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Anyone open carry on a motorcycle in Michigan ?

M

mastiff69

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 11, 2007
Messages
573
Location
Kalamazoo, Michigan, United States
imported post

I do !! also have a CPL from michigan !! in michigan my understanding is that if you carry loaded in a car you must have a cpl, also on a motorcycle loaded cpl required.

Having a cpl covers me both ways OC/CC:D
 
Venator

Venator

Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
6,462
Location
Lansing area, Michigan, USA
imported post

nascarkent wrote:
Mastiff

The problem beeing I don't have a CPL. So I can't open carry on a motorcycle with a loaded gun? Anyone else have any info on this? Thanks
Click to expand...

This is all we can find so far on this question. Below is a hodge podge of info on this subject, that has been provided by various members. The law seems to exempt a pistol but other law deals with concealing a pistol on a motor vehicle. So it's up in the air. I suggest you contact Sgt. Deasy of the MSP at 517- 336-6441 and ask this question. He is very helpful.



750.227d Transporting or possessing firearm in or upon motor vehicle or self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel; conditions; violation as misdemeanor; penalty.
Sec. 227d.
(1) Except as otherwise permitted by law, a person shall not transport or possess in or upon a motor vehicle or any self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel a firearm, other than a pistol, unless the firearm is unloaded and is 1 or more of the following:
(a) Taken down.
(b) Enclosed in a case.
(c) Carried in the trunk of the vehicle.
(d) Inaccessible from the interior of the vehicle.
(2) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days, or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.
History: Add. 1981, Act 103, Eff. Mar. 31, 1982
© 2007 Legislative Council, State of Michigan



ORV-324.81133 Operation of ORV; prohibited acts

k) While transporting on the vehicle a bow unless unstrung or encased, or a firearm unless unloaded and securely encased, or equipped with and made inoperative by a manufactured keylocked trigger housing mechanism.

MCL 324.82126(1)(g).[/b]

• A person shall not operate a snowmobile while transporting a
firearm, unless unloaded in both barrel and magazine and securely
encased. Id.

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]Member opinion:[/font]]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]It is more difficult to say whether it is legal to carry concealed in a boat. Your CPL authorizes you to carry a concealed pistol anywhere in the state, “except as otherwise provided by law”. Michigan law, MCL 324.40111(2) states, “Except as otherwise provided in this part or in a department order authorized under section 40107, a person shall not transport or have in possession a firearm in or upon a vehicle, unless the firearm is unloaded … in a motorized boat.” [/font]]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"][/font]]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]Similar statutes outlaw the carrying of a loaded firearm in an ORV (MCL 324.81133) or in a snowmobile (MCL 324.82126(1). These statutes were designed to stop poachers][/font] from shooting game from a motor vehicle, motor boat, ORV or snowmobile. But, their terms do not limit enforcement to that situation. [/b]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"][/font]][/b]

[size=The DNR has issued a written guidance to its officers not to enforce the above statutes against anyone with a Concealed Pistol License] unless the person is using the handgun to hunt from a motor vehicle, boat, ORV or snowmobile.[/b][size=]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"][/font]]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]This has not been formalized into a “department order” so it does not control anyone but Conservation Officers. There is no such barrier for any other peace officer. A police officer or deputy sheriff could arrest you for violation of the motor vehicle, motor boat, ORV or snowmobile statute. I believe that the carry concealed statute was intended to supercede these laws. But it did not do so explicitly. Hopefully the legislature will correct these contradictions.
[/font]
]I know Brian’s OP was without CPL, however, according to the above, carrying a loaded pistol in or on car, motorcycle, boat and snowmobile, etc. is going to require a CPL. I don't see how the above can be clearer on the subject.

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]In Michigan[/font]][size= we are not going to find a law that specificallystates OC is legal in or on a boat, snowmobile.

In][size=Michigan][size=, motorcycles are considered vehicles; therefore, CPL is required to CC or OC, same as a car.]At this time the only thing we have to go by is what the DNR stated.



