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Thread: Pepper Spray, Tasers, and Bears

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    The bear spray I have looked at is of the fogger variety. For example, UDAP bear spray is 3.3 million SHU and puts out about a 30' long cloud of fog. From my understanding, a bear's nose and mouth lining is so sensitive that hitting that cloud of OC generally causes them to stop/slow down quickly as they do so it causes them to remain even longer in the OC cloud further deterring them.

    Again, as I understand things, with humans, OC spray is meant to incapacitate the perp and cause such pain, discomfort and eye irritation that they are unable to continue fighting (which is why it is of limited use on druggies who are high on substances that reduce or eliminate their pain response) whereas with bears, it does not incapacitate but rather deters/discourages them from continuing the attack and once the attack/focus is broken, your survivability increases dramatically.

    Tazers are also meant to incapacitate. Given that they don't always work on a very wired or very large human, I would think that their effectiveness against a bear would be rather limited. Also, now you are "tethered" to the bear with the electrode cables. Laslty you have to aim it well to hit a fast moving target and if you miss you are screwed. I think a bear spray fogger which does not require any significant marksmanship to function and lays out a deterrent that the bear has to travel through for 25-30' before reaching you, and that then is still in the bear's nasal passage and mouth continuing to irritate, is a much better defensive tool than any tazer or handgun.
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    Regular Member Huck's Avatar
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    deepdiver wrote:
    The bear spray I have looked at is of the fogger variety. For example, UDAP bear spray is 3.3 million SHU and puts out about a 30' long cloud of fog. From my understanding, a bear's nose and mouth lining is so sensitive that hitting that cloud of OC generally causes them to stop/slow down quickly as they do so it causes them to remain even longer in the OC cloud further deterring them.

    Again, as I understand things, with humans, OC spray is meant to incapacitate the perp and cause such pain, discomfort and eye irritation that they are unable to continue fighting (which is why it is of limited use on druggies who are high on substances that reduce or eliminate their pain response) whereas with bears, it does not incapacitate but rather deters/discourages them from continuing the attack and once the attack/focus is broken, your survivability increases dramatically.
    You mean you hope it works against bears. Has anyone acually used any of this bear spray and lived to tell about it? The boondocks areas here in the northern rockies are Grizzly Bear country and those animals are increadibly tough and to rely on something that I doubt has ever been used against one in a for real attack in the boondocks is nuts.

    One thing to keep in mind too. That spray was probably tested on captive animals in a carefullycontrolled situationwho were not agitated until after they got sprayed. A bear in the wild who attacks is most likely defending young and/or territory so they're gonna be pretty much like a freaked out druggie, where the spray may have no more effect except to piss off the bear more.

    Whenever I'm in Grizz country I have old tried and proven with me, and it's got a longer reach than a can of spray doesbut even a .45-70 is not guarenteed to stop 'ol Grizz.

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    I have read quite a few stories of people who while hunting were mauled by a bear. Those who used pepper spray report shooting the bear with a full dose. Usually in the mouth. Spray might help with a passive bear. Use it on a charging or angry bear and you are just adding condensed jalapenos to his meal.

    Taser might work for the few seconds when it is shocking the animal.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOhYvu_EgwM
    But once that charge runs out you have one pissed off bear that you have just filled with adrenaline.



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    Maybe if you consider a high tension wire attached to a whaler's harpoon a taser, then yea, go ahead.:what:

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    Lets look at what a bear hugger says about pepper spray and guns and their relative effectiveness on bears. I will translate what they are saying.


    Why is bear pepper spray so effective in deterring aggressive bears?

