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Thread: Buffalo Wild Wings - Lynchburg

  1. #1
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    I just got back home from my regular Thursday night dinner with friends (about 9 p.m.) at the Lynchburg Buffalo Wild Wings and although the food and service was fine, I'm rather disappointed. Near the end of our meals my girlfriend noted the guys behind us commenting to their server about my openly carriedfirearm, whichhappened to becarried in a strapped top holster. Shortly afterward two managers showed up at my table and asked to speak with me outside. I agreed and we headed outside away from the crowd. Once outside, the general manager (Jason?)stated that although he had no problem with my openly carried firearm and further had no idea of what the law allowed for, he asked that if I come in at dinner time that I leave my firearm in the car because the franchisee, who owns this store and the stores in Roanoke does not like having guests carrying firearms in the evenings because of their greateralcohol sales. He further stated that he had no issue with folks carrying at lunch time because thealcohol sales were small and that he had several guests that carried at lunch. However,he also stated that he had askedthose guestsnot to return for dinner carrying their firearms because of the trouble that he has had with his alcohol consuming customers getting too rowdy and becoming a danger to the customers in the evening. He at that point admitted that the rowdiness and trouble was in no way caused by the gun owners, but he was afraid of the firearm getting into the possession of one of his intoxicated rowdy customers and that they would become a (further) danger to his other customers. Although he wasn't asking me to leave right then or even demanding that I leave my firearm in the car whenever I visit, it was his sincere request that I not carry it at dinner time. In response I let him know that I appreciated the way he handled the situation, however I do not give my money to businesses that would ask me to leave my firearm behind. Shortly afterward, the cordial conversation ended and I returned to my table to wrap up the dinner service and leave.

    After this conversation with the general manager it became clear to me that this manager was already aware that he had lost control of his alcohol consuming customers and control of those who served the alcohol to those who were already intoxicated (because he stated that he had had problems). Further it was evident that he was more interested in continuing to rake in money from alcohol sales than providing a safe environment for his guests by ensuring that the alcohol consumers aren't drunk and troublesome. The time of evening that I was in the restaurant was from about 8 p.m. to 9 p.m., which is the same time that families might be and were dining out in that very same restaurant, not late in the evening when families would be less likely to be dining.

    For myself, I willnot again be dining at this Buffalo Wild Wings for lunch or dinner since the manager has asked that I not come in during regular dinner hours with my firearm and has further indicated that his alcohol serving establishment may not be a safe place to be in the evenings as a result of his rowdy, drunk customers. It is my intent to make note of this situation with the Buffalo Wild Wings company, which sold the franchise and note to the VA Alcoholic Beverage Control what this manager related to me regarding the safety of his restaurant because of his alcohol consuming guests.

    Take note that the franchisee who owns this store also owns the locations in Roanoke, VA as well. Until this restaurant welcomes the guests who care for their own safety and gets a handle on their rowdy, drunk customers I'd recommend staying out of this and the other mentioned Buffalo Wild Wings.

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    Great ideas.

    Just as I was thinking to myself, "Why not report to the ABC," you go and write exactly that. Good thinking, even if I'm also complimenting myself.

    I definitely would do just that.

    And thepolice. Nothing helps ensure the safety and continued operation of a business like a sobriety checkpoint just down the street.

    (Giggle) Of course, you could let them know you are going to do this, since the drunks are thick and out-of-control. I mean, you sincerely want to help this manager and the company get this situation under control, don't you? You don't want them in the embarrassing position of having to warn away good customers (you) and at the same timetacitly admit their staff can't control thedrunks. My, God. They might as well admit they have erectile problems. How terribly embarrassing.The situation must be horrible in there. I betsomeof the rowdies ignore the waiter's refusal to serve more alcohol,walk up to the bar, and just seize whatever they want. Its a miracle they even payfor it.

    Yep. Its your duty to help this poor man get this situation under control.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Why would someone armed or not, want to visit a restaurant where the manager has told them that it may be unsafe due to their serving excessive amounts of alcohol to customers they know present a danger to other customers when inebriated?
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    So your a danger because his establishment is overserving the customers? Worse he only cares that nothing happens that might endanger him, he seems to care less about everyone he's endangering by putting drunks on the road.

