• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

OC in Holland?

custom.45acp

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
118
Location
Istanbul, , Turkey
imported post

Greetings all.

I am new here, relatively new to the state of Michigan and soon to be CC licensed.

Does anyone OC in Holland or nearby communities?
 

warlockmatized

Regular Member
Joined
May 28, 2008
Messages
720
Location
Silverwood, Michigan
imported post

Welcome to OCDO. I am sure there are people on the board that are in or around Holland that do open carry. Bounce around, do some reading, i am sure soon you will run into them or them into you.

When you get a chance please click on the my account button on the upper right, and change your info to reflect your location. remember you MUST choose your country BEFORE you can choose your state. enjoy OCDO.
 

custom.45acp

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
118
Location
Istanbul, , Turkey
imported post

I just came back from the HPD (obtaining pistol purchase permit). While I was there, I informed them of the OC laws of Michigan and asked if there were any local restrictions that I should be made aware of, prior to OCing in Holland. Both said, "if that's the law" but neither of them were carrying.



When I return to pick up my PPP, I'll see if I can speak to the Chief (of course, I will be handing him the statue of the OC laws of Michigan.)



So far, no one has informed me that the law has changed regarding the Inspections, so I will bring a copy when I return to pick up my PPP.
 

UpNorth

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2008
Messages
41
Location
, Michigan, USA
imported post

custom.45acp wrote:
I just came back from the HPD (obtaining pistol purchase permit). While I was there, I informed them of the OC laws of Michigan and asked if there were any local restrictions that I should be made aware of, prior to OCing in Holland. Both said, "if that's the law" but neither of them were carrying.



When I return to pick up my PPP, I'll see if I can speak to the Chief (of course, I will be handing him the statue of the OC laws of Michigan.)



So far, no one has informed me that the law has changed regarding the Inspections, so I will bring a copy when I return to pick up my PPP.
Restrictons????? Was this question just to get them to talk or what? What "LAWS" are you going to show them? Careful on your wording, here AND there.....
 

Venator

Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
6,462
Location
Lansing area, Michigan, USA
imported post

custom.45acp wrote:
I just came back from the HPD (obtaining pistol purchase permit). While I was there, I informed them of the OC laws of Michigan and asked if there were any local restrictions that I should be made aware of, prior to OCing in Holland. Both said, "if that's the law" but neither of them were carrying.



When I return to pick up my PPP, I'll see if I can speak to the Chief (of course, I will be handing him the statue of the OC laws of Michigan.)



So far, no one has informed me that the law has changed regarding the Inspections, so I will bring a copy when I return to pick up my PPP.

There can be no local restrictions (1990 preemption law).

There are no laws saying OC is legal, just no law that makes it illegal.
 

ghostrider

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2007
Messages
1,416
Location
Grand Rapids, Michigan, USA
imported post

custom.45acp wrote:
I just came back from the HPD (obtaining pistol purchase permit). While I was there, I informed them of the OC laws of Michigan and asked if there were any local restrictions that I should be made aware of, prior to OCing in Holland. Both said, "if that's the law" but neither of them were carrying.



When I return to pick up my PPP, I'll see if I can speak to the Chief (of course, I will be handing him the statue of the OC laws of Michigan.)



So far, no one has informed me that the law has changed regarding the Inspections, so I will bring a copy when I return to pick up my PPP.
Why are you returning to pick up your PPP? They should have given it to you when you first went there. The same law that prevents them from passing laws against OC, is the same law that imposing any waiting period on PPP's.
 

SpringerXDacp

New member
Joined
May 12, 2006
Messages
3,341
Location
Burton, Michigan
imported post

ghostrider wrote:
custom.45acp wrote:
I just came back from the HPD (obtaining pistol purchase permit). While I was there, I informed them of the OC laws of Michigan and asked if there were any local restrictions that I should be made aware of, prior to OCing in Holland. Both said, "if that's the law" but neither of them were carrying.



When I return to pick up my PPP, I'll see if I can speak to the Chief (of course, I will be handing him the statue of the OC laws of Michigan.)



