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After protesting gun rule, Disney guard is fired

Prophet

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Unclebuck wrote:
Wow this guy put his 13 year career on the line over this issue. To much for him to go about his business and just keep a gun in his car and not tell anybody. I have zero sympathy for him.

Hope his wife has a job with benefits. I disagree with Disney, but I also tend not to @#$% where I eat. Even my dog knows that.

Some people may just think things like doing the right thing, liberty and not being ashamed of either is worth the price. If more people were willing to take a stand and face the hazzards...instead of hiding in dark places and being free only when it is without cost or inconviencience like you portend to do Unclebuck, maybe these situations would go the way of the dodo.
 

Chkultr

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Unclebuck wrote:
Wow this guy put his 13 year career on the line over this issue. To much for him to go about his business and just keep a gun in his car and not tell anybody. I have zero sympathy for him.

Hope his wife has a job with benefits. I disagree with Disney, but I also tend not to @#$% where I eat. Even my dog knows that.
I feel pretty much the same way! Apparently he can't keep his mouth shut!!!! So just going about his business without letting some of his co workers know he was carrying in his vehicle is not an option... What they don't know won't hurt.

I have a friend or two that are cast members....I asked how often they really search your vehicle on a random basis? Very rare is the answer I got...

By the way....Sea World is allowing employees to leave em in the car and they have a fireworks permit also! Surprise since it is AB.
 

Pointman

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Unclebuck wrote:
<his opinion>
After protesting gun rule, Disney guard is fired
--
So, I wonder what he guarded "guests" with, in order to protect them in the Disney Disarmament Zone :: "Stop right there, or two 'toons 'll drop a safe on ya!"
 

thorvaldr

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So he should just sit down, shut up and drink the kool aid? "Give me liberty or ... or not I guess" Thanks, Unclebuck

But seriously, I don't think that he's done the right thing here and I don't think he'll end up having a lot of legal recourse to fight his termination. I hope his wife has a job with benefits, I hope his union goes to bat for him, and I hope the state of Florida will find some way to establish that the rule of law counts on Disney property, too.

For now all we can do is hope for the best and BOYCOTT DISNEY
 

imperialism2024

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kenny wrote:
imperialism2024 wrote:
kenny wrote:
What some people do not know is that Disney aka Reedy Creek Improvement District is their own government. They have their own executive and legislative forms of government. They rule by Dictatorship so they have no need for a judicial branch. Everyone not just the folks in Florida need to stand up and pay attention to this.
Explain more (and cite), please? I was wondering about "Disney's claim of an exemption to the new law"...
Google it and you will find your answers. To many it is common knowledge, sorry the word had not made it to you. The Internet is a wonderful if you only learn how to use it.
If you'll take a look at the second and third sentences in my post, you'll see that my questioning is in reference to whether or not this autonomous government is what provides the "exemption"... but the following post indicates that they may be hiding behind the "fireworks" exemption.
 

PT111

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News from OCSO Media Relations
Sheriff’s deputies did not request to search employee’s car for weapons


[align=center][/align]

[align=center]News reports stating or implying deputies requested search were inaccurate[/align]
On Friday, July 4[suP]th[/suP] the Orange County Sheriff’s Office responded to a standby call at Walt Disney World in reference to a Disney employee who was believed to be transporting a gun in the trunk of his car on Disney property. Deputies responded to the call for service and upon arrival, at the request of Walt Disney World management, issued a trespass warning to Edwin Sotmayor.



During an evening newscast a reporter from WKMG TV-6 incorrectly reported that Orange County Deputies “asked to search the car of Edwin Sotomayor.” A reporter covering the same story for WESH TV-2 stated, “They asked him if they could search his vehicle, and when he refused, he was suspended and banned from the property,” implying that Sheriff’s deputies made a request to search Sotomayor’s vehicle.



At no point did a deputy sheriff request to search Mr. Sotomayor’s vehicle. Deputies were called to the scene by Disney management personnel to maintain order and to issue a formal trespass warning to Mr. Sotomayor at their request.

http://www.ocins.com/
 

Citizen

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Unclebuck wrote:
Wow this guy put his 13 year career on the line over this issue. To much for him to go about his business and just keep a gun in his car and not tell anybody. I have zero sympathy for him.

Hope his wife has a job with benefits. I disagree with Disney, but I also tend not to @#$% where I eat. Even my dog knows that.

I know a guy who quit his job because his employer started working on something to do with nuclear weapons after he was already employed. He felt so strongly against nuclear weapons that he resigned.

Principle.