[size=[font="Times New Roman"]A hunting license is not required while transporting a firearm en route to or from a target, trap or skeet range, or target shooting area and there is no attempt to take game.][/font]

[size=At all times, rifles, shotguns, muzzleloading and other firearms and bows and arrows carried in or on any type of motor vehicle, including ORVs and snowmobiles][size=, must be unloaded in both barrel and magazine, and either enclosed in a case, or unstrung, or carried in the trunk of a vehicle with a trunk. [b]These rules apply whether your vehicle is parked, stopped, moving or is on private or public property[/b]. A firearm transported in a motor-propelled boat or sailboat must be unloaded in both barrel and magazine when the motor is operating or the boat is under sail and may not be loaded until the momentum of the boat has ceased. Firearms must be unloaded in the barrel, and all arrows must be in a quiver when a hunter is afield outside the legal hunting hours. Exception: These rules do not apply to pistols carried under authority of a concealed pistol license or properly carried under authority of a specific exception from the requirement of a concealed pistol license. ]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]A percussion cap muzzleloading longarm is considered unloaded if the percussion cap is removed. A flintlock muzzleloading longarm is considered unloaded if the cock is left down and the pan is open. Black powder handguns must be transported as stated above. ][/font]
 
J

Jared

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2006
Messages
892
Location
Michigan, USA
imported post

Venator wrote:
nascarkent wrote:
Mastiff

The problem beeing I don't have a CPL. So I can't open carry on a motorcycle with a loaded gun? Anyone else have any info on this? Thanks
Click to expand...

This is all we can find so far on this question. Below is a hodge podge of info on this subject, that has been provided by various members. The law seems to exempt a pistol but other law deals with concealing a pistol on a motor vehicle. So it's up in the air. I suggest you contact Sgt. Deasy of the MSP at 517- 336-6441 and ask this question. He is very helpful.



750.227d Transporting or possessing firearm in or upon motor vehicle or self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel; conditions; violation as misdemeanor; penalty.
Sec. 227d.
(1) Except as otherwise permitted by law, a person shall not transport or possess in or upon a motor vehicle or any self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel a firearm, other than a pistol, unless the firearm is unloaded and is 1 or more of the following:
(a) Taken down.
(b) Enclosed in a case.
(c) Carried in the trunk of the vehicle.
(d) Inaccessible from the interior of the vehicle.
(2) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days, or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.
History: Add. 1981, Act 103, Eff. Mar. 31, 1982
© 2007 Legislative Council, State of Michigan



ORV-324.81133 Operation of ORV; prohibited acts

k) While transporting on the vehicle a bow unless unstrung or encased, or a firearm unless unloaded and securely encased, or equipped with and made inoperative by a manufactured keylocked trigger housing mechanism.

MCL 324.82126(1)(g).[/b]

• A person shall not operate a snowmobile while transporting a
firearm, unless unloaded in both barrel and magazine and securely
encased. Id.

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]Member opinion:[/font]]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]It is more difficult to say whether it is legal to carry concealed in a boat. Your CPL authorizes you to carry a concealed pistol anywhere in the state, “except as otherwise provided by law”. Michigan law, MCL 324.40111(2) states, “Except as otherwise provided in this part or in a department order authorized under section 40107, a person shall not transport or have in possession a firearm in or upon a vehicle, unless the firearm is unloaded … in a motorized boat.” [/font]]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"][/font]]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]Similar statutes outlaw the carrying of a loaded firearm in an ORV (MCL 324.81133) or in a snowmobile (MCL 324.82126(1). These statutes were designed to stop poachers][/font] from shooting game from a motor vehicle, motor boat, ORV or snowmobile. But, their terms do not limit enforcement to that situation. [/b]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"][/font]][/b]

[size=The DNR has issued a written guidance to its officers not to enforce the above statutes against anyone with a Concealed Pistol License] unless the person is using the handgun to hunt from a motor vehicle, boat, ORV or snowmobile.[/b][size=]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"][/font]]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]This has not been formalized into a “department order” so it does not control anyone but Conservation Officers. There is no such barrier for any other peace officer. A police officer or deputy sheriff could arrest you for violation of the motor vehicle, motor boat, ORV or snowmobile statute. I believe that the carry concealed statute was intended to supercede these laws. But it did not do so explicitly. Hopefully the legislature will correct these contradictions.
[/font]
]I know Brian’s OP was without CPL, however, according to the above, carrying a loaded pistol in or on car, motorcycle, boat and snowmobile, etc. is going to require a CPL. I don't see how the above can be clearer on the subject.