So far, no one has informed me that the law has changed regarding the Inspections, so I will bring a copy when I return to pick up my PPP.
Why are you returning to pick up your PPP? They should have given it to you when you first went there. The same law that prevents them from passing laws against OC, is the same law that imposing any waiting period on PPP's.


28.422 In pertinent part:

(3) The commissioner or chief of police of a city, township, or village police department that issues licenses to purchase, carry, or transport pistols, or his or her duly authorized deputy, or the sheriff or his or her duly authorized deputy, in the parts of a county not included within a city, township, or village having an organized police department, in discharging the duty to issue licenses shall with due speed and diligence issue licenses to purchase, carry, or transport pistols to qualified applicants residing within the city, village, township, or county, as applicable unless he or she has probable cause to believe that the applicant would be a threat to himself or herself or to other individuals, or would commit an offense with the pistol that would violate a law of this or another state or of the United States. An applicant is qualified if all of the following circumstances exist:


What exactlyis the time frame of "due speed"?
 

ghostrider

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2007
Messages
1,416
Location
Grand Rapids, Michigan, USA
imported post

SpringerXDacp wrote:
ghostrider wrote:
custom.45acp wrote:
I just came back from the HPD (obtaining pistol purchase permit). While I was there, I informed them of the OC laws of Michigan and asked if there were any local restrictions that I should be made aware of, prior to OCing in Holland. Both said, "if that's the law" but neither of them were carrying.



When I return to pick up my PPP, I'll see if I can speak to the Chief (of course, I will be handing him the statue of the OC laws of Michigan.)



So far, no one has informed me that the law has changed regarding the Inspections, so I will bring a copy when I return to pick up my PPP.
Why are you returning to pick up your PPP? They should have given it to you when you first went there. The same law that prevents them from passing laws against OC, is the same law that imposing any waiting period on PPP's.


28.422 In pertinent part:

(3) The commissioner or chief of police of a city, township, or village police department that issues licenses to purchase, carry, or transport pistols, or his or her duly authorized deputy, or the sheriff or his or her duly authorized deputy, in the parts of a county not included within a city, township, or village having an organized police department, in discharging the duty to issue licenses shall with due speed and diligence issue licenses to purchase, carry, or transport pistols to qualified applicants residing within the city, village, township, or county, as applicable unless he or she has probable cause to believe that the applicant would be a threat to himself or herself or to other individuals, or would commit an offense with the pistol that would violate a law of this or another state or of the United States. An applicant is qualified if all of the following circumstances exist:


What exactlyis the time frame of "due speed"?
I understand that the phrase "due speed and diligence" may seem vague, but The AG opinion has already stated that there is no waiting period. It doesn't take 24 hours to issue a permit. Making someone wait that long isn't "due speed and diligence", it's a waiting period.

Due speed and diligence? Takes about 20-30 minutes here in GR, and some even less.

The OP should go to this thread: http://www.migunowners.org/forum/showthread.php?t=23983

and report it there. They should do it while you wait.
 

custom.45acp

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
118
Location
Istanbul, , Turkey
imported post

Is anyone else experiencing the same problem in HPD, the lengthy process of getting a PPP?



Last time I went to get a PPP, I had to wait 4 hours to get it signed, they called just prior to closing and said that I could come to get it the following day. I thought this was common for Michigan, being new here.



With the strict gun laws in Illinois, I had less of a headache than here. I would buy a gun. The gun shop would call in the check. I would wait 72 hours from the approval. Go back to the gun shop and pick up my pistol. No extra running around and a lot less time consuming. I can't even get a PPP on the weekend here (I guess that's where the CPL comes in handy.)
 

ghostrider

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2007
Messages
1,416
Location
Grand Rapids, Michigan, USA
imported post

custom.45acp wrote:
Is anyone else experiencing the same problem in HPD, the lengthy process of getting a PPP?



Last time I went to get a PPP, I had to wait 4 hours to get it signed, they called just prior to closing and said that I could come to get it the following day. I thought this was common for Michigan, being new here.



