with the 4th Ammendment printed on it in big letters on the top so it's the first thing they see when they open it.
    Great idea!
    Yeah, but it's totally lost on the low-IQ types who do that sort of thing to people's baggage.

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    Every Friday night from June to August there are concerts on the "Town Green" (Which is just a big lawn for the Town Council Building)in Herndon. These events are sponsored by the Herndon Chamber of Commerce and others. They control access to the "Green" and check coolers and bags for alcohol because bringing alcohol into the event is against ABC regulations since alcohol is for sale by the Herndon High School All Night Grad Committee.

    My question is: Has anyone ever open carried to a FNL event?

    and, Can you CC to the event since alcohol is offered for sale for on site consumption only?

    If you have open carried, were you hasseled by anyone? Either the volunteer "marshals" or the numerous police who are in the area?

    There is a concert there this week by a Jimmy Buffet tribute band that I want to see and I was pondering carryingsince I will NOT be drinking this week.

    BTW, if you have never been, these are great events that are very well attended by lots of people of all ages when the weather is good.

    Be Careful Out There!

    Paul

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    I've never been there, so I couldn't begin to guess about your OC questions, but as far as CC is concerned, it depends on the type of ABC license they have. I seriously doubt that they have a Restaurant or Club license, which are the only two types where CC is prohibited. If I were going (and I may have to consider doing that soon), I wouldn't hesitate to CC.

    While OC is undoubtedly legal there, who knows if it would result in a hassle of some sort?

    ~ Boyd

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  25. #25
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    My $0.02:

    Yes, you can carry there. It's public property, so preemption prevents them from legally forbidding firearms. Also, the ABC license is an event license, not a restaurant license, so CC is allowed. The whole "inspection" of coolers thing is fairly shaky on constitutional grounds, IMO, but that's not the topic here.

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