    A: I personally believe that these bear deterrent sprays confer three important advantages to the user:


    (I like bear sprays caus I love bears)


    1) Bear pepper spray gives people a reason not to run. Its often said that running from a bear may elicit a chase and attack. Is this true or are people just assuming that bears are little more than “big dogs with little tails” (to quote famous phylogeneticist George Gaylord Simpson) and hence, like dogs, chase things that run from them? I analyzed thousands of stimulus-response type data associated with bear attacks. The idea was to see what the historical record could teach us, quantitatively, about how bears responded to people’s responses to them. In this instance I had 42 times in my database when people confronted with an aggressive bear chose as their response to run. It seems fairly safe to assume that the desire of the person running was to put distance between themself and the bear and end the confrontation. How often did the desired result occur? About 5% of the time! In only 2 of these 42 instances did the bear leave without further interaction. Importantly, however, in 83% of these instances (35) desired results were not obtained.... bears chased after the fleeing persons, and in some cases, attacked and mauled them. So, running from an aggressive bear should not be high on your list of options for dealing with them in a close encounter. Yet when confronting a bear, particularly one-on-one, with no deterrent options available, people panic and run regardless of what they’ve been told. We can do much better than that. Carry bear pepper spray and don’t run but stand your ground. Not running and holding your ground conveys a message that bears recognize, that of a co-dominant unwilling to yield. That gives them pause and buys you time. If you have bear pepper spray with you, have it handy, have it out and pointed in the bear’s direction, you will find that you have a reason to not run and this says to the bear “I am not subordinate nor am I going to be an easy target.” Without a deterrent you will have a very hard time keeping your legs from taking off regardless of what your head says otherwise.


    (If you run he will catch you and eat you. Carrying bear spray makes you feel strong so that you don't feel like a wimp, who is afraid to carry a gun.)


    2) The sudden, loud hissing of the spray and billowing cloud startles bears. This effect I have observed several times in person and on video-tape. You could be spraying sugar water for all it matters initially because this sound and sight is surprising. As a result, approaching bears are surprised, they halt, and very often run away before the spray even reaches them. Again, this startle effect has been shown time and again to give bears a reason to go somewhere else and, as our records show, they most often do.


    (Loud noises scare bares and guns scare you so maybe this noise will only scare the bear)


    3) The active ingredient in bear pepper spray is a strong irritant, as observed with penned and wild bears that have been sprayed. Steve Herrero, Chuck Jonkel, myself, and many others have seen bears sprayed directly with this and many cough, wheeze, and wildly paw at their eyes and nose. Pepper spray obviously turns the tables...the aggressor becomes the victim. Sure, there have been a few failures of sprays to deter aggressive bears but there have been far greater successes, something that you should keep in mind next time you contemplate hiking in bear country.



    (They have also found that bear are attracted by residual bear spray, but they don't tell you that and they summarily dismiss that this cast doubts on its effectiveness. Here is a quote from the same article; "I have heard that bear spray actually attracts bears? Who would want to use something that does that?


    A: I published a paper in 1998 in the Wildlife Society Bulletin (Vol. 26: 92-94) demonstrating that some Alaskan brown bears (Ursus arctos horribilis) were attracted to bear pepper spray residues. I decided to conduct this work after I’d observed a bear vigorously rolling in pepper spray residues put down by a person who had hoped that the spray would repel bears from his floatplane tied to the beach. It hadn’t worked and his neoprene float covers were damaged. Now here I was watching a bear vigorously scent rub in the orangish stain on the beach. “What if this stuff actually attracted bears?” I began to worry, but not whether or not the spray worked as a bear deterrent but rather regarding their interest in residues on objects regardless of how they got there. I reflected on the fact that only days before I had shown a new field assistant how to use pepper spray... by discharging it just outside my field camp perimeter. It never occurred to me that the residue might prove troublesome. What if this residue actually attracted bears? Considering this further, I knew of people who had applied pepper spray to objects in the hopes of repelling bears from them. I even knew of a PhD bear research scientist who lectured on bear safety and had suggested that spray could be used in this manner to protect items that couldn’t be otherwise protected from curious bears. I felt I needed to further investigate because property and people could possibly be injured by this misuse of the product.


    For this research I sprayed red pepper spray directly onto the ground then sat back and observed bears' reactions to it. Many bears were clearly attracted to spray residues, some vigorously head rubbing, back rolling, pawing and eating the soils tainted with spray. I also observed some bears responding to these sites for up to a 5 days after spray application. So not only were they attracted to it but for some time after it had been dispensed. So I published a short note hoping to warn others of the potential dangers associated with misuse of the product.