With the strict gun laws in Illinois, I had less of a headache than here. I would buy a gun. The gun shop would call in the check. I would wait 72 hours from the approval. Go back to the gun shop and pick up my pistol. No extra running around and a lot less time consuming. I can't even get a PPP on the weekend here (I guess that's where the CPL comes in handy.)
Make a print out of this AG opinion and take it down there with you.

http://www.migunowners.org/pub/AGLetter7-17-06.pdf

moz-screenshot-1.jpg
moz-screenshot-2.jpg
moz-screenshot-3.jpg
 

Furner

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2008
Messages
108
Location
Grand Rapids, MI, , USA
imported post

I know that some parks in Holland have posted anti-firearm rules. I know one is posted at Black Lake Boardwalk. I am not sure who owns/controls that boardwalk, but it is public. Of course any of those rules would be ILLEGAL



I did find this on municode:

Sec. 22-4. Firearms, etc. Unless that person is authorized to engage in an animal control activity authorized under section 22-9 of the Ordinance Code of the City of Holland, no person shall carry in any public park any gun, "BB" gun, air rifle, rifle, shotgun, revolver, pistol or other firearm of any kind or description or any device which is capable of throwing or discharging an object with sufficient force to injure or kill humans or animals.

Its probably just a scare tactic. I have read the meeting minutes from when this ord was enacted though, and they believe that it is a legal ord, even after warning, I believe from MCRGO.
 

Venator

Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
6,462
Location
Lansing area, Michigan, USA
imported post

Furner wrote:
I know that some parks in Holland have posted anti-firearm rules. I know one is posted at Black Lake Boardwalk. I am not sure who owns/controls that boardwalk, but it is public. Of course any of those rules would be ILLEGAL



I did find this on municode:

Sec. 22-4. Firearms, etc. Unless that person is authorized to engage in an animal control activity authorized under section 22-9 of the Ordinance Code of the City of Holland, no person shall carry in any public park any gun, "BB" gun, air rifle, rifle, shotgun, revolver, pistol or other firearm of any kind or description or any device which is capable of throwing or discharging an object with sufficient force to injure or kill humans or animals.

Its probably just a scare tactic. I have read the meeting minutes from when this ord was enacted though, and they believe that it is a legal ord, even after warning, I believe from MCRGO.
It's illegal.
 

Furner

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2008
Messages
108
Location
Grand Rapids, MI, , USA
imported post

Venator wrote:
Furner wrote:
I know that some parks in Holland have posted anti-firearm rules. I know one is posted at Black Lake Boardwalk. I am not sure who owns/controls that boardwalk, but it is public. Of course any of those rules would be ILLEGAL



I did find this on municode:

Sec. 22-4. Firearms, etc. Unless that person is authorized to engage in an animal control activity authorized under section 22-9 of the Ordinance Code of the City of Holland, no person shall carry in any public park any gun, "BB" gun, air rifle, rifle, shotgun, revolver, pistol or other firearm of any kind or description or any device which is capable of throwing or discharging an object with sufficient force to injure or kill humans or animals.

Its probably just a scare tactic. I have read the meeting minutes from when this ord was enacted though, and they believe that it is a legal ord, even after warning, I believe from MCRGO.
It's illegal.
They must think they live in some sort of alternate universe. Where up is down and they are above the law.
 

Venator

Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
6,462
Location
Lansing area, Michigan, USA
imported post

Furner wrote:
Venator wrote:
Furner wrote:
I know that some parks in Holland have posted anti-firearm rules. I know one is posted at Black Lake Boardwalk. I am not sure who owns/controls that boardwalk, but it is public. Of course any of those rules would be ILLEGAL



I did find this on municode:

Sec. 22-4. Firearms, etc. Unless that person is authorized to engage in an animal control activity authorized under section 22-9 of the Ordinance Code of the City of Holland, no person shall carry in any public park any gun, "BB" gun, air rifle, rifle, shotgun, revolver, pistol or other firearm of any kind or description or any device which is capable of throwing or discharging an object with sufficient force to injure or kill humans or animals.

