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Thread: Courthouses, town offices, and § 18.2-283.1 and § 15.2-915

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    The signs are preempted. VCDL needs to know this, also. Since you're down that way, you may want to take this upon yourself to advise the town that these signs have no weight, due to preemption and should come down. I did like your statement -
    "... are all across town about three or four blocks away."
    I know, Wytheville isn't real big.

    Edit - I remember some town in your neck of the woods with this same issue and Phillip Van Cleave attended a town meeting, but I'm thinking it may have been Boone's Mill.

    Edit#2 - Yep, it was Boone's Mill

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    Bill in VA wrote:
    SNIP Under §18.2-283.1I know...
    Oh, ho, ho, ho.

    Sounds like its timefor an e-mail to VCDL.

    Welcome to your first chance to tackle a 2A activist assignment.

    Go get 'em!

    (Plus, if the metal detectors came after 15.2-915, you can fuss at them for wasting the town's money on the purchase.)


    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    It's a carryover from the old days. I know Wytheville well. It's part of my old stomping ground. Expect some resistance. Even though that's gun country, the feeling is that guns are for hunting and Municipal property is their kingdom to regulate as they please.

    Until you slap them in the face with it, they will ignore the law. Radford almost succeeded from the Commonwealth when VCDL insisted they remove old signs.



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    peter nap wrote:
    SNIP Radford almost succeeded from the Commonwealth...
    There is something to be said for an anti-authority attitude like that.

    Virginians have a history of that sort of thing, y'know.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Citizen wrote:
    peter nap wrote:
    SNIP Radford almost succeeded from the Commonwealth...
    There is something to be said for an anti-authority attitude like that.

    Virginians have a history of that sort of thing, y'know.
    I just don't understand that Citizen. I've always been so passive and cooperative myself

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Some time ago there was a thread about a fellow who got burned (or almost burned) for carrying IIRC an AR magazine into a courthouse, and the whole issue of what is and is not a courthouse was dissected.

    I recall posting a somewhat interesting Court of Appeals decision about the portions of a multi-use building that hosted both courts and other municipal administrative offices. Unfortunately, my google-fu is quite weak today - after several attempts to search for the thread I cannot find it.

    Can anyone else locate that thread? I ask not because I want everyone to bask in the glory of my interpretations of the law, but because the issue was well hashed out by the membership and a rather good consensus was reached on the issue and how to deal with "No Guns" postings by municipalities.

    stay safe.

    skidmark

    * edit to add:

    OK, I found part of what I was looking for, but not the giy with the AR magazine - yet!

    read this: http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum54/10913.html

    * and my google-fu is still down, but a page-by-page search finally led me back to the guy arrested at the courthouse for having an AR magazine - read about it and the discussion of what is and is not a courthouse here: http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum54/5830.html.

    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Bill in VA wrote:
    (I still haven't found a definition of "courthouse" in state code or regulations though.)
    You will not find a definitition of "courthouse" in the Code of Virginia. That's why the link to the Supreme Court decision http://www.virginia1774.org/CourthouseArea.html. The decision is an interpretation of what the law means, and unless changed by a later ruling (this decision has not been overturned, reversed or amended, by subsequent decsions) is the "law of the land."

    From what you have posted, the "No Guns" issue is completely unlegal and ought to be illegal but, alas, the Code does not impose any penalty. If you went in and were either denied service because of your "violation" of the sign, or were arrested for "violating" the sign's instruction, you could sue - probably under 42 CFR 1983.

    stay safe.

    skidmark
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

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    Bill in VA wrote:
    Thanks for the clarification, Skidmark. However, I think you mean 42USC Ch21 1983 (civil action for deprivation of rights) rather than 42CFR 1983 (42CFR refers to public health.)
    Hey, denying a man the right to protect himself could be downright unhealthy for the public!

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Bill in VA wrote:
    Thanks for the clarification, Skidmark. However, I think you mean 42USC Ch21 1983 (civil action for deprivation of rights) rather than 42CFR 1983 (42CFR refers to public health.)
    Correct you are sir. I'mgoing to admit guilt but with the extenuating circumstance of a total lack of caffiene. Mea culpa.

    Oh, please Mr. Brother Bill, don't make me shoot no boxes of WWB as punishment! Please, Mr. Brother Bill, anything but that! (with apologies to Uncle Remus)

    stay safe.

    skidmark
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

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    Alas, two (2) months later the sign is gone.

    Read and rejoyce. http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum54/16817.html

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member paramedic70002's Avatar
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    Before I go reading through a bunch of court cases, can anyone answer this...

    Court clerks and Judges offices, not in the same building as the courthouse. Sometimes the Judge conducts judicial hearings in his office.

    Carry legal or not in the offices?
    "Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18

    Guns Save Lives. Paramedics Save Lives. But...
    Paramedics With Guns Scare People!

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