    Some persons have concluded that because pepper spray was shown to elicit and hold a bear’s interest is ought not be used as a deterrent. Does this make any sense? Of course not." It does to me.)


    What other benefits are there to carrying bear pepper spray versus a firearm?


    A: Not only are firearms in of themselves a hazard to carry but consider for a moment that a bear has charged and you’ve killed it. Now you’ve a real dilemma because in Alaska this is termed a Defense of Life or Property (DLOP) incident and you, as the shooter must skin the bear and turn the hide, claws and skull into the nearest Fish and Game agent. There will be paperwork to fill out, explanations, and this all takes time. Have you ever skinned a bear? I doubt most of you have. It is a nasty, difficult job. What if this happened miles from the nearest road? You’re going to have to decide whether or not you can pack the hide, skull and claws out or not and justify that response to Fish and Game. What about the carcass? You’ve now created a kill site and other bears can be expected to be drawn to it. If it is along a major trail that carcass must be moved or other persons may find themselves in the same circumstance you were just in and may be injured, or worse. An average Alaskan bear will weigh hundreds of pounds... how do you move that? What if you shot at the bear but didn’t kill it or are unsure? Now someone is going to have to go after that bear and finish the job or verify that it was indeed killed. Trailing a wounded bear is very, very dangerous and has resulted in a number of serious injuries and deaths over the years here in Alaska. My point in having this discussion is to help you realize that firearms carry with them some hefty responsibilities and when successfully used (about half the time) they result in other consequences that you may well want to not get involved in. I would seriously think about this before opting to carry a gun rather than bear pepper spray next time you hike. Even if you are a hunter who has a firearm on your person, I would highly recommend that bear pepper spray be a part of your gear because unless you are bear hunting, killing a bear will impact your hunt in a negative way, not to mention the impact of the ecosystem losing a bear for no good reason.



    (So their reason to not carry a gun is because guns are dangerous...OOOOOOooooo.... and if you do shoot a bear you have a nasty job ahead of you. They would rather be dead than clean a bear.)



    I would rather place my faith in something I am well practiced in using...My gun.

    Tarzan




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    http://www.bio-medicine.org/biology-...-shows-2621-1/

    Seems BYU did a statistical study on pepper spray use detering brown bear attacks in Alaska. They say spray is 98% effective and guns are only 67% effective.:shock:

    But remember brown bears attack for different reasons than black bears and mountain lions do, so defense methods might not carry over. Brown bears are usually defending their territory and "attacks" are usually actually bluff charges that will end when they don't perceive you as a threat or get a face full of pepper spray. Black bears and mountain lions, usually attack because you have done something that causes their primative brain to identify you as prey. Conventional wisdom is to react very differently to attacks by these different animals. Playing dead, for instance, is supposed to work with brown bears but will just get you eaten faster by a black bear or a mountain lion. With a black bear or mountain lion you are supposed to make noise, try to appear big and fight hard as needed. My theory is that pepper spray may be better for Alaska, Montana, etc., but a gun would be more effective against the black bears, mountain lions, feral dogs, crazed maniacs, gangbangers, etc. you find outside grizzly country.

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    It seems to me it wouldn't be a bad idea to carry both bear spray and a handgun. If time allows I could draw both. Handgun in dominant hand and spray in weak hand.

    If dealing with a non-aggressive bear that is getting too close the spray could make him decide to leave.

    If the bear is charging then spaying and shooting could be more effective then just shooting. Guns have not been %100 effective with bear incidents either. This seems to be from failures to make a critical hit to stop the bear. A bear both having bullets hit him and running into a stinging cloud might change his mind more often than just being shot. A bear doesn't understand the cause and effect of the two legged animal and his bang stick and the pain of the gunshots. Also, there can be a significant delay between bullet impact and pain.

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    Huck wrote:
    deepdiver wrote:
    The bear spray I have looked at is of the fogger variety. For example, UDAP bear spray is 3.3 million SHU and puts out about a 30' long cloud of fog. From my understanding, a bear's nose and mouth lining is so sensitive that hitting that cloud of OC generally causes them to stop/slow down quickly as they do so it causes them to remain even longer in the OC cloud further deterring them.

