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Thread: Had an OC encounter on the Sounder.....

  1. #1
    Regular Member compmanio365's Avatar
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    Was riding the Sounder back to Tacoma this afternoon, decided to OC. Was mostly uneventful, until we pulled into Puyallup, and I had a gentleman come up behind me and discreetly whisper to me, "You need to cover up your weapon."

    I turned around and told him, "Actually, open carry is legal in Washington, so it's perfectly legal to do what I'm doing. I have a pamphlet here I can go over with you if you want that explains it a bit better than I can, and shows you the applicable laws that says it is legal to do so." "Oh really, when did they change the RCW?" was his reply. I explained that there was no change to any RCW that I know of, but that there was preemption of all firearm laws in the Washington State Constitution, and that there is important case law that explains some of the ambiguous wording of the RCW laws that may have made him think it was illegal to OC.

    I told him to go ahead and keep the pamphlet, and to check out our website if he was interested in learning more. He said he would do that and thanked me for the pamphlet, and went back to his seat. I thought it was a great encounter, and overall, I've been pretty glad I started OCing on the Sounder (was one of those weird "I don't know if I want to OC there" places)......

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    It sounds like you conducted yourself in a pleasant, rational manner instead of a defensive one. Well done! That's exactly the kind of encounters we need to have. Even if that guy decides he's not in favor of OC or even gun ownership in general, he's walking away with a positive memory of a gun owner.

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    Regular Member just_a_car's Avatar
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    Excellent encounter Comp!

    I love OC for that very reason... informing people of the truth. They may disagree or not even like it, but at least they know the truth rather than misinformation.
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    The best part about encounters like this, is that psychologically, human beings love to eavesdrop and listen/see things we think we're not supposed to. It falls back onto people wanting what they can't have. Ergo, if you see a traffic accident or a cop pulling someone over, you get a bunch of rubbernecks slowing down I-5 just for a peek...then ten feet past the accident traffic is fine.

    What this means, is that for the one person an OC'r educates in a mature, thoughtful way, there are generally a myriad of folks around the OC'r that have already made up their minds and gone, "Honey you should go say something to that man, little Timmy is afraid of guns."

    Now, not only is the one guy with balls big enough to say anything educated, so are the people around you that thought they had you all figured out. The best part is that this happens almost every time an OC'r educates someone about the law. It's like collateral damage, but in a good way.

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    State Researcher Bill Starks's Avatar
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    compmanio365 wrote:
    Was riding the Sounder back to Tacoma this afternoon, decided to OC. Was mostly uneventful, until we pulled into Puyallup, and I had a gentleman come up behind me and discreetly whisper to me, "You need to cover up your weapon."
    <snip>
    Look at the opportunity you would have missed had you rode home with me today !!

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    Cool, great encounter!

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    Compmanio365;

    I am the man who asked you the question on the Sounder, on Monday. And, yes, your reply was polite and helpful. Obviously, I've checked out the pamphlet you gave me.

    I was an Army MP and CID Agent out of Fort Lewis until '92 and, as an agent, carried concealed all the time. I still carry concealed todaywith a CWP.

    In fact, the Maxpedition bag you saw me carrying held a Browning Hi-Power Practical in 9mm, with 3 hi-caps of Pow'rBall. I prefer to carry concealed.

    I have a blog here: http://freemendo.typepad.com/and if any of you would like to comment on the posts I've made there relative to weapons use, or any other topic, please feel free.

    Undaunted

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    Regular Member compmanio365's Avatar
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    Undaunted wrote:
    Compmanio365;

    I am the man who asked you the question on the Sounder, on Monday. And, yes, your reply was polite and helpful. Obviously, I've checked out the pamphlet you gave me.

    I was an Army MP and CID Agent out of Fort Lewis until '92 and, as an agent, carried concealed all the time. I still carry concealed todaywith a CWP.

    In fact, the Maxpedition bag you saw me carrying held a Browning Hi-Power Practical in 9mm, with 3 hi-caps of Pow'rBall. I prefer to carry concealed.

    I have a blog here: http://freemendo.typepad.com/and if any of you would like to comment on the posts I've made there relative to weapons use, or any other topic, please feel free.

    Undaunted
    Good to see you on the forum! Whether one chooses to OC, CC, or not carry at all,it's viewedas a personal choice, and as long as it is an informed one, most see no problem in that decision. I'm certainly notgoing to insist that everyone must OC, nor do I think it is the right thing for everyone......IDO feel that it is important for a person to have the capacityfor self defense at all times, no matter how it is done. And a sidearm is usually regarded as the best way to ensure the ability to defend oneself in just about all situations.

    Even though you don't OC, I hope you will stick around and see all you can, and feel free to pitch in when you feel you have something to add to the discussion at hand; it seems like you have a unique perspective to offer.

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    I tilt my hat to that gentleman…. He sounds very respectful and open minded…. Cheers mate

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    Thanks, Alwayspacking. Keep your powder dry.

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    Welcome aboard Undaunted!

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    Thank you, sir. This looks like a lively group.

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    Undaunted wrote:
    Thank you, sir. This looks like a lively group.
    It has it's moments... :P

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    Regular Member just_a_car's Avatar
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    sv_libertarian wrote:
    Undaunted wrote:
    Thank you, sir. This looks like a lively group.
    It has it's moments... :P
    LOL! That's one way to put it...