I'm sure Mr. Sotmayor worked out his options and planned his budget before doing this.
 

Pointman

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Contents:
-
Article
-
Complaint to the Attorney General
- Disney's original memo (edited to remove personal information)


Snipped from:
-
http://www.local6.com/news/16777761/detail.html?rss=orlpn&psp=news
- http://deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,700241675,00.html
- http://www.wmbb.com/gulfcoastwest/mbb/special_sections/advisory_council_jackson.apx.-content-articles-MBB-2008-07-08-0006.html

Before the law went into effect this week, Walt Disney World e-mailed its employees and said because it stores huge amounts of fireworks on the property, they are exempt and do not have to let workers with concealed weapons [permits] keep the guns locked in their cars.

The NRA responded to Disney on its Web site: "Disney is a prime offender when it comes to firing employees for exercising Second Amendment rights. There has never been any intention to exempt any part of Disney from the new law. We thought you'd like to see such arrogance."

There is an exemption in the new law for companies with explosives permits, however, Republican leaders said they never intended to exempt Disney -- which is Florida's largest private employer.

Edwin Sotomayor, 36, was fired Monday after refusing to let security managers at Disney's Animal Kingdom in Orlando search his car when he arrived for work on July 4. Earlier in the week, he had alerted the media that he would bring a gun onto Disney's property to protest its "ridiculous" stance that the company is exempt from a new law letting employees with permits keep guns in their locked cars, he said in an interview.

"He would not confirm or deny he had a weapon in his vehicle," Disney spokeswoman Zoraya Suarez said Tuesday. "He refused to allow a search of his vehicle. He was terminated for a violation of company policies, including failure to cooperate with an investigation."

Suarez said Disney, which operates theme parks and resorts in the Orlando area, is exempt from the new gun law because it stores fireworks. The law, enacted on July 1, doesn't apply to schools, jails and nuclear power plants or employers in national defense, aerospace, homeland security and explosives manufacturing and storage. "The exemption is clear," she said. "The safety of our guests is our top priority, and we don't want it compromised."

Supporters of the law say it protects a citizen's constitutional right to bear arms. The Florida Retail Federation and the state's Chamber of Commerce sued in federal court to strike it down, saying it exposes employees and customers to "physical harm and death." A judge is expected to rule later this month.

Sotomayor, who made $15.13 an hour, said he refused to let the managers see the Springfield XD .45-caliber gun that he brought in a box in the trunk of his white Chevy Impala. He said he'd never before brought a gun to work. "They said, 'We need to see your car,"' he said. "I said, 'No, the law says you cannot look into my car.' They asked me one question, 'Do you have a weapon in your car?' I said 'Maybe, maybe not. I cannot confirm or deny your question. Both possibilities are there."'

A native of the Bronx, New York, who was raised in Puerto Rico, he said that Disney's Animal Kingdom is "very safe." He said he was concerned for his safety on his 23-mile commute to work because of rising crime in central Florida.

The Florida Attorney General's office is receiving complaints against Walt Disney World for the firing, and is evaluating how to respond. The attorney general is responsible for enforcing the law. Spokeswoman Sandi Copes says the office will resolve the complaints on a case-by-case basis.

One complaint from Louis Berding, who says he works for Disney, accuses the theme park of using a legal loophole to take away his 2nd Amendment rights. Berding writes that he should be able to protect himself traveling to and from work.

Marion Hammer of the National Rifle Association argues the exemption does not cover Disney and calls their reading of the law "ludicrous."

Copes says the attorney general's office is encouraging anyone with a complaint about the law to contact the office. The hot line number is: 866-966-7226 or you can file an online complaint at http://myfloridalegal.com/contact.nsf/contact. (See my complaint below.)

At one of the e-mails received by the attorney general supports Disney's decision to ban guns in its parking lots. Stefan Lowry of Indiatlantic writes that he would not want to take his family to Disney anymore if the park were to allow employees to have guns in their cars. Lowry says all it takes is one employee to snap and go on a rampage. He apparently believes all employees will abide by Disney's policy, but not Florida's laws against murder.

Many blogs and websites are prompting people to boycott Disney completely.

----------

Sent to http://myfloridalegal.com/contact.nsf/contacton 7/10/2008


References:

HOUSE AMENDMENT Bill No. CS/HB 503: http://www.myfloridahouse.gov/Sections/Documents/loaddoc.aspx?