    Again, as I understand things, with humans, OC spray is meant to incapacitate the perp and cause such pain, discomfort and eye irritation that they are unable to continue fighting (which is why it is of limited use on druggies who are high on substances that reduce or eliminate their pain response) whereas with bears, it does not incapacitate but rather deters/discourages them from continuing the attack and once the attack/focus is broken, your survivability increases dramatically.
    You mean you hope it works against bears. Has anyone acually used any of this bear spray and lived to tell about it? The boondocks areas here in the northern rockies are Grizzly Bear country and those animals are increadibly tough and to rely on something that I doubt has ever been used against one in a for real attack in the boondocks is nuts.

    One thing to keep in mind too. That spray was probably tested on captive animals in a carefullycontrolled situationwho were not agitated until after they got sprayed. A bear in the wild who attacks is most likely defending young and/or territory so they're gonna be pretty much like a freaked out druggie, where the spray may have no more effect except to piss off the bear more.

    Whenever I'm in Grizz country I have old tried and proven with me, and it's got a longer reach than a can of spray doesbut even a .45-70 is not guarenteed to stop 'ol Grizz.

    http://www.marlinfirearms.com/firear...bore/1895G.asp
    Yes, people have used it successfully on bears. Numerous accounts of successfully deterring bear attacks in the wild with bear spray can be found if one takes a few minutes to search for them online. I have not investigated them specifically for stories of effectiveness, if any, against grizzlies.

    Anyway, the OP was not about what to use to kill bears in case of attack, but rather the relative effectiveness of or concept of using a tazer rather than bear spray in the wild.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    :shock:

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    WARNING BEAR COUNTRY
    Department of Fish and Game

    You are in bear country. It is advisable that you wear bells either attached to your ankles or wrists. This will help you not walk up and surprise a bear while feeding or going about its daily routine. Carry pepper spray in case of you do encounter a bear. It is also important to be able to identify bear sign. If you find grizzly bear sign it is recommended that you vacate the area as Grizzly Bear have been known to be aggressive towards human beings, Tracks are one key indicator of bears. Black and grizzly bears have very different tracks. The most important difference in the two bears feet are in the length of the claws. Black bears have shorter claws, while the long claws of a grizzly can extend up to 10 cm (3.9 in). When identifying tracks, there are numerous characteristics to look for. While claw length can help identify those tracks with clear imprints, there are two more reliable indicators of species. Black bear tracks tend to have the toes slightly separated, whereas grizzly tracks show toes that are usually joined together. Also, the arc of the toes is greater in black bears. It is also possible to identify bear species by their scat. Black bear scat has a musty old cigar odor its appearance varies quite dramatically based on what the bear is eating at a particular time of year. During August, when the bears are fattening up on buffaloberries, the scat takes on a blackish-red appearance with plenty of buffaloberry seeds visible. Grizzly bear scat is somewhat larger and will have the remains of roots, or tubers, black bears lack the claws to reliably dig up these plants. Grizzly bear scat will also contain small metal bells and may smell of pepper spray.


    Pretty much sums it up for me. I would never use a taser or pepper spray in a conflict with a bear, never ever. I think it rates right up there with rubbing bacon fat all over myself before going into bear territory. I do not rely on my .45 as it may not have adequate penetration. I know from personal experince a broadhead will not penetrate or stick a bear's skull. My faith in a taser having adequate penetration is nil. If I really feel the need I have carried my pack rifle a Marlin 45/70. If I had the cash to spend I' love to have a .500 cal BMF from Reeds Custom Guns but I don't so I won't. Nor would I ever consider using pepper spray on a bear. Most every time I have run into a bear (not as often that might sound though we do have one on the hill we live on) a couple of yells will run them off if not a shot into the ground has done the track. Attacking one with pepper spray and that is what it is an attack changes the scenario from a chance meeting into one of aggression and hostility. Pepper spray has a good possibility of doing nothing more than ticking the bear off and making me responsible fro creating a situation that will require I kill an innocent bear if I can get to my gun fast enough. Since my hand was busy using pepper spray, I have a good chance of being bear slapped before I can pump a round into him/her.
    If you want to avoid conflict with bear do not lure them in with food. Keep your food sealed and out of reach. Leave their cubs alone. Show them some respect and stand your ground. In turn they will be respectful of you while you visit their home