    Glad to have you aboard, sir. Make yourself at home.
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    compmanio365 wrote:
    Was riding the Sounder back to Tacoma this afternoon, decided to OC. Was mostly uneventful, until we pulled into Puyallup, and I had a gentleman come up behind me and discreetly whisper to me, "You need to cover up your weapon."
    Dude what a wus if you could not have a polite conversations with that guy you need the Doc to up your meds.......... Joking had to say it.
    Good on both of you each of you helped the public see that we gun toting red necks ain't bad folks after all. A gentleman confronts a dude with a gun and they have a polite conversation, imagine that. Better yet imagine all the office and dinner conversations about that.

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    AllCon; I have a question or two.

    Is everyone who OCs using a holster with some sort of retention device? I looked at some of the pictures and sawa fewholsters that look pretty easy to snatch a pistol from.

    What have been your experiences when confronted by the various LE agencies in different jurisdictions?

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    Undaunted wrote:
    AllCon; I have a question or two.

    Is everyone who OCs using a holster with some sort of retention device? I looked at some of the pictures and sawa fewholsters that look pretty easy to snatch a pistol from.

    What have been your experiences when confronted by the various LE agencies in different jurisdictions?
    Ahhh can o' worms time!

    IMHO opinion retention is a mainly a matter of awareness and a snug holster. I have never carried with something more than a tight fit and a strap across the top. With my new shoulder holster I am probably going to dispsense with the strap.

    If you think you are going to be wrestling with bad guys on a regular basis, or believe you will run a risk of getting jumped from behind, get the super duper, whatever is fashionable in the gun magazines 23 level plus laser shield retention holster. Otherwise get one you are most comfortable with and can quickly draw from.

    As far as LEO's... folk's encounters have gone from good "How are you doing sir? Good? Well then have a nice day!" To getting pulled out of a line in Subway without warning, cuffed and disarmed. My personal experiences have been one very chill encounter in Seattle where no names were asked, a frisk and disarming in Oly, and a gun pulled, butt chewing and disarmed in Oly. (Please note those problems here have been dealt with and there should be no more issues with OC in Oly)

    There has been a tremendous amount of effort made to help make sure agencies are on the same page with each other and the law, so I would like to think the very negative encounters are a thing of the past, but it could happen. Attitude plays a small role in how an encounter will go, as will the policies or lack thereof of the local agency and their dispatch. As always YMMV.

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    Regular Member compmanio365's Avatar
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    I would say that 99% of the people that OC do use a retention holster of one sort or another. It's just prudent. Of course, the best retention is your situational awareness, and the ability to react quickly to an attempted gun grab.

    Many people use the Serpa holster, either with Level 2 or 3 retention (the one with the extra "hood" device as well as the button), some people use a Fobus holster or Uncle Mikes, which is passive retention....I have one for my 1911 and when I had my Hi Point.......I think they do pretty well, you have to draw a certain way to get the gun out, if you don't know the right way, it's not going anywhere....if you are really worried about a gun grab,Blackhawk has a Level 4 Serpa, with a hood, button, everything........that's a beast.

    I am not that worried about it.....show me a verifiable case of an OCers gun being snatched and used against them.......then I'll start thinking I might be at risk using a passive retention device.

    I have been confronted twice by TPD, first time I had just started OCing, so I did give my license and CPL, this officer asked why I was carrying and such, she left, came back, handed back my DL/CPL, and that was it. Second time, we were taking the Link from Freighthouse Square and the supervisor on the Link had a fit, and called the police. The police showed, talked with the group of three of us, said we were good to go, and off we went. The supervisor that worked at the Link no longer is employed by Sound Transit.

    Some people have bigger issues; look at some of sv_libertarian 's posts, he has been harrassed by Olympia, as well as Mainsail, as he was harrassed by TPD on a much bigger level than I ever saw for myself. Both times we have taken the offending departments to task, and the issue has stopped.

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    Thanks, sv.

    I only mentioned take-aways because I'm not sure how many OC'rs have thought about it a/o had any instruction in that subject. Seems like something this org should stress, if it doesn't already... I'm pretty new here.

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    Thanks, comp.

    Just added a link to this very cool site to my blog.

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    I completely agree with the statement that you should be the first level retention. Being aware of your surroundings is #1. If you are always just watchful of anyone that gets to close to your strong side than it really shouldn't ever be a worry.

    As for myself, I just feel more comfortable knowing that if for some reason I am distracted or just absolutely in another world not paying attention, I have something else that is keeping an eye out for me.

    Serpa CQC for me. Nothing fancy, just a trigger button.

  22. #22
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    I used to carry a Serpa with the finger retention. I now carry a Bianchi 3-slot leather holster with a thumb strap. I've had people try to pull it out (when unloaded/cleared), and of 10 or so pulls, only ONE came out, and that was after about 5 seconds of tugging on it and just so happened to push the thumbsnap to the side...

    I'm personally not worried about it, being alert and keeping an eye/feel for your surroundings will avoid 99% of any situation anyway..
    Evangelical lessons are provided upon request. Anyone wishing to meet Jesus can just kick in my door.

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