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    I would write the owner / manager and inform them that you have written the Virginia Alcohol Control board and and reported that management of the said establishment has admitted to over- serving alcohol to people who are already intoxicated in violation of Virginia ABC laws.

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    I've eaten at many Buffalo Wild Wings since there were plenty of them around where I grew up in Ohio and except for late in the evenings, when the crowd becomes more of a "bar" crowd, the place is rather family friendly. In fact I've been to this location on various occasions and have never seen the first incident.I do know from the times that I've been there sans gun so I could enjoy a brew or two, that the only thing the management does to control the alcohol pumped into a guest is ensure that the guest has completely finished off one drink before they'll bring another.

    One funny thing I noted was that although the manager said he usually doesn't have any issue with uniformed on duty police carrying in his restaurant, he'd rather the off duty out of uniform ones leave their guns behind as well. I guess he knows he has trouble and doesn't want to be bothered with fixing it.

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    Sheriff I bought a voice recorder just earlier this week for a situation similar to this, but for some reason I didn't put it back on after I worked out. It's probably that I'm not fully used to keeping it on me all the time yet, but I wanted to kick myself for forgetting it once I realized that I didn't have it. Live and learn I suppose.

    I have no intention of giving the restaurant a "heads up" regarding my statement to the ABC. This manager indicated that he has made the same request to various people, so I would not be the only person who could be making note to the ABC. Apparently there have already been issues with the customers making trouble when inebriated, so I'm sure the ABC is already aware of the problem.

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    I'll take it as a virtual kick in the rear. Ouch! Hey sheriff not so hard man!

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    I had my first Buffalo Wild Wings visit yesterday in Newport news Va. What a let down. Service sucked with an empty lunch crowd (we had to go track down our own waitress) and the wings were ok. I ordered them with the sauce farthest to the right (alledgedly super hot) but wasn't impressed with the fire level. I'll stick to Hooters....better scenery.

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    You know, Melvin, you could stop by and ask to talk to the same manager again, THEN record him.

    It's perfectly legal to record a conversation you're a part of. Even over the phone.

    Give 'im a call, get your recording, then get ahold of the ABC. This is a public safety issue.
    Why open carry? Because 1911 > 911.

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    bayboy42 wrote:
    I had my first Buffalo Wild Wings visit yesterday in Newport news Va. What a let down. Service sucked with an empty lunch crowd (we had to go track down our own waitress) and the wings were ok. I ordered them with the sauce farthest to the right (alledgedly super hot) but wasn't impressed with the fire level. I'll stick to Hooters....better scenery.
    That sucks. The one in VA beach is great.

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    GLENGLOCKER wrote:
    bayboy42 wrote:
    I had my first Buffalo Wild Wings visit yesterday in Newport news Va. What a let down. Service sucked with an empty lunch crowd (we had to go track down our own waitress) and the wings were ok. I ordered them with the sauce farthest to the right (alledgedly super hot) but wasn't impressed with the fire level. I'll stick to Hooters....better scenery.
    That sucks. The one in VA beach is great.
    DO they have different sauces or are you just commenting on the service?

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    I go with medium which is plenty hot and the service has always been great.

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    Never much liked BWW, the wings were always dried out it seemed. Blacksburg always had a few quality bars that had good wing joints.

    Fosters is alright up here, not hot enough for most, but Hard Times Cafe is another decent option.



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    I do not see a problem with the General Manager asking you to leave your gun in the car where it will be out of reach from anyone who might attempt to grab it from you. Whether the person grabbing it is intoxicated or not is not the issue. It is the risk presented that is the issue. You seem to be dwelling on the fact that there might be intoxicated guests in the restaurant. How would you feel if Buffalo Wild Wings offered you protection while you eat by allowing their servers (people whom you don't know are or aren't licensed to carry a weapon) to carry guns. Wouldn't you feel that there is a posibility of a threat if someone (drunk or sober) reached out and grabbed the gun from the servers holster? I believe anyone would agree the restaurant is safer without the presence of the weapon. My main point is that the Manager didn't know if you were licensed and even if you were the possibility of a person grabbing the gun from you could pose a threat to the public. I eat in this restaurant regularily and I do not see any problems with overserving alcohol. The manager must have been presenting a hypothetical worst case senaro which might have taken place, although it seems unlikely. He was just watching out for the publics safety as he should be with all the shootings going on these days.

