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  1. #1
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    We just got home, so I thought I would add this while it is fresh, yet a bit tired so please forgive my lack of spelling.


    My wife works at the Big B on second shift, and tonight I had to pick her up and drop of 2 of our kiddies to there mom for there weekend visit. Our third child, my wife and I decided to pay a visit to my folks who also work second shift at the Big B. We arrived at there apartment that is close to back side of Boeing in Everett and did the normal socializing.

    Around 2am we were getting our things gathered to leave when we heard a loud screach from outside, the sound of a car slamming on the brakes and leaving a nice 50+ foot patch of black on the road. My folks live in a second floor apartment with a wrap around balcony so all of us headed out to it to see WTF was going on. We got to the balcony and didn't see a thing.

    A few moments later we noticed a car pulling into the small parking lot between my Folks building and another and this car was being driven quite eratic almost sideswiping 3-4 other cars that were parked, the car was then turned and driven into a stall and they almost hit a truck in the next stall only swerving with a quick jerk at the last second. The car was parked then, this parking spot just happens to be directly below my Folks balcony.

    We saw allot of movement from inside the car and it was rocking back and forth, at one point I swear it had hydrolics as it looked like it lept in the air a bit :shock: We started hearing some comotion and realized the movments inside looked like a fight was breaking out. At this point I told my Dad to dial 911 and I headed for the door, my folks told me to not go out but I wasn't going to sit and do nothing. About the same time I hit the door my wife screamed it was a guy beating on a gal.....

    I hit mach 5 down the hall and flew down the stairs at this point. I hit the street and rounded the corner to the side of the building that this little parking lot is located. As soon as I rounded the corner I got full view of a man ontop of a woman who was in the passenger seat in full swings. He was litteraly ontop of her giving her a beatdown as she was trying to get out of the car, he was also keeping her from exiting the car. As I aproached closer now about 2 stalls away this fight was not getting any lesser and she was now screaming for help even louder.......

    Now I will get into what I did next, but I will say flat out I DO NOT regret what I did, nore does my wife or folks or the Gal that was getting beat. I have even heard back from her about an hour ago with her thanking me for what I did.


    When I saw this fellow(a 26 year old male) ontop of this Gal whaling on her I had Fear for her life and safety. My instinks took over and I drew my firearm and instantly began yelling at him as I further aproached the vehicle. I yelled "Get the **** off her and Get the **** out of the car" At this point her door was open a few inches and she was clawing her way out of it with him still beating on her and ontop of her. When I said my first line she made eye contact ewith me and began pleading for help from me, he had not noticed me at this time. I repeated exactly what I had said another 2 times before he lifted his head and stopped his attack and noticed me.


    When he noticed me and stoped what he was doing he got off her and sat back down in the drivers seat. What I remember the most is front sight and him, I could see everything he was doing as if it was the sunniest of days. He sat in the drivers seat for a few moments and then started fumbling at the key in the ignition. I again yelled my command to "get the **** out of the vehicle" At this time the Gal was already out and made it the 5 feet to me and had colapsed at my feet. He exited the vehicle with his hands at about a 45deg angle and palms facing me(sorta a hands up but not quite) he stood facing me for a second and then began to walk backwards twords the rear of the car, I was at the front passenger side. he then proceded to move along the back side of the car and kept moving away keeping his body square to me and his hands in plain view palms facing me(kinda strange)


    At this point my wife had cought up to me and started yelling for him to get down, my Dad had come down the stairs on the other side of the building and came out on the other side of the car/s and headed for him at witch point he took off running, with my dad in pursuit. My dad lost him not to far off, he is an older gentleman and couldn't keep up with the younger attacker.

    This entire time my wife was on the phone with 911. She let them know I am a CPL holder and was OCin and what I had done.

    As soon as he was away I reholstered keeping an eye out and comforting the Gal. She was pretty shaken and histerical at this time. I will also add she was a bit on the not so sober side. We took her into the open of the parking lot and sat her down on a curb and I sat there with her comforting her until the police arrived. I managed to get her calmed down quite a bit. I would say it was a long 4-5 minutes from the time this started till the police arrived, but it was a good minute into it before my wife got the phone and dialed 911.