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    tarzan1888 wrote:
    ...snip
    A: I published a paper in 1998 in the Wildlife Society Bulletin (Vol. 26: 92-94) demonstrating that some Alaskan brown bears (Ursus arctos horribilis) were attracted to bear pepper spray residues. I decided to conduct this work after I’d observed a bear vigorously rolling in pepper spray residues put down by a person who had hoped that the spray would repel bears from his floatplane tied to the beach. It hadn’t worked and his neoprene float covers were damaged. Now here I was watching a bear vigorously scent rub in the orangish stain on the beach.
    snip...


    I saw a program either on Discovery Channel of National Geographics Channel that was about bears and attacks. They sprayed bear repellant on the ground and set up a camera. A little while later a bear showed updid exactly as stated above. It sat in the spot that was sprayed and then rolled over and rolled in it like a dog that found something stinky to roll in.

    There is no way I am going to risk my life on a can of spray! If I plan on being in bear country and I havean encounter with one, don't anyone bet on the bear.
    Revelation 1911 - And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

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    While I carry a .44 mag as backup when hunting in bear country. I wouldn't even consider a tazer. First off bears have thick fur. The tazer probe would catch on it and IMO wouldn't even make contact with the skin. Unless the electrical charge passes from probe to bear through the hair and hide its pointless. You would have to hit it in an area with little or very short hair. Mainly the head. Good luck doing that if its charging you. Don't forget that you have to have a clear area to shoot as well. If your in an overgrown or dense area with little range your good as lunch or at best a play toy. I have a friend in Maine thats a bear guide and he gives everyone a can while in the field. In many cases they are proven to work if used correctly.
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    mobeewan wrote:
    I saw a program either on Discovery Channel of National Geographics Channel that was about bears and attacks. They sprayed bear repellant on the ground and set up a camera. A little while later a bear showed updid exactly as stated above. It sat in the spot that was sprayed and then rolled over and rolled in it like a dog that found something stinky to roll in.
    Well, Firearms aren't much better! I saw a thing on tv once where they shot a bunch into the ground, then set up a camera.A little while later a bear showed up, picked up the empty casings, dug the bullets out of the dirt, then went back to his cave and reloaded them...

    ...I just don't know if I'd trust those reloads...
    ...Orygunner...

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    I dont by that BYU study. Talked to way too many people who thought that their .45 or their 357 was good enough for their bear encounter. Break it down by ammunition used and you would likely find a difference on what works and what doesnt. A 9mm vs spray, I would take the spray. A 12ga slug followed by 00 buck vs spray, I will take the 12ga.

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    Orygunner wrote:
    Well, Firearms aren't much better! I saw a thing on tv once where they shot a bunch into the ground, then set up a camera.A little while later a bear showed up, picked up the empty casings, dug the bullets out of the dirt, then went back to his cave and reloaded them...

    ...I just don't know if I'd trust those reloads...
    ...Orygunner...
    Ah-ha! It all makes sense now...



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    Orygunner wrote:
    mobeewan wrote:
    I saw a program either on Discovery Channel of National Geographics Channel that was about bears and attacks. They sprayed bear repellant on the ground and set up a camera. A little while later a bear showed updid exactly as stated above. It sat in the spot that was sprayed and then rolled over and rolled in it like a dog that found something stinky to roll in.
    Well, Firearms aren't much better! I saw a thing on tv once where they shot a bunch into the ground, then set up a camera.A little while later a bear showed up, picked up the empty casings, dug the bullets out of the dirt, then went back to his cave and reloaded them...

    ...I just don't know if I'd trust those reloads...
    ...Orygunner...