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    rebeccaphillips wrote:
    I do not see a problem with the General Manager asking you to leave your gun in the car where it will be out of reach from anyone who might attempt to grab it from you. Whether the person grabbing it is intoxicated or not is not the issue. It is the risk presented that is the issue. You seem to be dwelling on the fact that there might be intoxicated guests in the restaurant. How would you feel if Buffalo Wild Wings offered you protection while you eat by allowing their servers (people whom you don't know are or aren't licensed to carry a weapon) to carry guns. Wouldn't you feel that there is a posibility of a threat if someone (drunk or sober) reached out and grabbed the gun from the servers holster? I believe anyone would agree the restaurant is safer without the presence of the weapon. My main point is that the Manager didn't know if you were licensed and even if you were the possibility of a person grabbing the gun from you could pose a threat to the public. I eat in this restaurant regularily and I do not see any problems with overserving alcohol. The manager must have been presenting a hypothetical worst case senaro which might have taken place, although it seems unlikely. He was just watching out for the publics safety as he should be with all the shootings going on these days.
    If that is your belief then I'd say you don't come around here too often.

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    rebeccaphillips wrote:
    I do not see a problem with the General Manager asking you to leave your gun in the car where it will be out of reach from anyone who might attempt to grab it from you. Whether the person grabbing it is intoxicated or not is not the issue. It is the risk presented that is the issue. You seem to be dwelling on the fact that there might be intoxicated guests in the restaurant. How would you feel if Buffalo Wild Wings offered you protection while you eat by allowing their servers (people whom you don't know are or aren't licensed to carry a weapon) to carry guns. Wouldn't you feel that there is a posibility of a threat if someone (drunk or sober) reached out and grabbed the gun from the servers holster? I believe anyone would agree the restaurant is safer without the presence of the weapon. My main point is that the Manager didn't know if you were licensed and even if you were the possibility of a person grabbing the gun from you could pose a threat to the public. I eat in this restaurant regularily and I do not see any problems with overserving alcohol. The manager must have been presenting a hypothetical worst case senaro which might have taken place, although it seems unlikely. He was just watching out for the publics safety as he should be with all the shootings going on these days.
    1) Most people who open carry (OC) a sidearm do so in a retention holster, as do most police officers who OC, to prevent someone from just reaching out and taking the handgun. Many of us have and do train in retention techniques, specialized martial arts training on how to keep someone from taking our sidearm.

    2) I don't care what kind of protection BWW offers me, I prefer the protection I offer myself when I take responibility for my own and my family's safety by being a legally armed citizen, every day, every where I can legally do so.

    3) I would feel fine if the BWW or any other restaurant's wait staff carried firearms openly or concealed. That BWW would have the same faith in my fellow citizens to legally carry firearms as I do, and the same grounding in the United States Constitution's Bill of Rights as I do, would be refreshing and heartening and would garner them much more of my business than they receive now.

    4) In VA there is no licensing requirement to carry a handgun openly.

    5) I do not agree that this restaurant or any other is safer without weapons. I remember watching the news about "Luby's Massacre" when George Hennard drove his truck through the front wall of Luby's restaurant in Killeen, TX and then calmly got out and systematically executed 23 patrons and wounded 20 more. Due to TX law at the time, no citizen was legally armed to fight back. It was the most bloody massacre in modern American history prior to the VT killings. Just a bunch of people sitting around eating feeling oh so safe since none of them had guns and minutes later they cowered in fear waiting their turn for a madman to execute them since none of them had guns with which to fight back.

    6) In restaurants that serve alcohol in VA you will see if someone is carrying a firearm even if they typically conceal it because VA law passed by the wisdom of your legislators and signed by your governor, requires OC only in such establishments. In most other parts of the country and most other places in VA, you will never know how many firearms are constantly surrounding you because most citizens who carry firearms do so concealed. I live in an area that requires concealed firearms all the time, even in restaurants that serve alcohol. I actually sat at dinner one evening with an acquaintance and several friends at which the acquaintance commented about how much she hates guns and is glad that she isn't around them. Almost everyone at the table besides her was concealed carrying (CC) a sidearm. The fact that she didn't see them did not put her at risk or make her safer than if we were OC, it only made her ignorant of reality.