    My only thought through this entire incident was for the Gals safety, what happened to him was no concern to me other then getting his ass off of her and getting her safe. At no time did I even consider running after him and was not leaving her side until the police arrived, but I did keep him in mind incase he returned.

    My wife had told the 911 operator I had a firearm, when the first police officer arrived she emidiatly made it clear to him that I was armed before he aproached me and the victim(sitting with the victim in a non threatening way) At no time did any of the officers even mention or agnolage the fact I was armed and OCin. The 2 officers I talked with were very proffesional and have my utmost respect, one even drove her home after being treated by the medics and refusing to be transported to the hospital, she was a reluctant witnsess but did provide some info on the guy.


    Now a few things about this incident, Some asshat from the next building opened his window and yelled out for us to ****????? seriously a Gal is getting a beat down and all you care about is sleep? The Gal asked me several times how I knew(How I knew she was being attacked and to come to her aid) we told her the story and she was extremely grateful.



    Now some may question me pulling my Firearm, to each his own I guess but if this happened again I would do it without hesitation. I felt she was in extreme danger and my actions led to him stoping his attack. My Mom who watched the whole incident from about 15 feet away on her balcony would not shut up for the next 2 hours about how proud she was of me, and how she couldn't believe that was my voice telling him to get off her and get out of the car(she reinacted it multiple times to my embarassment) My Father a veteran of multiple wars said it could not have went any other way, my wife(who reads OCDO also) belived it could not have been handled better and hoped someone would do it for her if she needed help(she also carrys open and CC and was pissed her Glock was locked in the truck atm)


    Both my wife an I wrote out our statements for the Police and then went back up to my Folks after they were done with us. As far as I know they did not find the guy but they had quite a few Officers out hunting his ass down.

    I never thought I would have to draw my weapon, and I am glad this asshat did what he did when confronted and did not try to be a martyr. I am 32 and have been carring a pistol for over 12 years, always beliving that if you carry you carry ALWAYS as you never know what will happen. Tonight was just a simple picking up the wife and droppping kiddies off and hitting my parents but it happened. I had OCed all day, granted I work from home and it was at home working, messing with my Willys and baking bread, I even considered taking my gun off tonight and leaving it in the vehicle with my wifes that I brought with me so she would have hers when she got off work. This just reafirmed my "always" mentality...

    I may have missed some info here and if I remember I will add it later or answer any questions once I get some sleep.



  2. #2
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    esstac wrote:
    I wasn't going to sit and do nothing. About the same time I hit the door my wife screamed it was a guy beating on a gal.....

    I hit mach 5 down the hall and flew down the stairs at this point.
    What you did was foolish, IMO. Running down there and confrontingthemput you in considerable danger. You should have stayed in the apartment and dialed 911. That would have been the smart thing to do.

  3. #3
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    I can agree that it put him in a considerable dangerous situation. Other then that I have to disagree with your opinion. What if that was your wife, girlfriend, mom, or someone you loved. Would you want someone to just watch and do nothing. Yeah you can call 911 but by that time it could be to late. I hope I would have that much courage to do the same thing if need be. Good job esstac.

  4. #4
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    Great job esstac!!! I only hope that if someone in my family was in a situation like that, someone like you would be around to help them. I think that you did everything perfect.

  5. #5
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    A few things:

    1. When you see two people going at it, how do you know who is good and who is bad? Just because Person A is beating the crap out of Person B doesn't automatically mean Person B is the victim. For all you know, Person A is defending himself against Person B, and perhaps Person B deserves the beating. You just don't know. In this particular case, it is likely the woman was the victim, but I wouldn't bet my life on it.

    2. That guy probably beats her up every night. (Ask any LEO, and he'll tell you the "daily beating" is a lot more common than you think.) How much do you want to bet she is back with that guy, right now?

    3. In many of these types of situations, the woman will get mad at you for stopping her boyfriend/husband from beating up on her. Yea, sounds crazy, but it happens more often than you think. Now you have TWO people coming at you- the drunk boyfriend/husband AND the woman who was getting the beating.

    4. My handgun is a defensive weapon. It is my tool for defending me and my loved ones against serious threats. It is not my job, nor and I trained, to come to the aid of strangers.