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]In Michigan[/font]][size= we are not going to find a law that specificallystates OC is legal in or on a boat, snowmobile.

In][size=Michigan][size=, motorcycles are considered vehicles; therefore, CPL is required to CC or OC, same as a car.]At this time the only thing we have to go by is what the DNR stated.



[size=[font="Times New Roman"]A hunting license is not required while transporting a firearm en route to or from a target, trap or skeet range, or target shooting area and there is no attempt to take game.][/font]

[size=At all times, rifles, shotguns, muzzleloading and other firearms and bows and arrows carried in or on any type of motor vehicle, including ORVs and snowmobiles][size=, must be unloaded in both barrel and magazine, and either enclosed in a case, or unstrung, or carried in the trunk of a vehicle with a trunk. [b]These rules apply whether your vehicle is parked, stopped, moving or is on private or public property[/b]. A firearm transported in a motor-propelled boat or sailboat must be unloaded in both barrel and magazine when the motor is operating or the boat is under sail and may not be loaded until the momentum of the boat has ceased. Firearms must be unloaded in the barrel, and all arrows must be in a quiver when a hunter is afield outside the legal hunting hours. Exception: These rules do not apply to pistols carried under authority of a concealed pistol license or properly carried under authority of a specific exception from the requirement of a concealed pistol license. ]

[size=[font="Times New Roman"]A percussion cap muzzleloading longarm is considered unloaded if the percussion cap is removed. A flintlock muzzleloading longarm is considered unloaded if the cock is left down and the pan is open. Black powder handguns must be transported as stated above. ][/font]
Click to expand...
Any idea if a bicycle would count as a "self propelled vehicle"? I don't think it would but I want to make sure.
 
L

lapeer20m

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
928
Location
Near Lapeer (Hadley), Michigan, USA
I have oc'd thousands of miles on a motorcycle (with cpl) and only had one negative encounter.

we have beat this horse to death.

best advice is to not ride a motorcycle without cpl. the cost of a felony conviction is too great.

however, it is probably legal as the pistol would not be "in the vehicle"

Apples and oranges: The court said in a case involving a previously convicted felon transporting a pistol concealed under the seat/gas tank of his motorcycle was in violation of the statute as the pistol was "within the area" of the motorcycle. Area is a geography term. If you calculate the area of a triangle you would not count any of the space outside of the triangle.

example:
pistol within the area of a triangle:
pistol+in+a+triangle.png


pistol NOT within the area of a triangle:

pistol+not+in+a+triangle.png


pistol not within the area of a motorcycle
pistol+not+within+a+motorcycle.png


pistol within the area of a motorcycle
pistol+within+a+motorcycle.png


i am pretty adventurous and i would not attempt it without cpl. If you oc on motorcycle and get in trouble, please select an excellent attorney, like Dean Greanblatt so we enhance our chances of having case law in our favor on this subject.
 
Last edited:
S

soldier

New member
Joined
Aug 17, 2010
Messages
2
Location
SALEM MI
nascarkent said:
Mastiff

The problem beeing I don't have a CPL. So I can't open carry on a motorcycle with a loaded gun? Anyone else have any info on this? Thanks
Click to expand...

I just Got off the phone with Michigan State Police (MSP) From MSP is that the law that they have is unclear the way that it writen. It can be argued both ways. It's in legislation now to make it more clear for Us and For the Police. So if you want to take on the challenge. You would probably win. (not quoted by MSP) If You dare call and talk to somebody from the NRA so they can help.:mad:
 
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