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    Pointman wrote:
    .44 Magnum followed by .44 Magnum, I'd take the .44 Magnum. Wait, I did take that. The grisly that saw me steered clear, too. (True story in northern Wyoming.)

    Actually, I think I told that one before. Everyone laughed at me until one day when we were eating lunch and were surrounded by wolves. Something about not being able to aim fast enough through their rifle scopes...I just laughed and said they shouldn't eat all of their sandwiches.
    Maybe you should carry a BMF. Now that is a bear pistol I doubt folks would laugh at
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    Pointman wrote:
    imperialism2024 wrote:
    :shock:
    Definitely in need of heavy seasoning.....

    ------

    Here's what I didn't know:

    - Bear spray emits flavor fog instead of a scream stream. Having spent time in the woods, I realize that wind tends to circle around in many areas instead of coming from one direction. Bears will generally approach from down-wind, meaning the fog, in theory, will be carried toward them. In practice: "I think I just seasoned myself."

    - Bears actually like the seasoning, to the point of eating seasoned dirt. If I escaped one attack I'm setting myself up for another, especially when in the mountains on a 3-day pack-in.

    - If bear spray creates a fog so you can hit a fast-moving bear, a bad-guy will probably avoid the scream stream and TKO yo azz.

    - Hissing like a snake might work, dropping a rank-bomb might work, and using a .44 magnum to fire an ear-shattering warning shot might work. If those don't work, use the .44 to blow out one shoulder, then the other.

    - From the video, a high-powered stun gun for non-human use will stun a bull, a Taser mightstun a bull, but as soon as the 30-second timeout hits, you're ground Chuck. A bear will probably do the same to you, just faster, given bears are hunters. So the answer is that a Taser is not a good means of self-defense against a bear.

    - Bear "experts" aren't experts, aren't overly smart, and apparently love to waste money (at least as far as I've seen and in relation to those commenting on the effectiveness of pepper spray).
    --- Almost all predators instincts are triggered by the predator-prey relationship, and bears are not one of the exceptions--that's been known for years, and simply discounting "running" as something related to dogs is complete idiocy.
    --- 42 bear attacks isn't even a year's worth of data, much less enough information for any sort of reasonable statistical basis. No real conclusions can be drawn from 42 discreet events, given the area the events occur over, the number of bear-human interactions, changes in environment over time, other mitigating factors, etc. In other words, the "expert study" is fairly useless.
    --- A database is extremely expensive to set up, given everything is custom for government work, as it usually deals with "the mainframe." I can track 42 bears on two legal-sized pieces of paper, and I'm a software engineer! If I say a sheet of paper is the best tool for the job, it probably is!

    One thing thorvaldr's post reminded me of is that Alaskan natives carry big rifles, not pepper spray. I'm also betting they know something about bears.

    Since an enraged human is like a non-enraged bear, mostly, pepper spray and Tasers aren't great defensive weapons in some cases. I'm still thinking of carrying pepper spray, although I'm not sure where I'd put it. (Yeah, I know what you're thinking.) I'm out of room on my belt, and ain't stickin' it there...

    ----
    Thanks Tarzan for the hilariously accurate translation.
    Think you for the very logical and intuitive observations.

    I just got back from a long weekend where I took the Scouts out looking at some Indian sites. this is my first time back at the computer since last Wednesday.



    Tarzan

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    Orygunner wrote:
    mobeewan wrote:
    I saw a program either on Discovery Channel of National Geographics Channel that was about bears and attacks. They sprayed bear repellant on the ground and set up a camera. A little while later a bear showed updid exactly as stated above. It sat in the spot that was sprayed and then rolled over and rolled in it like a dog that found something stinky to roll in.
    Well, Firearms aren't much better! I saw a thing on tv once where they shot a bunch into the ground, then set up a camera.A little while later a bear showed up, picked up the empty casings, dug the bullets out of the dirt, then went back to his cave and reloaded them...

    ...I just don't know if I'd trust those reloads...
    ...Orygunner...