BILL APPROVAL/EFFECTIVE DATE: http://www.myfloridahouse.gov/Sections/Bills/billsdetail.aspx?BillId=37914

FLORIDA STATUTE 790.25: http://www.myfloridahouse.gov/FileStores/Web/Statutes/FS07/CH0790/Section_0790.25.HTM




Subject: Disney Gun Ban

STATEMENT:

1.) Walt Disney World banned employees from legally possessing firearms on most company property, claiming exemption from Florida law created by CS/HB-503 in a memo dated June 27, 2008.

2.) Walt Disney World has fired an employee, Edwin Sotomayor, on July 7, after questioning him about legally storing a firearm in his vehicle parked on a Disney parking lot.

COMPLAINT:

Both actions (1) and (2) violate Florida Statute Title XLVI Chapter 790.251(4)(a), which specifically prohibits an employer from prohibiting an employee from possessing any legally owned firearm lawfully possessed & locked inside a private motor vehicle in a parking lot.

Action (2) violates 790.251(4)(b), which specifically prohibits an employer from taking action against an employee without due process of law.

Action (2) violates 790.251(4)(e), which specifically prohibits an employer from terminating an employee for legally storing a firearm.

RESOLUTION:

Per 790.251(6), I request the Attorney General enforce the protections afforded under 790.251 by commencing an investigation against Walt Disney World for cited actions (1) and (2), as the exemption 790.251(7)(e) does not apply to Walt Disney World, as Disney's primary business is not the use, storage, or transportation of explosive materials.

----------

Original Memo:

From: WDW NewsRoom

To: #WDW X Corporate Executive Cast - Florida; #WDW X Walt Disney Parks and Resorts Vice Presidents; #WDW X Walt Disney Parks and Resorts

Directors; #WDW X Walt Disney Parks and Resorts General Managers

Sent: Fri Jun 27 XXXXXXX 2008

Subject: Florida's Guns-At-Work Legislation

Below is a memo regarding the Florida Guns-at-Work law, effective July 1, 2008. Please share verbally with your teams, as appropriate.

*********************************************

To: Florida-site Executives Date: June 27, 2008

From: Shannon McAleavey,

Senior Vice President Public Affairs

Subject: Florida's Guns-at-Work Legislation




*********************************************

On July 1, a new Florida law will go into effect that will allow employees with a conceal-and-carry permit to have a weapon in their vehicle at their place of employment. This law does not apply to Walt Disney World Co. owned and leased properties due to an exemption.

This includes all theme parks, resorts, theme park and resort parking lots, Cast Member parking lots, administrative offices across the Walt Disney World(r) Resort, Downtown Disney(r), Disney's Wide World of Sports Complex, hotels on Hotel Plaza Boulevard, Celebration and the Disney Reservation Centers (Orlando and Tampa).

However, the law will apply to property owned by Reedy Creek Improvement District, Disney's Vero Beach Resort, the Disney Cruise Line Crew Member parking lot, the La Quinta warehouse on Orange Blossom Trail and Disney-owned liquidation stores off property.

Because this is a Florida law, it also does not apply to Disney's Hilton Head Island Resort.

Cast Members will continue to be prohibited from removing a weapon from their vehicle while at work. All Cast Members must comply with the gun policies in effect at the location they are visiting, regardless of where they work. For example, Disney's Vero Beach Cast Members must comply with the gun policies at a Walt Disney World Co. theme park when visiting that location.

Walt Disney World Co. continues to maintain a zero tolerance policy for guns and workplace violence. Possession of dangerous or unauthorized materials such as explosives, firearms, ammunition, weapons or other similar items on Walt Disney World Co. owned or leased property is grounds for termination (as outlined in the Employee Policy Manual).

A lawsuit filed by the Florida Chamber of Commerce and Florida Retail Federation to repeal the law is under review, and we are hopeful it will be overturned by mid-July. We support the ongoing efforts of the Florida Chamber of Commerce and the Florida Retail Federation to challenge the legislation.

The safety of our Cast and Guests is our top priority. Please encourage your teams to practice safe behaviors at any location. In an emergency, Cast Members should dial 911. If a gun is seen or suspected to be at any location, Cast Members should immediately contact their local Human Resources representative or Walt Disney World Security at x1990 or 407-560-1990.

Thanks for your support in verbally sharing this information with your teams. I will update you when a final ruling is made in the lawsuit.

[end memo]

----------
 

crotalus01

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Wow did this guy screw the pooch. I agree in principal what he did, but he is so screwed its not even funny. Problems I see with his case:

1) Florida is a right to work state meaning an employee can quit for any or no reason, and an employer can terminate for any or no reason.