    5. When you come to a stranger's aid, you are usually risking your life for someone who is not armed. Ask yourself this: Why do they care so little about their own safety that they choose to go around unarmed? Why should you- a person who cares about his safety- put your life in danger for someone who apparently doesn't even care about their own safety?

    Just a few things to think about...

  6. #6
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    A few more things to think about in response:

    1. A man should NEVER be hitting a woman, no matter who started it.

    2. Even if the guy beats her up all the time, at least you stopped it that night.

    3. That is a situation that you would have to deal with if it arises. It's hard to tell when that would happen. Apparently not in this case, thank God.

    4. My handgun is also a defensive weapon, used to protect myself, my family, my friends, and anyone else who needs help. I may not be "trained" to come to the aid of strangers, but I will do my best to help them.

    5. I feel that it's a moral obligation to help a victim of a crime. How can people just stand by and watch an assault happen? You did right.

  7. #7
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    Sounds like you did the right thing and had a pretty stressful moment. I'm glad everything worked out alright.

    Ohio Patriot in the midst of his feeling superior than you (Nothing going on in Ohio?) does raise some interesting tactical points, but given as you saw the incident unfold, given as the woman being beaten and the attitude of her attacker did not indicate self defense or "deserving" being attacked, and the nature of the attack seems to have gone beyond basic self defense had that been the case, you clearly had reasonable fear for the safety of the woman being beaten and were IMHO justified in drawing your weapon.

    Ohio Patriot, I don't know how they do things in your corner of the world, but here in Washington it is perfectly legal to draw a weapon in defense of a third party when there is reasonable belief that the person is in immediate danger of life or serious injury.

  8. #8
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    I had an incident where I pulled a weapon on someone that was fighting my brother in our own house years ago, and there were a few people on this site really bashed me hard for what I did.:? I would love to see what folks say about this one….


    But what I think about this is… "Maybe" I would not have gone down there without a tactical flashlight and put lights in the car ready to draw or already with the gun in hand. He could have been armed and fired at you and her.
    I think (knowing me, but I was not there so I am speaking in the best case here) I would have just got the lady away as you did, and let the guy run off, she has all the info you will need to catch him, and that would keep youfrom having confrontation with him, a possible attack on you.
    But you are a hero and good job, your wife did the correct thing also.


  9. #9
    Regular Member John Hardin's Avatar
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    Ohio Patriot wrote:
    You should have stayed in the apartment and dialed 911.
    No comment, as I cannot find anything polite to say.
    A few things:

    1. When you see two people going at it, how do you know who is good and who is bad? Just because Person A is beating the crap out of Person B doesn't automatically mean Person B is the victim. For all you know, Person A is defending himself against Person B, and perhaps Person B deserves the beating. You just don't know. In this particular case, it is likely the woman was the victim, but I wouldn't bet my life on it.
    What do you do? You stop the assault and control the situation until the police arrive to straighten things out.

    2. That guy probably beats her up every night. (Ask any LEO, and he'll tell you the "daily beating" is a lot more common than you think.) How much do you want to bet she is back with that guy, right now?
    And that is a reason to not come to her aid? And what if that's not the case?

    3. In many of these types of situations, the woman will get mad at you for stopping her boyfriend/husband from beating up on her. Yea, sounds crazy, but it happens more often than you think. Now you have TWO people coming at you- the drunk boyfriend/husband AND the woman who was getting the beating.
    I will agree that is a hazard. But what about the majority of cases where that is not the situation, and the victim is indeed a victim rather than a semi-willing participant?

    4. My handgun is a defensive weapon. It is my tool for defending me and my loved ones against serious threats. It is not my job, nor and I trained, to come to the aid of strangers.
    While that comment does have some validity, that attitude is a large reason behind the deterioration of our society.

    5. When you come to a stranger's aid, you are usually risking your life for someone who is not armed. Ask yourself this: Why do they care so little about their own safety that they choose to go around unarmed? Why should you- a person who cares about his safety- put your life in danger for someone who apparently doesn't even care about their own safety?
    Many people in our society are brainwashed into believing that it is someone else's responsibility - specifically, the police's - to look after their safety. It's not a matter of not caring about their own safety; it's ignorance, not stupidity.

