Open carry after getting cc permit legal?

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Hey guys first post here. I'm taking the concealed carry course next monthbut would still like to carry openly. In the Gander Mountain in Mooresville I have been told that once I get my concealed I can no longer carry openly. This was by a salesman and their gunsmith on two seperate occasions. Is this just misinformation on the part of store training or reality?



--Oxblood

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never heard that before. im sure theirs some folks that know the exact laws on here but i think those guys dont know what their talking about. i have ccp and i still open carry alot.

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Welcome to OCDO!

It's your right to open carry guaranteed by the state constitution and two supreme court decisions. It's a priviledge to carry concealed (although this too should be a right).

Saying that you couldn'tOC after you got your concealed permitwould be like saying that you couldn't ride in the passenger seat of a car after you got your drivers license.

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Oxblood wrote:

Hey guys first post here. I'm taking the concealed carry course next monthbut would still like to carry openly. In the Gander Mountain in Mooresville I have been told that once I get my concealed I can no longer carry openly. This was by a salesman and their gunsmith on two seperate occasions. Is this just misinformation on the part of store training or reality?



--Oxblood

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Hmmm.... Smells like it, sounds like it. Crap. I don't know who told you this, but its obvious thery couldn't cite state or case law on this one. Why? Cause it doesn't exist, that's why. I open and conceal quite often, depending where I am (I live too close to Chapel Hill).

Dang and I was about to go there for a good Remington scattergun, too.

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That is BS. In fact, in some places in NCit is illegal to conceal, but legal to OC, banks for instance.

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Panos1296 wrote:

That is BS. In fact, in some places in NCit is illegal to conceal, but legal to OC, banks for instance.

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Interstingly. Can you cite the code section making bank cary unlawful? Also , any more open carry rewired areas?

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Sorry. I cant cite the actual law. (I dont like to read Legalese.) Besides, nowhere in NC law will itexplicitly say OC is legal. (It simply isnt prohibited.) That is what I understand.

In my CCW course I learned that concealed is illegal in banks. In NC. I could be wrong though. If anyone can correct me, please do.

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Panos1296 wrote:

Sorry. I cant cite the actual law. (I dont like to read Legalese.)

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OK, well the point of this web site is to get people to like to read legalese and cite to authority - that's in the rukles - and help clear up all these myths out there!

When you get a chance, look up the online NC statutes, and find the allege ban on concealed cary in banks. Assuming you find no general possession ban in banks, then you will have essentially proven your point by citing to authorities.

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You know Mike, it seems that the law trumps peoples rights (read as: all) most of the time. I guess thats where the recent trend of making laws that specifically defines rights came from.

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§ 14415.11. Permit to carry concealed handgun; scope of permit.
(a) Any person who has a concealed handgun permit may carry a concealed handgun unless otherwise specifically prohibited by law. The person shall carry the permit together with valid identification whenever the person is carrying a concealed handgun, shall disclose to any law enforcement officer that the person holds a valid permit and is carrying a concealed handgun when approached or addressed by the officer, and shall display both the permit and the proper identification upon the request of a law enforcement officer. In addition to these requirements, a military permittee whose permit has expired during deployment may carry a concealed handgun during the 90 days following the end of deployment and before the permit is renewed provided the permittee also displays proof of deployment to any law enforcement officer.
(b) The sheriff shall issue a permit to carry a concealed handgun to a person who qualifies for a permit under G.S. 14415.12. The permit shall be valid throughout the State for a period of five years from the date of issuance.
(c) A permit does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun in the areas prohibited by G.S. 14269.2, 14269.3, 14269.4, and 14277.2, in an area prohibited by rule adopted under G.S. 12032.1, in any area prohibited by 18 U.S.C. § 922 or any other federal law, in a law enforcement or correctional facility, in a building housing only State or federal offices, in an office of the State or federal government that is not located in a building exclusively occupied by the State or federal government, a financial institution, or on any other premises, except stateowned rest areas or stateowned rest stops along the highways, where notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the posting of a conspicuous notice or statement by the person in legal possession or control of the premises. It shall be unlawful for a person, with or without a permit, to carry a concealed handgun while consuming alcohol or at any time while the person has remaining in his body any alcohol or in his blood a controlled substance previously consumed, but a person does not violate this condition if a controlled substance in his blood was lawfully obtained and taken in therapeutically appropriate amounts.
(d) A person who is issued a permit shall notify the sheriff who issued the permit of any change in the person's permanent address within 30 days after the change of address. If a permit is lost or destroyed, the person to whom the permit was issued shall notify the sheriff who issued the permit of the loss or destruction of the permit. A person may obtain a duplicate permit by submitting to the sheriff a notarized statement that the permit was lost or destroyed and paying the required duplicate permit fee. [font="Times New (W1), serif"](1995, c. 398, s. 1; c. 507, s. 22.1(c); c. 509, s. 135.3(e); 1997, c. 238, s. 6; 2000140, s. 103; 2000191, s. 5; 2005232, s. 3.)