Its probably just a scare tactic. I have read the meeting minutes from when this ord was enacted though, and they believe that it is a legal ord, even after warning, I believe from MCRGO.
It's illegal.
They must think they live in some sort of alternate universe. Where up is down and they are above the law.


We have heard of bad information given out by the Holland PD. All we can do is inform them of whats correct and ask them to show you where the local ordinance trumps state law. Other than that sounds like a great place for a get together.
 

Furner

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2008
Messages
108
Location
Grand Rapids, MI, , USA
imported post

Venator wrote:
Furner wrote:
Venator wrote:
Furner wrote:
I know that some parks in Holland have posted anti-firearm rules. I know one is posted at Black Lake Boardwalk. I am not sure who owns/controls that boardwalk, but it is public. Of course any of those rules would be ILLEGAL



I did find this on municode:

Sec. 22-4. Firearms, etc. Unless that person is authorized to engage in an animal control activity authorized under section 22-9 of the Ordinance Code of the City of Holland, no person shall carry in any public park any gun, "BB" gun, air rifle, rifle, shotgun, revolver, pistol or other firearm of any kind or description or any device which is capable of throwing or discharging an object with sufficient force to injure or kill humans or animals.

Its probably just a scare tactic. I have read the meeting minutes from when this ord was enacted though, and they believe that it is a legal ord, even after warning, I believe from MCRGO.
It's illegal.
They must think they live in some sort of alternate universe. Where up is down and they are above the law.


We have heard of bad information given out by the Holland PD. All we can do is inform them of whats correct and ask them to show you where the local ordinance trumps state law. Other than that sounds like a great place for a get together.
Id love to do a meet in Holland. I even have a state park vehicle pass!

Although the state park might be biting off more than we can chew. Maybe keep it to a city park.
 

Venator

Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
6,462
Location
Lansing area, Michigan, USA
imported post

Furner wrote:
Venator wrote:
Furner wrote:
Venator wrote:
Furner wrote:
I know that some parks in Holland have posted anti-firearm rules. I know one is posted at Black Lake Boardwalk. I am not sure who owns/controls that boardwalk, but it is public. Of course any of those rules would be ILLEGAL



I did find this on municode:

Sec. 22-4. Firearms, etc. Unless that person is authorized to engage in an animal control activity authorized under section 22-9 of the Ordinance Code of the City of Holland, no person shall carry in any public park any gun, "BB" gun, air rifle, rifle, shotgun, revolver, pistol or other firearm of any kind or description or any device which is capable of throwing or discharging an object with sufficient force to injure or kill humans or animals.

Its probably just a scare tactic. I have read the meeting minutes from when this ord was enacted though, and they believe that it is a legal ord, even after warning, I believe from MCRGO.
It's illegal.
They must think they live in some sort of alternate universe. Where up is down and they are above the law.


We have heard of bad information given out by the Holland PD. All we can do is inform them of whats correct and ask them to show you where the local ordinance trumps state law. Other than that sounds like a great place for a get together.
Id love to do a meet in Holland. I even have a state park vehicle pass!

Although the state park might be biting off more than we can chew. Maybe keep it to a city park.
Fees required to enter state parks, that's why we like city parks.
 

custom.45acp

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
118
Location
Istanbul, , Turkey
imported post

Getting a CPL in Holland, Ottawa County, similar the stories that I am hearing or can I expect the same treatment that I've been getting when I get a PPP?

Silver Bullet, Wyoming, is where I'll take instruction. Anyone dealt with them? Good or average class for CCW training?
 

Furner

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2008
Messages
108
Location
Grand Rapids, MI, , USA
imported post

custom.45acp wrote:
Getting a CPL in Holland, Ottawa County, similar the stories that I am hearing or can I expect the same treatment that I've been getting when I get a PPP?

Silver Bullet, Wyoming, is where I'll take instruction. Anyone dealt with them? Good or average class for CCW training?
Good CPL class. Thats where I took mine. There may be cheaper ones, but Silver Bullet rocks because its one day and you shoot indoors. And they actually have you shoot. I went through almost my entire 100 rounds.
 
Top