    I could say a lot of snarky things here, but I will refrain. I will, however, say that I find the "I'm looking after myself and to hell with you" attitude is utterly repugnant - except perhaps where it's in specific response to an aggressive "you shouldn't be allowed to look after yourself, that's somebody else's job" attitude.

    esstac: Bravo. You done good.

    --


  10. #10
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    I feel that as an armed citizen in a free society you have moral/ethical duty to help stop crime in any way you can. The law allows us to step in to save others in imminent danger as this woman was. I'd guess Ohio "patriot" would actually just yell ****!". Much likethe New York citizens did many years ago when a woman was stabbed to death screaming for help in the hallway. A parasite takes all the good and beneficial in society but doesn't bring anything in to support the body. That is what happens when someone carries only to protect themselves.

    Excellent job esstac.

  11. #11
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    Good draw!

    I believe in doing the right thing, you Sir, did the right thing.
    [line]

    Also guys, please go easy on Ohio Patriot, some people believe in looking out for number 1. If you don't look out for number 1 how can you be around to look out for your loved ones.

    We should not fault him for that. Respect his choice as you would want him to respect yours.

  12. #12
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    5. When you come to a stranger's aid, you are usually risking your life for someone who is not armed. Ask yourself this: Why do they care so little about their own safety that they choose to go around unarmed? Why should you- a person who cares about his safety- put your life in danger for someone who apparently doesn't even care about their own safety?


    Too many factors that could prevent someone from carrying. She could be under the age of 21 (which means she can't carry concealed or loaded with gun). She could have been convicted of a non-violent felony which keeps her from possessing firearms. There's simply too many factors for one to know at that point why she isn't carrying.

    You'll have to forgive me if I don't subscribe to the fact that someone's life is worth less to defend because they don't happen to carry a firearm on them 24/7.

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    I can recall a police officer who always said that "only leo should be armed" He changed his mind one night when he was on the receivingend of a severe beating and a armed citizen screwed a 357 into the ear of the assailant. From that moment on right up to the time he died he was PRO ARMED CITIZEN.

    Kind of like the attitude of Ohio Patriot, but he changed.

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    Ohio Patriot wrote:
    esstac wrote:
    I wasn't going to sit and do nothing. About the same time I hit the door my wife screamed it was a guy beating on a gal.....

    I hit mach 5 down the hall and flew down the stairs at this point.
    What you did was foolish, IMO. Running down there and confrontingthemput you in considerable danger. You should have stayed in the apartment and dialed 911. That would have been the smart thing to do.
    *****.

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    Ohio Patriot wrote:
    A few things:

    1. When you see two people going at it, how do you know who is good and who is bad? Just because Person A is beating the crap out of Person B doesn't automatically mean Person B is the victim. For all you know, Person A is defending himself against Person B, and perhaps Person B deserves the beating. You just don't know. In this particular case, it is likely the woman was the victim, but I wouldn't bet my life on it.

    2. That guy probably beats her up every night. (Ask any LEO, and he'll tell you the "daily beating" is a lot more common than you think.) How much do you want to bet she is back with that guy, right now?

    3. In many of these types of situations, the woman will get mad at you for stopping her boyfriend/husband from beating up on her. Yea, sounds crazy, but it happens more often than you think. Now you have TWO people coming at you- the drunk boyfriend/husband AND the woman who was getting the beating.

    4. My handgun is a defensive weapon. It is my tool for defending me and my loved ones against serious threats. It is not my job, nor and I trained, to come to the aid of strangers.

    5. When you come to a stranger's aid, you are usually risking your life for someone who is not armed. Ask yourself this: Why do they care so little about their own safety that they choose to go around unarmed? Why should you- a person who cares about his safety- put your life in danger for someone who apparently doesn't even care about their own safety?

    Just a few things to think about...
    Worthless moron.

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    I believe you did the right thing... You may/did save a life yesterday/today

    I probably would have done the same, even if you dont know who or how the fight started, obviously she was over being over powered and being a victim at that point. How should we try and solve a problem? Stop the threat not kill it, and you did just that, you stopped it.

    Some people say just call 911 and be a witness, but ya know some cases thats ok but something like this... The guy could have beat her to death if no one stopped him.

    I dont know how big you are or how big that guy was, but with him already in that kind of rage he could take on some one quite well, you had a tool and you used it and thankfully you didnt have to shot.

