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Thread: No FFLs in DC, no problemo.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    There are of course some FFLs in DC, but at the moment it isn't clear that they do business with the general public.

    I have a solution.

    Make your own gun.

    If I lived in DC here is what I would consider doing.
    Go to a Virginia gun shop or gun show and obtain a black powder revolver. They are not federally regulated and out of state residents can purchase them. In fact on their own they are not the worst pistol to be armed with especially if you get multiple cylinders for reloads.
    Also if you prefer centerfire, you can get conversion cylinders that will allow the use of fixed centerfire ammunition.

    Heres a good example of a gun that would be a good candidate for a conversion.
    http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpag...eitemid=183598

    The conversion cylinder
    http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpag...eitemid=502091



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    Now there's an idea... That would be quite the conversation piece as well. Honestly, for the hassle, I would just as soon have a shotgun.

  3. #3
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    Thought of another class of handguns that DC residents can obtain sans FFL.
    Pre 1899 firearms. They probably need to be registered but can be bought and shipped to someplace outside DC, and brought into DC when the registration process is complete.

    See http://www.antiquefirearms.org/blog/ for a seller of such firearms.

    I wouldn't mind this .44 special 1873 Bisley.

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    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    If you had a C&R license you could buy a nice C&R handgun at a gun show.
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    The end gun show goal, however should be to have a gun show in D.C.!!!!
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    If you have a C&R License why cant a C&R revolver be mailed to a DC resident as well?

    Also there is 1 FFL who will be 'available' for transfers, but time will tell how that works out.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    Doing more research on the the C&R route, it looks like the most commonly available C&R revolver is the Nagant. How about that.


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    longwatch wrote:
    Thought of another class of handguns that DC residents can obtain sans FFL.
    Pre 1899 firearms. They probably need to be registered but can be bought and shipped to someplace outside DC, and brought into DC when the registration process is complete.

    See http://www.antiquefirearms.org/blog/ for a seller of such firearms.

    I wouldn't mind this .44 special 1873 Bisley.
    That Bisley can't be "shipped to your door" unless you have a C&R...otherwise, it would still have to be transfered through an FFL.
    It has to be a black powder gun to be considered "antique" in the sense that you guys are discussing.....not ALL pre 1898 guns qualify.
    See the ATF definition below......

    style="font-family: 'Arial'; font-size: 10pt;"Antique firearm. (a) Any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; and (b) any replica of any firearm described in paragraph (a) of this definition if such replica (1) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or (2) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.

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    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    longwatch wrote:
    Doing more research on the the C&R route, it looks like the most commonly available C&R revolver is the Nagant. How about that.
    Auction arms is currently auctioning 98 C&R revolvers. The Nagant is one of the most common and most inexpensive, but there are lot to choose from. If I had to pick a self defence handgun from what was offered, mine would be a colt police special in .38 special. A little more expensive, but a better firearm. Ammo is a lot cheaper too.
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    Comp-tech wrote:
    longwatch wrote:
    Thought of another class of handguns that DC residents can obtain sans FFL.
    Pre 1899 firearms. They probably need to be registered but can be bought and shipped to someplace outside DC, and brought into DC when the registration process is complete.

    See http://www.antiquefirearms.org/blog/ for a seller of such firearms.

    I wouldn't mind this .44 special 1873 Bisley.
    That Bisley can't be "shipped to your door" unless you have a C&R...otherwise, it would still have to be transfered through an FFL.
    It has to be a black powder gun to be considered "antique" in the sense that you guys are discussing.....not ALL pre 1898 guns qualify.
    See the ATF definition below......

    style="font-family: 'Arial'; font-size: 10pt;"Antique firearm. (a) Any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; and (b) any replica of any firearm described in paragraph (a) of this definition if such replica (1) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or (2) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.
    If it is a replica you are correct, if the receiver was manufactured pre 1899 it can be shipped sans FFL.