    7) I agree that public safety is an issue today for numerous reasons including the mass shootings/massacres at public places. However, nearly all of those mass shootings occur in gun free zones where citizens are not allowed to carry firearms. There is a reason for that. It is called a target rich environment. Mass shooters want victims who can't shoot back so they can prolong and excalate their body count. When mass shootings occur in areas with armed citizens they are not called mass shootings or massacres, they are called a justifiable homicide by a citizen(s) in defense of self or others.

    8) Alcohol is a primary factor in the deaths of far more Americans than handguns (see the drunk driving death toll alone) not to mention the incredible number of physical assaults that occur in and around drinking establishments or other places when alcohol is involved. Over imbibing/serving alcohol is much more dangerous statistically than a law abiding citizen carrying a handgun for his/her own and family's defense.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    rebeccaphillips wrote:
    I do not see a problem with the General Manager asking you to leave your gun in the car where it will be out of reach from anyone who might attempt to grab it from you. Whether the person grabbing it is intoxicated or not is not the issue. It is the risk presented that is the issue. You seem to be dwelling on the fact that there might be intoxicated guests in the restaurant. How would you feel if Buffalo Wild Wings offered you protection while you eat by allowing their servers (people whom you don't know are or aren't licensed to carry a weapon) to carry guns. Wouldn't you feel that there is a posibility of a threat if someone (drunk or sober) reached out and grabbed the gun from the servers holster? I believe anyone would agree the restaurant is safer without the presence of the weapon. My main point is that the Manager didn't know if you were licensed and even if you were the possibility of a person grabbing the gun from you could pose a threat to the public. I eat in this restaurant regularily and I do not see any problems with overserving alcohol. The manager must have been presenting a hypothetical worst case senaro which might have taken place, although it seems unlikely. He was just watching out for the publics safety as he should be with all the shootings going on these days.
    I suggest you take cover rebecca. That is a first post bullseye!

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    That's a helluva first post on a 4 month old thread Rebecca.

    Can't wait to see post # 2
    James Reynolds

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    IP Check, please?

    rebeccaphillips wrote:
    I do not see a problem with the General Manager asking you to leave your gun in the car where it will be out of reach from anyone who might attempt to grab it from you.

    Well, what about someone seeing a person take a weapon outside, at the request of a manager, and stealing said gun from the glass box it is now in?


    rebeccaphillips wrote:

    How would you feel if Buffalo Wild Wings offered you protection while you eat by allowing their servers (people whom you don't know are or aren't licensed to carry a weapon) to carry guns.

    Indifferent at best. This type of situation rarely helps in the parking lot.

    rebeccaphillips wrote:

    Wouldn't you feel that there is a posibility of a threat if someone (drunk or sober) reached out and grabbed the gun from the servers holster?

    I guess that's why they make retention holsters.

    rebeccaphillips wrote:
    I believe anyone would agree the restaurant is safer without the presence of the weapon.

    I believe everyone knows that using phrases such as "I believe everyone would agree", or "everyone knows", or "I think we can all just agree" is a sign of a weak argument.

    Unless you have a genie's lamp in your back pocket, all the weapons in the world aren't going to go away overnight. We have laws that make it illegal to shoot people, and most places of business find any sort of assault, armed, or otherwise, as grounds for not wishing someone to remain on premises. Just tell someone that if you're ever in a store that's being robbed.

    rebeccaphillips wrote:

    My main point is that the Manager didn't know if you were licensed and even if you were the possibility of a person grabbing the gun from you could pose a threat to the public.



    rebeccaphillips wrote:

    I eat in this restaurant regularily and I do not see any problems with overserving alcohol. The manager must have been presenting a hypothetical worst case senaro which might have taken place, although it seems unlikely.

    I USED to eat there, but I got tired of picking broken glass out of my hair after the first time some drunken idiot started throwing high-ball glasses across the building.

    rebeccaphillips wrote:

    He was just watching out for the publics safety as he should be with all the shootings going on these days.
    I don't recall going to B-Dub's to have someone oversee my safety. I DO, however, recall going there to get something to eat.

