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VA State Police Response to Post Office Carry...

Sheriff

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Bubba Ron wrote:
You are wellinside the Post Office on Lynnhaven Pkwy and Viking Drive (in Virginia Beach) when you see the no guns sign - it's on the door going into the Passport office (at the farend of the service line) - that can be a sticky situation!!!!

Still not a defense though.

You know the ole "ignorance of the law" routine...... :shock:
 

Repeater

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ProShooter wrote:
Actually, as I read the law, the post office is fine but no one of authority will admit to that.
From Eugene Volokh, More on Guns in Post Office Parking Lots

Monday, the magistrate judge in U.S. v. Dorosan, which I blogged abouthere issued a further opinion, including this on the Second Amendment question (which is whether the federal government could criminalize the bringing of guns onto post office property, including leaving them in a car parked in the parking lot):

As previously addressed in this Court's prior opinion, the postal regulation at issue (39 C.F.R. § 232.1(l)) passes Second Amendment constitutional muster and is reasonable as applied to Dorosan. The Government has a significant interest in protecting the integrity of the purposes to which it has dedicated the property (facilitating postal transactions) and ensuring the security of postal employees and the public who must: (1) visit postal property to conduct official and personal business; (2) wait single file in roped off lines inside of postal facilities; (3) idle in vehicles single file in "snorkel lanes" 21 on postal property to use "drive and drop" mail receptacles placed outside of the Post Office building; and (4) carry cash or other legal tender for stamps, money orders, passports and other goods and services provided by the United States Postal Service.

Noting the fact that there were no signs prominently displayed outside of the Gretna Post Office building publishing the regulation's prohibition against carrying firearms (§ 232.1(l)) or animals (§ 232.1(j)) on "postal property," the defendant argued that the statute was vague, overly broad and unconstitutional as applied to the defendant. More particularly, defense counsel suggested that the regulation effectively outlaws conduct including matriculating the drop box lane in a vehicle with either a firearm or an animal safely stowed within its confines. The undersigned Magistrate Judge expresses no opinion whatsoever as to the constitutionality of regulation's ban on carrying firearms or animals in public areas without official purpose -- i.e., operating a vehicle through the "snorkel lane" of the Gretna Post Office while accompanied by a pet Shih Tzu, other non-seeing eye dog or, perhaps, armed with a loaded handgun stowed in the glove compartment. Neither of those issues are before the Court in this case, which involves the prohibited conduct of carrying and storing firearms without official purpose in the gated/restricted access employee parking, loading and unloading area of the subject "postal property."
 

ProShooter

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Section 930. Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facilities
Code:
Section 930. Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facilities 
(a) Except as provided in subsection (d), whoever knowingly
possesses or causes to be present a firearm or other dangerous
weapon in a Federal facility (other than a Federal court facility),
or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned
not more than 1 year, or both.
(b) Whoever, with intent that a firearm or other dangerous weapon
be used in the commission of a crime, knowingly possesses or causes
to be present such firearm or dangerous weapon in a Federal
facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or
imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both.
(c) A person who kills any person in the course of a violation of
subsection (a) or (b), or in the course of an attack on a Federal
facility involving the use of a firearm or other dangerous weapon,
or attempts or conspires to do such an act, shall be punished as
provided in sections 1111, 1112, 1113, and 1117.
(d) Subsection (a) shall not apply to - 
(1) the lawful performance of official duties by an officer,
agent, or employee of the United States, a State, or a political
subdivision thereof, who is authorized by law to engage in or
supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or
prosecution of any violation of law;
(2) the possession of a firearm or other dangerous weapon by a
Federal official or a member of the Armed Forces if such
possession is authorized by law; or
(3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons
in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful
purposes.

(e)(1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), whoever knowingly
possesses or causes to be present a firearm in a Federal court
facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title,
imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.
(2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to conduct which is described
in paragraph (1) or (2) of subsection (d).
(f) Nothing in this section limits the power of a court of the
United States to punish for contempt or to promulgate rules or
orders regulating, restricting, or prohibiting the possession of
weapons within any building housing such court or any of its
proceedings, or upon any grounds appurtenant to such building.
(g) As used in this section:
(1) The term "Federal facility" means a building or part
thereof owned or leased by the Federal Government, where Federal
employees are regularly present for the purpose of performing
their official duties.
(2) The term "dangerous weapon" means a weapon, device,
instrument, material, or substance, animate or inanimate, that is
used for, or is readily capable of, causing death or serious
bodily injury, except that such term does not include a pocket
knife with a blade of less than 2 1/2 inches in length.
(3) The term "Federal court facility" means the courtroom,
judges' chambers, witness rooms, jury deliberation rooms,
attorney conference rooms, prisoner holding cells, offices of the
court clerks, the United States attorney, and the United States
marshal, probation and parole offices, and adjoining corridors of
any court of the United States.

(h) Notice of the provisions of subsections (a) and (b) shall be
posted conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal
facility, and notice of subsection (e) shall be posted
conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal court
facility, and no person shall be convicted of an offense under
subsection (a) or (e) with respect to a Federal facility if such
notice is not so posted at such facility, unless such person had
actual notice of subsection (a) or (e), as the case may be.
Code:
I cant see how anyone, judge, citizen, lawyer, could argue with the "lawful carrying of a firearm in a Federal facility incident to another lawful purpose", like mailing a letter or buying stamps.

Not sure why this keeps coming up in green and my highlights are not working, but you get the point....
 

sccrref

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ProShooter wrote:
Not to hijack the thread, but if his interpretation is correct, then one could carry onto a military base as long as they were there for a legal purpose. i.e. their job. I definitely would not want to be the test case for this on a base or the post office. I do not have the resources to do so. It would be great if this were the case and you could carry on bases, post offices etc.
 

joeamt

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Jun 4, 2008
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Cape Cod, MA

Tomahawk

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joeamt wrote:
ProShooter wrote:
I have always OC's at the Dumfries USPS and have never been challanged. The last time I was there was yesterday! Not even the employees said anything. I have been to that USPS at least a dozen times OC, and once, there was a state trooper car in the lot.
Sounds like you're going to be the test case.
 

joeamt

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Cape Cod, MA
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Tomahawk wrote:
joeamt wrote:
ProShooter wrote:
I have always OC's at the Dumfries USPS and have never been challanged. The last time I was there was yesterday! Not even the employees said anything. I have been to that USPS at least a dozen times OC, and once, there was a state trooper car in the lot.
Sounds like you're going to be the test case.
I will probably continue to OC to the post office. We shall see.. I think I will go buy stamps Monday! :celebrate
 

Bubba Ron

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Virginia Beach, , USA
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sccrref wrote:
ProShooter wrote:
Not to hijack the thread, but if his interpretation is correct, then one could carry onto a military base as long as they were there for a legal purpose. i.e. their job.....
....or even going to the base exchange or commissary - which would be a huge improvement!!!!
 

ProShooter

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joeamt wrote:
ProShooter wrote:
I have always OC's at the Dumfries USPS and have never been challanged. The last time I was there was yesterday! Not even the employees said anything. I have been to that USPS at least a dozen times OC, and once, there was a state trooper car in the lot.

Sounds like I'm not the only loon who thinks that its ok to carry at the Post Office.

Well done joeamt !
 

taurusfan

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Richmond, ,
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Just as everywhere else I'm not going to leave my gun in the car we all know the reputation of postal workers.;)

Be happy in your work!
 

joeamt

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Cape Cod, MA
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glockfan wrote:
Just as everywhere else I'm not going to leave my gun in the car we all know the reputation of postal workers.;)

Be happy in your work!
LOL! :lol:That's the spirit!
 
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