And the Gander Mountain guys are dead wrong....
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Mike wrote:

Panos1296 wrote:

Sorry. I cant cite the actual law. (I dont like to read Legalese.)

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OK, well the point of this web site is to get people to like to read legalese and cite to authority - that's in the rukles - and help clear up all these myths out there!

When you get a chance, look up the online NC statutes, and find the allege ban on concealed cary in banks. Assuming you find no general possession ban in banks, then you will have essentially proven your point by citing to authorities.

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Concealed carry is strictly prohited in banks in NC. But banks are NOT included in areas where there is a ban on firearms. Therefore, OC in banks is LEGAL in NC.

The point of the forum is to get people to like to read Legalese? I still dont like to read it as it is purposefully written this way by lawyers that claim to have authority over others because they were "elected" by some voters. In the end, this is all POSITIVE law and NOTnatural law.Other examples of POSITIVElaw allowed me to own blacks many years ago and allowedthe govt to round up "Japs" in WWII. Positive law issimply words written on pieces of paper and are rarely ethical. Postive law is always written in Legalese. But if you still respect positive law and enjoy reading it then the link is below:

http://www.grnc.org/guns.htm

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Panos1296 wrote:

Mike wrote:

Panos1296 wrote:

Sorry. I cant cite the actual law. (I dont like to read Legalese.)

Click to expand...

OK, well the point of this web site is to get people to like to read legalese and cite to authority - that's in the rukles - and help clear up all these myths out there!

When you get a chance, look up the online NC statutes, and find the allege ban on concealed cary in banks. Assuming you find no general possession ban in banks, then you will have essentially proven your point by citing to authorities.

Click to expand...

Concealed carry is strictly prohited in banks in NC. But banks are NOT included in areas where there is a ban on firearms. Therefore, OC in banks is LEGAL in NC.

The point of the forum is to get people to like to read Legalese? I still dont like to read it as it is purposefully written this way by lawyers that claim to have authority over others because they were "elected" by some voters. In the end, this is all POSITIVE law and NOTnatural law.Other examples of POSITIVElaw allowed me to own blacks many years ago and allowedthe govt to round up "Japs" in WWII. Positive law issimply words written on pieces of paper and are rarely ethical. Postive law is always written in Legalese. But if you still respect positive law and enjoy reading it then the link is below:

http://www.grnc.org/guns.htm

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We need folks to cite to authority when they state rules of law - it's in the rules. You just said that concealed carry was banned in banks but not open carry - can you cite the statute banning concealed carry in banks or not?

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§ 14‑415.11. Permit to carry concealed handgun; scope of permit.

(c) A permit does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun in the areas prohibited by G.S. 14‑269.2 (schools), 14‑269.3 (establishments that serve alcohol), 14‑269.4 (state property), and 14‑277.2 (parades), in an area prohibited by rule adopted under G.S. 120‑32.1 (general assembly), in any area prohibited by 18 U.S.C. § 922 or any other federal law (post offices, federal buildings, etc.), in a law enforcement or correctional facility, in a building housing only State or federal offices, in an office of the State or federal government that is not located in a building exclusively occupied by the State or federal government, a financial institution, or on any other premises, except state‑owned rest areas or state‑owned rest stops along the highways, where notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the posting of a conspicuous notice or statement by the person in legal possession or control of the premises. It shall be unlawful for a person, with or without a permit, to carry a concealed handgun while consuming alcohol or at any time while the person has remaining in his body any alcohol or in his blood a controlled substance previously consumed, but a person does not violate this condition if a controlled substance in his blood was lawfully obtained and taken in therapeutically appropriate amounts.