    Pop Quiz: What do the Jonesboro Westside Middle School, VA Tech, Notre Dame Elementary, that mall in Utah, Kirkwood city hall, Louisiana Tech, and Ecole Polytechnique college all have in common?

    Someone banned guns as a way of watching out for the public's safety. You know, with all the shootings that went on those days.
    Why open carry? Because 1911 > 911.

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    rebeccaphillips wrote:
    I do not see a problem with the General Manager asking you to leave your gun in the car where it will be out of reach from anyone who might attempt to grab it from you. Whether the person grabbing it is intoxicated or not is not the issue. It is the risk presented that is the issue. You seem to be dwelling on the fact that there might be intoxicated guests in the restaurant. How would you feel if Buffalo Wild Wings offered you protection while you eat by allowing their servers (people whom you don't know are or aren't licensed to carry a weapon) to carry guns. Wouldn't you feel that there is a posibility of a threat if someone (drunk or sober) reached out and grabbed the gun from the servers holster? I believe anyone would agree the restaurant is safer without the presence of the weapon. My main point is that the Manager didn't know if you were licensed and even if you were the possibility of a person grabbing the gun from you could pose a threat to the public. I eat in this restaurant regularily and I do not see any problems with overserving alcohol. The manager must have been presenting a hypothetical worst case senaro which might have taken place, although it seems unlikely. He was just watching out for the publics safety as he should be with all the shootings going on these days.
    I have to wonder about the fear of gun related deaths. I mean, drinking and driving kills just as effectively.

    Think about that for a moment. To shoot someone with a gun requires overcoming certain inhibitions. It's not taken lightly. To drink and drive only requires bad judgement.

    I would truly be more worried about the drunks driving than people open carrying. You normally don't find the OC folks drinking if they are OC. On that note, I believe OC and drinking is illegal. I'd have to go check to confirm that. Even if it isn't, good sense indicates (to me at least) you don't want to have a gun if you have been consuming something that impairs judgement.

    Good luck with your 1st post.

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    Rebecca thanks for your post. While you have a right to voice your opinion, I certainly do not have to agree with it and I certainly don't. Yes the general manager was well within his bounds to ask me to leave my firearm in my car and it is within my limits to never eat at this BWW again, which I haven't and I won't not even if they had a small army to "protect" their guests. I make a habit of not giving my money to businesses that ask me to part with one of my best means of self defense. When the general manager expressed that he thought that his restaurant was too dangerous for me to be carrying a weapon you had best believe that I know ifa place is too dangerous for me to have a weapon then it is certainly too dangerous to enter without one. I won't put my life or the life of my friends and family in a position where they are without the defensive tools they would use to protect their own life, especially not for food that I could get many other places that don't try to disarm me.

    What you may or may not know is that legally only you and I are responsible for our own safety, not police as found by the U.S. Supreme Court and certainly not some restaurant's security guards therefore I will not rely on either as means of protection and I would recommend that neither should you if you think your own life and health have value. When I carry my firearm openly it is always carried in a holster that would prevent someone from just easily reaching down and pulling it out and using it against me or someone else. This type of holster also buys me a bit of reaction time to grab my knife or pepper spray to use it against whoever would be bold enough to try to disarm an armed man who has a strong desire to keep his firearm fromunintended hands.

    As you have been made aware there is no license needed to openly carry a holstered firearm in most places in our Commonwealth. I regularly eat in various restaurants here in Lynchburg while openly armed and the only place that I have had an issue is at BWW. On the rare occasion that I see other restaurant guests also openly armed I am generallycomforted withtheir presence with the understanding that they too are likely someone who takes their own life and well-being seriously. Knowing that the management at the Lynchburg BWW does not accept me carrying the tools to protect my own life and well-being and also being aware of the unsafe environment that having rowdy drunks around me presents I will not be returning to BWW. You, however, are more than welcome to return as much as you like.

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    rebeccaphillips wrote:
    My main point is that the Manager didn't know if you were licensed and even if you were the possibility of a person grabbing the gun from you could pose a threat to the public.

    There is no licensing requirement to Open Carry in the Commonwealth of Virginia!
    Bitka Sve Rešava!
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    Eh heck, she just posted last night. Give her the opportunity to reply, it's just now 9:30 she may be at work or somewhere else.

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