Odd situation today while CC'ing at the mall...

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Let's keep in mind thathitting someone with a car is battery, and threatening them with a car is assault. So the woman has possibly assaulted HSMITH with the carand continues with a verbal assault after parking. Fortunately, no injuriesoccurred from the initial assault, and HSMITH acted appropriately by doing nothing.

Even given that, had she continuedher unarmed approach, I have a hard time imagining ANY situation where I would drawon her. Drawing your weapon assumes you are prepared to fire and this doesn't pass that test for me.

Even ifshe was beating on the g/f with a cane I'd likely try to pull her offinstead of brandishingand/or using a weapon. There are an awful lot ofserious consequences involved.What if it was a huge 'roid-raging male bodybuilder? What if the it was a huge 'roid-raging female bodybuilder? What if she was a little old granny?

Actually my first though was that I'd run away beforeshe got too close. I don't mess with crazy people.

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If she hit you and then verbally assaulted you, it would appear she is a thug. Society doesn't need thugs randomly assaulting and battering others.

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Unless she was a 300 pound power lifter for the Russian Olympic team with a mean unibrow I'd say even if she did approach you you were not in any real danger. Besides, I believe in equal rights for everyone. One hit and I'd take her down with a right hook.

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There sure are a lot of people around here who are willing to get into a fistfight while they are armed.

Yeah it's a woman and all, but any physical encounter is going to make it very difficult to be aware of the rest of your surroundings and keep your gun safe.

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asforme wrote:

There sure are a lot of people around here who are willing to get into a fistfight while they are armed.

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Well, thank you very much for handing ammunition to the anti-gunners.

Whose side are you on anyway?

I scanned the thread and only saw one who mentioned slugging a woman, and even then it was only in a general context regarding likely effectiveness.

For the occasional one that does show up on the forum, great. That's one of the reasonswe're here--to educate. In this case to educate new members on the fine points of self-defense, including law on self-defense.

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Citizen wrote:

asforme wrote:

There sure are a lot of people around here who are willing to get into a fistfight while they are armed.

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Well, thank you very much for handing ammunition to the anti-gunners.

Whose side are you on anyway?

I scanned the thread and only saw one who mentioned slugging a woman, and even then it was only in a general context regarding likely effectiveness.

For the occasional one that does show up on the forum, great. That's one of the reasonswe're here--to educate. In this case to educate new members on the fine points of self-defense, including law on self-defense.

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I see how you may have misunderstood me. I am not saying that people hear are aggressive or likely to start fights. I'm saying it is surprising to see so many people who are advocating a hand on hand (or OC spray, since it has similar effective range) defense while they are armed.

Despite the fact that Virginia has no duty to retreat, I will still try to as a method of deescalating the situation. But if that does not work and I am perused and someone attempts to get into a physical altercation with me, I am not willing to participate. And if that means brandishing to prevent the fight, I will. Hand to hand combat is very dangerous while armed, it is an invitation to be disarmed by the attacker or one of their associates because you will be preoccupied with the fight.

In this situation, all ended well because the woman drove off. But if she pursued and wanted to fight, unlike most of the posts I've read here, I would not have a problem drawing to prevent the fight from happening.

For illustrative purposes, here are some of the posts I'm talking about.

gsx1138 wrote:

Unless she was a 300 pound power lifter for the Russian Olympic team with a mean unibrow I'd say even if she did approach you you were not in any real danger. Besides, I believe in equal rights for everyone. One hit and I'd take her down with a right hook.

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Mechanic wrote:

Even ifshe was beating on the g/f with a cane I'd likely try to pull her offinstead of brandishingand/or using a weapon.

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TheMrMitch wrote:

You did just fine. Unless she was Wonder Womanor hada weapon, most men can roundhouse a woman and stop the threat. I don't advocate that....but.....beats drawing on her at this point.

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SouthernBoy wrote:

Good Lord, where have you been? Don't you know the femi-Nazis would have a cow if he didn't punch her senseless in response to her slapping him? After all don't those nut cases think men and women are the same and therefore should be treated exactly the same?