2) He likelywas terminated for breech of contract by not allowing a search of his vehicle - I can almostguarantee you it will be in the willful employment contract Disney will produce in court. He would have done better if he had allowed the search revealing the gun since he likely would have been terminated on the spotIMHO.

3) He made a prior announcement to the media, alerting his supervisors as to his intentions (the potential jury will note this). Better he just "got caught" with a gun in his car (loose lips would have done better than a media announcement IMHO).

I hope very much that he wins his case but I just don't see it. As for Disney and their safety concerns for their guests....:banghead::banghead::banghead:
 

crotalus01

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I did read your entire post Pointman, and I hope like hell I am wrong and Disney gets their A$$ handed to them.

Biggest problem to me still being he refused to allow the search of his vehicle which would be grounds for his termination under the contract he signed when he accepted employment from them (also FL is a right to work state).

Again, I really hope I am wrong and the AG eats Disneysa$$ alive
 

Prometheus

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Bogus law IMO.

Private property Rights are whats at issue here. Does a private property owner have the right to bar you from the property? If so they have a right to limit what you can bring onto that property. PERIOD.

I think disney sucks for not allowing their employees to keep a gun in the car, but it is disneys RIGHT to have that rule.

The sheer ignorance being shown as to Rights here is astounding. You have no right to work at disney. You choose to work at disney you choose to enter a victim disarmament zone. Plain and simple. Don't like it? get another job.

If gun owners would start respecting everyones rights and stop supporting anti-gun businesses the free market would take care of this.

Instead of pushing for laws that violates peoples rights, lets start passing laws that RESTORE peoples rights.

Nation wide carry, no permits, no licenses. Carry in parks, forests, libraries... anything owned by the government (except secure detention facilities).

This big brother crap because gun owners can't put their money where there mouth is and shop/work/visit some place else has got to stop.
 

AbNo

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Prometheus wrote:
Private property Rights are whats at issue here.  Does a private property owner have the right to bar you from the property?  If so they have a right to limit what you can bring onto that property. PERIOD.

I think disney sucks for not allowing their employees to keep a gun in the car, but it is disneys RIGHT to have that rule.

Actually, the only reason Disney is covered under that storage of explosives rule is because it is poorly worded.

In other words, they are following the letter, not the spirit of the law.
 

Prometheus

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You AbNo wrote:
Prometheus wrote:
Private property Rights are whats at issue here. Does a private property owner have the right to bar you from the property? If so they have a right to limit what you can bring onto that property. PERIOD.

I think disney sucks for not allowing their employees to keep a gun in the car, but it is disneys RIGHT to have that rule.

Actually, the only reason Disney is covered under that storage of explosives rule is because it is poorly worded.

In other words, they are following the letter, not the spirit of the law.
You totally missed the point. The law is a violation of private property rights. I could care less what ridiculous loophole disney is claiming. This goes back to my comment about gun owners being "ignorant of rights". There is more than one right.

I still think this law will be stuck down by the Florida supreme court.

It SHOULD be stuck down because it is a blatant violation of private property rights.

It WILL be struck down because the liberals on the court will seize this opportunity to use it to bash actual gun rights rather than re-affirm private property rights.

Lose-Lose situation.
 

Kevin Jensen

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AbNo wrote:
Actually, the only reason Disney is covered under that storage of explosives rule is because it is poorly worded.

In other words, they are following the letter, not the spirit of the law.
I don't think so. Here is that wording.

(e) Property owned or leased by a public or private employer or the landlord of a public or private employer upon which the primary business conducted is the manufacture, use, storage, or transportation of combustible or explosive materials regulated under state or federal law, or property owned or leased by an employer who has obtained a permit required under 18 U.S.C. s. 842 to engage in the business of importing, manufacturing, or dealing in explosive materials on such property.
Explosives is not their primary business, raking in cash is.
 

Boomer654

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OK... I've read all of the posts and I've got to tell you... it's a dumb rule to disallow cast members, (who don't have ready access to their vehicle while working) from storing a firearm there so they can legally carry to and from work. "Oh... Billy might take a half hour to get to his car, take another half hour to get back here and then shoot everybody".The cast parking lots are way the hell and gone away from the guest areas and the employees travel back and forth by shuttle. Hell... he could gohome and get a gun in a like amount of time. Plus, I can't count how many times I've carried concealed on Disney property as a guest. On my early visits I even carried in the parks due to no safe in the hotel room we were staying in, and reluctance to leave a pistol in my car. The whole "we're concerned for guest safety" argument is Bovine Scatology.:banghead:
 
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