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    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    Is there any way to geta few peoplelicensed asFFL Dealersin D.C.? From there we could try to organize the first DC Gun show! Whoop, Whoop!!!!
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Thundar wrote:
    Is there any way to geta few peoplelicensed asFFL Dealersin D.C.? From there we could try to organize the first DC Gun show! Whoop, Whoop!!!!
    If I remember correctly, it's a crime to display a handgun in the District. I guess you could have a table covered with pictures of the guns you're selling. haha

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    I supose we could start a fund to give away revolverd in DC. No law about reciving a gift across state lines is there?

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    vinnie wrote:
    I supose we could start a fund to give away revolverd in DC. No law about reciving a gift across state lines is there?
    You still have to do the transfer through an FFL.

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    vinnie wrote:
    No law about reciving a gift across state lines is there?
    The law doesn't distinguish between gifts and sales. It's interstate transfers that are illegal unless they go through an FFL (in the resident's state, if it's a handgun).



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    IKBCraig wrote:
    vinnie wrote:
    No law about reciving a gift across state lines is there?
    The law doesn't distinguish between gifts and sales. It's interstate transfers that are illegal unless they go through an FFL (in the resident's state, if it's a handgun).

    I'm note sure that that is the case. I think that that would be stretching commerce clause a little too far.
    But thats just my opinion.

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    I can see where there may be an issue if a gun store made the gift as they would have to have paperwork, but there should beno problem if I gave a personally owned gun to a friend/family memberwho lives in another state.

    Would this not be like my father who lives in Texas giving me one of his guns and I live in Virginia?

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    Regular Member Gunslinger's Avatar
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    Regular Member Gunslinger's Avatar
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    Can't do it. Effectively, all interstate transfers for whatever reason have to be through a receiving state FFL. There is nothing that says private citizens in DC don't have FFLs, however. I would wager quite a few do.
    "For any man who sheds his blood with me this day shall be my brother...And gentlemen now abed shall think themselves accursed, they were not here, and hold their manhoods cheap whilst any speaks who fought with us on Crispin's day." Henry V

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    I'll take you up on that wager.

    http://www.wtopnews.com/?sid=1437663&nid=695

    There are only six Federal Firearms Licensees in the District. WTOP contacted all six, and found only one is considering facilitating the transfers of handguns once the law changes.
    Why open carry? Because 1911 > 911.

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    Regular Member Gunslinger's Avatar
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    AbNo wrote:
    I'll take you up on that wager.

    http://www.wtopnews.com/?sid=1437663&nid=695

    There are only six Federal Firearms Licensees in the District. WTOP contacted all six, and found only one is considering facilitating the transfers of handguns once the law changes.
    That is amazing to me. With all the military, DOD civilians, etc, you'd think there would be many. I guess they all live in Virginia...However, sounds like an opportunity for somebody.
    "For any man who sheds his blood with me this day shall be my brother...And gentlemen now abed shall think themselves accursed, they were not here, and hold their manhoods cheap whilst any speaks who fought with us on Crispin's day." Henry V

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    Regular Member Gunslinger's Avatar
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    Bill in VA wrote:
    Gunslinger wrote:
    Can't do it. Effectively, all interstate transfers for whatever reason have to be through a receiving state FFL. There is nothing that says private citizens in DC don't have FFLs, however. I would wager quite a few do.
    No such thing. Either you are a licensee or you're not (i.e., you either hold an FFL or you do not hold an FFL.)
    What I'm saying is that anyone in DC, private citizen, can apply for a FFL. The process is no different than in COS. Then, they could do business receiving/transfering for customers. At say $20-30 a pop, there would be money to be made. You can buy a gun online from any state, so long as it's shipped to a FFL. Whether a gunshop or a private party holder, it is completely legal. Then the buyer has to go thru the DC BS for registration, but handguns would be available.
    "For any man who sheds his blood with me this day shall be my brother...And gentlemen now abed shall think themselves accursed, they were not here, and hold their manhoods cheap whilst any speaks who fought with us on Crispin's day." Henry V

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    Wasn't the BATFE cracking down on FFL-holders who operated out of their homes a few years back? (For no particular reason, of course?)

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