Flatten her then walk away. Keep the femi-Nazis happy the the PC squirrels content.

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I like to remember these words "Don't pick a fight with an old man (or woman). If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you." I say drawing your gun should be last resort only when you think your life is in danger. If she hits you then I would use hand to hand because you should already be aware of what other dangers are around you even if your focus is on the one in front or you. Situational awareness is key!

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asforme wrote:

Citizen wrote:

asforme wrote:

There sure are a lot of people around here who are willing to get into a fistfight while they are armed.

Click to expand...

Well, thank you very much for handing ammunition to the anti-gunners.

Whose side are you on anyway?

I scanned the thread and only saw one who mentioned slugging a woman, and even then it was only in a general context regarding likely effectiveness.

For the occasional one that does show up on the forum, great. That's one of the reasonswe're here--to educate. In this case to educate new members on the fine points of self-defense, including law on self-defense.

Click to expand...

I see how you may have misunderstood me. I am not saying that people hear are aggressive or likely to start fights. I'm saying it is surprising to see so many people who are advocating a hand on hand (or OC spray, since it has similar effective range) defense while they are armed.

Despite the fact that Virginia has no duty to retreat, I will still try to as a method of deescalating the situation. But if that does not work and I am perused and someone attempts to get into a physical altercation with me, I am not willing to participate. And if that means brandishing to prevent the fight, I will. Hand to hand combat is very dangerous while armed, it is an invitation to be disarmed by the attacker or one of their associates because you will be preoccupied with the fight.

In this situation, all ended well because the woman drove off. But if she pursued and wanted to fight, unlike most of the posts I've read here, I would not have a problem drawing to prevent the fight from happening.

For illustrative purposes, here are some of the posts I'm talking about.

gsx1138 wrote:

Unless she was a 300 pound power lifter for the Russian Olympic team with a mean unibrow I'd say even if she did approach you you were not in any real danger. Besides, I believe in equal rights for everyone. One hit and I'd take her down with a right hook.

Click to expand...

Mechanic wrote:

Even ifshe was beating on the g/f with a cane I'd likely try to pull her offinstead of brandishingand/or using a weapon.

Click to expand...

TheMrMitch wrote:

You did just fine. Unless she was Wonder Womanor hada weapon, most men can roundhouse a woman and stop the threat. I don't advocate that....but.....beats drawing on her at this point.

Click to expand...

SouthernBoy wrote:

Good Lord, where have you been? Don't you know the femi-Nazis would have a cow if he didn't punch her senseless in response to her slapping him? After all don't those nut cases think men and women are the same and therefore should be treated exactly the same?

Flatten her then walk away. Keep the femi-Nazis happy the the PC squirrels content.

Click to expand...

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In my defense, I trust you saw the tongue-in-cheek humor I tried to project. Would I strike a woman? Yes if the need was there, but in general.. no.

As for retreating, while Virginia has no duty to retreat, I would advise that prudence be the order of the day. If retreating a bit will save you from having to use deadly force, then retreating is the way to go. Not so much for the assailant's benefit but for your own safety since you are far more important than an individual who is of a mind to put you in such danger.

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I did understand your comment wasn't entirely serious, but you did say that if you needed to you would fight. The point I was trying to make is that for me I have 2 options. Try to escape, if I cannot, then I draw. I will not get into a fist fight while armed.

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hsmith wrote:

I was at the mall today with my lovely g/f and her sister shopping around. We procede to leave and head out to dinner with her parents.

We are walking through a pretty packed parking lot, a car pulls into a handicap spot in front of us and we keep on walking, as thinking nothing of it. The woman in the car yells out "I am backing up" as we are walking behind and backs into us. I narrowly escape and tap the trunk as she almost runs me over. She still keeps going and almost runs over my g/f who yells out "watch out" and taps the trunk as well.

Some could construe tapping the trunk as "aggression" but what else are you to do as a 4000lb object comes at you and you try to dodge the way! I've had it done to my vehicle a time or two when someone appears out of my rear I didn't see in a parking garage.