    Let us know if anything further comes of this for you with the police....

    IMO I would not agree to write a statement about the entire account, because you used a "gun", some how some way in some possible gray area you may become a criminal too, I really dont think so but you never know... CYA

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    VtCO wrote:
    Ohio Patriot wrote:
    esstac wrote:
    I wasn't going to sit and do nothing. About the same time I hit the door my wife screamed it was a guy beating on a gal.....

    I hit mach 5 down the hall and flew down the stairs at this point.
    What you did was foolish, IMO. Running down there and confrontingthemput you in considerable danger. You should have stayed in the apartment and dialed 911. That would have been the smart thing to do.
    *****.
    wow thats a bit harsh and should be kept to the PM's

    but definetly do not agree with call 911 and just watching in this particular situation

  18. #18
    Founder's Club Member Jim675's Avatar
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    Well done esstac. A good deed is not undone even if she decides to go back with the loser. She was not beaten to death this night and you gave her a chance to exercise free will. That's the best we can do.

    ETA: And congrats to your wife for quickly handling 911 and to your father for having large stones!

  19. #19
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    Ohio Patriot wrote:
    esstac wrote:
    I wasn't going to sit and do nothing. About the same time I hit the door my wife screamed it was a guy beating on a gal.....

    I hit mach 5 down the hall and flew down the stairs at this point.
    What you did was foolish, IMO. Running down there and confrontingthemput you in considerable danger. You should have stayed in the apartment and dialed 911. That would have been the smart thing to do.
    I don't see how the hell he was in danger and Washington state law clearly allows you to protect others up to and including deadly force. The only one in danger was the idiot committing the assualt. If you are gonna be a sheep dog you don't standbyand allow another person to be injured or killed, at least not in the book I read. Why would you carry at all if you are gonna wait for a 911 response?

  20. #20
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    You did it right. I would only hope that if my wife or any family
    member needed some help there would be somebody like you around.

  21. #21
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    I personally agree with what you did, and would have done the same.

    But one point to think about that is brought up in the "fighting pistol" training course. Sometimes the person who appears to be the attacker could be an undercover cop. He says that it has happened where uniformed police have shot undercover cops. But IMO, undercover cop or not, if he's beating on a woman he deserves to be drawn on.

  22. #22
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    I commend you Esstac,

    While the only obligation a citizen (in Wash.)has is to summon help (911) in such an instance, I would expect that the vast majority of folks would at least do that. On the other hand, you went above/beyond what joe average would do, and intervened.

    I have diffusednumerous situations similar to what you described, but that is expected of me, part of my job, and hardly newsworthy.When a citizen steps up and takes action as you did, You have earned my utmost respect. I have no issue with using your gun to control the situation, as it is exactly whatPolice do on a daily basis. You acted reasonably, and it sounds like the Officers onscene agreed with this as well.

    There is nothing I like more than to go back and tell my co-workers a story of how a citizen intervened, stopped a crime, or captured a bg. It is always great to hear about an incident like this, as it shows that there are still people out there who have a strong moral sense of right and wrong, and are willing to step in and intervene even if it means putting themselves at some risk.

    Nice job! JL.
    If you have to fight, do not fear death. We will all die one day, so fight skillfully and bravely! And if it is to be that you die, then at least go to God proudly. Meet him as the proud warrior that you are, and not as a sniveling coward. Nobody lives forever.

  23. #23
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    Nice work esstac. You did exactly what any decent and caring person should have done. The fact the the responding oficers did not criticize you or talk down to you for your actions should speak very loudly. Had it been the wrong decision I am sure you would have heard it from them.
    "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."

    "though I walk through the valley in the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for I know that you are by my side" Glock 23:40

  24. #24
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    VtCO wrote:
    *****.
    No. It's called being smart.

    The only way I would come to a stranger's aid is if I was 100% sure I understood the situation. And even then, there would be circumstances where I would simply call 911.

  25. #25
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    Ohio Patriot wrote:
    VtCO wrote:
    *****.
    No. It's called being smart.

    The only way I would come to a stranger's aid is if I was 100% sure I understood the situation. And even then, there would be circumstances where I would simply call 911.
    Try selfish and arrogant.

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