    Tarzan


  24. #24
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    Here is a story, just to get you thinking;

    http://www.stocksandnews.com/searchr...date=2/12/2007

    "Craig Medred, Anchorage Daily News:

    “The grizzly bear that fell dead, almost miraculously, inches
    from the feet of Doug White last fall changed his life, possibly
    forever. Near-death experiences have a way of doing that.

    “When the bear came seemingly out of nowhere near Dillingham
    and the shooting started, White thought he and moose-hunting
    partner Reed Thompson were dead.

    “In the blink of an eye, they found themselves in the center of a
    chaotic reality that seemed more like some crazy dream. There
    was the dead moose they had shot on the ground, a grizzly bear
    that wanted the moose almost on top of them, and only a .44-
    caliber Magnum handgun with which to defend themselves.”

    It seems the two had already killed the moose, returned to their
    riverboat to retrieve their backpacks and mentally shifted from
    being hunters to packers.

    “As they headed back to their moose kill, it was mainly out of
    habit that the two Dillingham men grabbed Thompson’s pistol
    along with the knives they would need for butchering, game bags
    and backpacks for hauling 600 or 700 pounds of food. Adding
    heavy rifles to the burden seemed like a lot of unnecessary effort.
    But the .44-Mag was light enough and compact enough they
    grabbed it as a precaution: Better to be safe than sorry.”

    But for all the animals Alaska’s hunters kill over the course of a
    year, rarely does a grizzly try and take it from them. It’s only
    now, though, that Doug White has decided to write about his
    incident from last September.

    “With darkness approaching, we decided to remove the top front
    and rear quarters of the moose, tie them to our pack frames, gut
    the moose out, and then roll the behemoth over to cool through
    the night. We would return in the morning to finish up.”

    But as they were taking out the internal organs, and “As Reed
    pulled the heart out [oops…sorry…I didn’t warn you
    beforehand] and tossed it behind us, a loud ‘HUFF’ snapped us
    to our feet.”

    “Turning around, we saw standing before us, on hind legs, a
    large, chocolate-brown grizzly bear. The next minute seemed to
    last an eternity. The term surreal is so overused, but it was
    dreamlike, bizarre, fantastic and unreal.

    “The bear was standing next to the tree where the pistol was
    hanging. We both started shouting and waving our arms back
    and forth as we moved somewhat to our right toward the tail end
    of the moose. The bear came down off his back legs, onto all
    fours and started circling to his right – toward the head of the
    bull. My only thought was to get to the gun so that we could
    scare him off.

    “I sensed that he charged from the head of the moose as I broke
    for the gun. Reed commented later that the bear vaulted over the
    moose and went straight for him. Halfway to the tree, I tripped
    on a fallen log and went down on all fours.

    “From my peripheral, I saw the bear going after Reed, who had
    moved into the tall grass. It appeared that the bear had knocked
    Reed down and was standing over him. My worst fear was that
    my friend was being mauled.

    “I grabbed the holster but was unable to remove the revolver
    regardless of how hard I tugged. As I looked up, I saw the bear
    charging toward me.

    “I started backing up as I continued screaming and hollering at
    the bear….With the bear almost on top of me, I fell over another
    log. I did a back drop and felt him grab my left leg. His huge
    head was above my lap, just out of reach of my holstered club.”

    White tried to shoot through the holster but that failed.

    “Just when I thought all was lost, the bear rose up, pivoted 90
    degrees to his left and was gone. The grizzly had charged back
    in the direction of Reed as he had jumped up and yelled once
    again.”

    Reed dropped back down into the tall grass and he could hear the
    bear sniffing for him, as Doug White was finally able to get the
    gun out of the holster. But now the bear was charging back at
    him again.

    “I pointed the revolver and fired at center mass. The .44
    magnum boomed in the night and the bear fell straight down, his
    head three feet away from I stood.”

    But if you thought the two’s troubles were over, that night a
    wicked storm hit the area, with winds of 60-70 mph. Cold and
    wet, they rigged up a tent and weathered it. Two days later they
    made it back to Dillingham. And the biggest mystery remains
    how it was that the bear was felled with just one shot from a .44. "



    Tarzan

  25. #25
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Wow, exciting story.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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