But we keep walking and ignore it - no harm no foul - one shouldn't get them selves into confrontations. The woman starts screaming expletives at us while we are walking away, all while her young 4-5 year old child is in the car with her. It goes on for 10-15 seconds as we are walking with her adding a "I will kick your ass" on the end of it.

My g/f knows better than to engage in verbal confrontations, especially now that I carry. Leading on arguments is just, as you all know, a bad situation. So we say nothing and walk to my vehicle.

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I've given this post a little more thought and have some replies I would like to add.

1) Why were you not paying attention to vehicles in the parking lot? Even after the woman verbally announced she was backing up, you still proceeded. Evidently, what you and your girlfriend were on your way to do were more important than anything or anyone else during that time. My step-sons know to watch out for cars in parking lots. They know that, chances are, the person driving is probally too busy on their cell phone, telling their other-half at home what they just bought from the store, to be concerned about anything else around them.

2) Both you and your girlfriend each "tap the trunk," to let the lady know you were behind her. She begins yelling at the two of you. You claim "no harm, no foul," however, you escalated the situation by "tapping" the trunk, whether you see it that way, or not.

3) Your girlfriend may know not to get into a verbal confrontation because you carry a gun, however, she (and you) escalated what would have been a non-event had you both been paying attention and maybe swallowed some pride by stopping for the woman who, obviously, had more important plans than you.

Not every situation NEEDS to involve a gun, but when you carry a gun every situation has a gun present. If being called a pussy and walking away, or giving a robber 200$ is what you have to pay to NOT kill somebody or to keep the police from talking to YOU, IMO, that's a decent price to pay. Like I replied prior, it's better to not get shot than it is to shoot the bad guy.

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Um, Cat, the way I read the OP, the crazy lady pulled all the way into the parking spot, so the OP and his GF proceeded to walk behind the vehicle, believing it had come to a full stop in its desired parking spot.

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Not sure on the individual State Laws, but from what I understand, at least in Arizona, a car is considered a "Deadly Instrument" and carries the same weight as assault with a deadly weapon. If she was driving her car at you, trying to hit you, she's already using deadly force, and it's safe to respond by putting a few rounds into her or her engine block.

Now as she was, from what I can tell, not driving at you except during the backup, it seems like you did the right things. I would have written down her plates though. If she was convicted of assault with a deadly instrument on multiple people, you could put her in jail for years. As a Felony, you'd also be certain this nasty creature couldn't vote or purchase a gun. Because a woman like that with a firearm is a freaking time bomb.

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KimberG19 wrote:

As a Felon, you'd also be certain this nasty creature couldn't .... .... purchase a gun.

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Except, if someone WANTS to circumvent that law, it's pretty easy to do.

I've met a couple of people that specialize in err, "serial-free weapons", if you will. :?

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It reads like the lady didn't warn about "I'm backing up" until they were already behind her, and instead of looking she just started moving. Typical Idiot Driver.

At least she warned you?

Hopefully I would have had the presence of mind to handle that situation similarly.

I've had a similar experience, just without the warning. A person was backing out of their parking spot and obviously hadn't looked. I smacked the trunklid as I moved out of the way. I swear she all but peed her pants! I just reminded her to watch out and went on my way. (At least she wasn't nasty like the OP's lady).

In the OP's case it sounds like someone has forgotten that pedestrian traffic has the right of way, pretty much always, and handled himself the best way possible.

Kudos man!

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Uh....Should one pull a gun, one must be ready to fire. Should I be in a situation where anyOTHER defensive act would allieviate the situation, including a roundhouse (not a fist fight), then I will choose the less lethal method.

I do have an advantage (?) of disparity, and will convince an adversary that to try and harm me will end up bad for them. Pull my weapon? Only to fire it.

If open carrying, draw attention to it. If CC, allow them to see it, NOT pull it.

I'm sure there are times one may pull and NOT fire, but not needed in this case. Every situation requires a different response, but one MUST strive to keep any situation non lethal. Bust their chops.