I just noticed something though, looking at all of these provisions it seems that it is not illegal to carry a firearm in a state park as long as it is not posted against firearms. Therefore, if the gun ban is dropped in national parks it appears thatpeople with aNC CHLmay be able to carry in them and quite possibly open carry in them while in North Carolina.

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dubccat51 wrote:

I just noticed something though, looking at all of these provisions it seems that it is not illegal to carry a firearm in a state park as long as it is not posted against firearms. Therefore, if the gun ban is dropped in national parks it appears thatpeople with aNC CHLmay be able to carry in them and quite possibly open carry in them while in North Carolina.

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You mean this part: "or on any other premises, except state‑owned rest areas or state‑owned rest stops along the highways, where notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the posting of a conspicuous notice or statement by the person in legal possession or control of the premises."

Are state parks not covered by "14‑269.4 (state property)"? Or another statute? Can you OC in state parks?

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§ 14‑269.4. Weapons on State property and in courthouses.

It shall be unlawful for any person to possess, or carry, whether openly or concealed, any deadly weapon, not used solely for instructional or officially sanctioned ceremonial purposes in the State Capitol Building, the Executive Mansion, the Western Residence of the Governor, or on the grounds of any of these buildings, and in any building housing any court of the General Court of Justice. If a court is housed in a building containing nonpublic uses in addition to the court, then this prohibition shall apply only to that portion of the building used for court purposes while the building is being used for court purposes.

It doesn't say anything about a state park, so as long as the park is not posted it appears that carrying a handgun, at least concealed, is legal.

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dubccat51 wrote:

§ 14‑269.4. Weapons on State property and in courthouses.

It shall be unlawful for any person to possess, or carry, whether openly or concealed, any deadly weapon, not used solely for instructional or officially sanctioned ceremonial purposes in the State Capitol Building, the Executive Mansion, the Western Residence of the Governor, or on the grounds of any of these buildings, and in any building housing any court of the General Court of Justice. If a court is housed in a building containing nonpublic uses in addition to the court, then this prohibition shall apply only to that portion of the building used for court purposes while the building is being used for court purposes.

It doesn't say anything about a state park, so as long as the park is not posted it appears that carrying a handgun, at least concealed, is legal.

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OK, but AP reports that gun carry is banned in state parks re the Nat. park gun ban repeal propsoal - maybe there is a regulation on this??

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It is a regulation, I found it on the ncparks.gov website under FAQ's:

Are firearms allowed in a state park?

All deadly weapons, including firearms, airguns, bows and arrows, sling shots, or lethal missiles of any kind, or other deadly weapon is strictly prohibited in all areas owned or operated by the NC Division of Parks and Recreation except for commissioned park rangers and other authorized personnel. Cap pistols and fireworks are also prohibited.

I hate bureaucracy.

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dubccat51 wrote:

It is a regulation, I found it on the ncparks.gov website under FAQ's:

Are firearms allowed in a state park?

All deadly weapons, including firearms, airguns, bows and arrows, sling shots, or lethal missiles of any kind, or other deadly weapon is strictly prohibited in all areas owned or operated by the NC Division of Parks and Recreation except for commissioned park rangers and other authorized personnel. Cap pistols and fireworks are also prohibited.

I hate bureaucracy.

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Can you get a cite or link? How do we get it changed? Do you have an administrative processes act?

Where is that guy Panos1296- is he going to make you do all the work?

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Mike wrote:

Can you get a cite or link? How do we get it changed? Do you have an administrative processes act?

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http://www.ncparks.gov/Visit/faq/main.phpand click on firearms.

I think the easiest way to get it changed would be to contact Grassroots North Carolinaand see if they willlobbythe legislature to put pressure on the division of parks and recreation or challenge it in court, but I am not a member (broke college kid) and I don't know how active they still are in the legislative process here. Since the federal government is thinking about striking down the National Parks ban it might be an issue thatthe GRNC would consider taking up. Any GRNC members here?