I stand corrected. . .sort of

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OK, I found this link, and I thought I would share it with the group. I still don't think that anyone should vote on this issue alone, but it definitely gives me pause. Truthfully, I can't imagine voting for either of these idiots, but what's a freedom-loving citizen to do? On the other hand, Obama has been moving toward the middle for quite some time now, so I'm not sure that he won't move more center on this issue, too. I'll keep an eye out for anything new.

http://www.ontheissues.org/2008/barack_obama_gun_control.htm

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Surely you aren't claiming the positions resulting from the "move to the middle" represent anything about how Obama would actually govern, do you?

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kparker wrote:

Surely you aren't claiming the positions resulting from the "move to the middle" represent anything about how Obama would actually govern, do you?

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+1 As John and Mike have asked us to stick to firearm related discussion, it is difficult to discuss the matter from anything beyond a single issue voting matter while sticking to the forum rules. However, it is clear that Barack is not only not a friend to 2A rights, he is downright hostile to 2A rights, especially OC and CC by non-LEO citizens.

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kparker wrote:

Surely you aren't claiming the positions resulting from the "move to the middle" represent anything about how Obama would actually govern, do you?

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+ another 1. The man has been against civilian gun ownership all his life but now, coincidentally during a political campaign, he has seen the light and now understands constitutional rights?

Right.

MD

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You all are spreading unsubstantiated fear... You must be the same audience that frequents the airwaves of limbaugh, Savage and the rest of the hate spewing fanatics!

Be safe...

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Remember, campaign promises aren't promises, only lies.

As to the election, I want a third choice:

None of the above, start over and try and get it right for once.

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One of the problems we have in this country is that too many people actually believe the campaign speeches of politicians. If a cantidate moves either way during his campaigh it is only to fool people into voting for him where he has discovered that his beliefs are not those of the people.

Base you judgement on what he has done in the past. Once a cantidate is elected he will not govern differently than what he has done in the past. Obama has shied away from voting on many critical bills during his tenure in the Senate by voting present rather than actually making a decision. He will continue that while as president, failing to mke important decisions rather depending on others to make that for him. His entiere campaign is being run by his entourage and he is simply a figurehead. When voting for Obama you are not voting gor him but his cast of hanger-ons that are taking full advantage of his popularity.

Remember that when a cantidate starts to shift his platfor it just shows that his opinions are not those of the people but it is no indication of his true belief.

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What exactly about his comments makes you feel warm and fuzzy on the inside? He dodges nearly every question and includes vageries when pressed on specifics. The fact that he thinks the DC gun ban was constitutional is idiotic. If it is an individuals right to be able own firearms then how exactly is it that the state or even city can go ahead and say no guns because someone might have an illegal gun. I'm sorry but I read nothing throughout that entire article that makes me think he is moving anywhere near the center on this issue. At least Kerry tried to look manly by going hunting in a pathetic attempt to make people think he was pro gun, Obama just wants to take our 2A away from us, all you have to do is look at his very very short voting record.

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Dukester wrote:

You all are spreading unsubstantiated fear... You must be the same audience that frequents the airwaves of limbaugh, Savage and the rest of the hate spewing fanatics!

Be safe...

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I read a lot of different blogs from a lot of different perspectives during the week. I read a lot of different news outlets. I used to listen to a lot of different radio programs on my computer at work daily. Of the entire spectrum of sites I regularly visited or listened to over the last 3 years, I will say unequivicolly that the most virulent hatred I have read and heard from "main stream" sites on a regular basis have been from DU, Daily Kos, Huffington Post and Randi Rhodes former Air America program and to a lesser degree Keith Olberman's show (which I while hate filled and vitriolic, he is such an idiot and buffoon, that it is more of a comedy than a diatribe and I do not get upset with his followers, only pity them for their ignorance and lack of critical thinking skills). I am so tired of the constant name calling and pot shots. That is why I stopped visiting the above sites. I'm tired of seeing it on OCDO also and we did not see it until recently primarily by new and/or previously low activity members. That is not what OCDO is about.

As to spreading upsubstantiated fear, I have 1) looked up his voting record in IL legislature 2) looked up and reviewed his entire Congressional voting record 3) have seen video clips of, heard recordings of or read main stream recognized news source stories substantially confirming what is claimed in the link Scarlett1125 posted in the OP. These are facts. Obama's anti-gun, anti-self-defense, anti-carry, pro-gun confiscation positions have been on record for many years. People who live in IL or who follow IL politics (I do) are well aware of these positions as they have not ever been a secret until his recent run for president.

To call reporting these facts regarding Obama's anti-gun, anti-self-defense, anti-carry, pro-gun confiscation positions "spreading unsubstantiated fear" requires a willful suspension of disbelief as Mrs. Clinton would say, a gross act of willful ignorance or a willful act of prevarication.

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Dukester wrote:

You all are spreading unsubstantiated fear... You must be the same audience that frequents the airwaves of limbaugh, Savage and the rest of the hate spewing fanatics!

Be safe...

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The only "the rest of the hate spewing fanatic!"here is you with trying to sell Obama's lies and deceit. Why don't you go somewhere where some moronmight actually believe you fantasy story.

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Bear 45/70 wrote:

Dukester wrote:

You all are spreading unsubstantiated fear... You must be the same audience that frequents the airwaves of limbaugh, Savage and the rest of the hate spewing fanatics!

Be safe...

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The only "the rest of the hate spewing fanatic!"here is you with trying to sell Obama's lies and deceit. Why don't you go somewhere where some moronmight actually believe you fantasy story.

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Cause I like hanging around with you right wing neo nuts. You folksare so narrow minded who only vote on one issue and one issue only and that is guns or your gun rights and you constantly live in fear... Nobody and I mean nobody is going to take your guns away from you. Hell, I have a P220 a long with a SP101. You act like there has never been a democrat in office! Guess what, to me ourlong term energy problems and the Iraq/Afganistan messtrumps anyissues out there plain and simple.

Go ahead live in fear... Be like the little sheepyou are. Hell, even the NRA is freaking out now cause theygot caughtwith there pants down, oops...

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Bear 45/70 wrote:

Dukester wrote:

You all are spreading unsubstantiated fear... You must be the same audience that frequents the airwaves of limbaugh, Savage and the rest of the hate spewing fanatics!

Be safe...

Click to expand...

The only "the rest of the hate spewing fanatic!"here is you with trying to sell Obama's lies and deceit. Why don't you go somewhere where some moronmight actually believe you fantasy story.

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Yep, that is why Doc (Pyshco) Savagehad some ads pulled from his show making vial and hateful comments regarding Autistic Children... Savage is a freak.

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Dukester wrote:

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I rest my case.

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Dukester wrote:

Bear 45/70 wrote:

Dukester wrote:

You all are spreading unsubstantiated fear... You must be the same audience that frequents the airwaves of limbaugh, Savage and the rest of the hate spewing fanatics!

Be safe...

Click to expand...

The only "the rest of the hate spewing fanatic!"here is you with trying to sell Obama's lies and deceit. Why don't you go somewhere where some moronmight actually believe you fantasy story.

Click to expand...

Cause I like hanging around with you right wing neo nuts. You folksare so narrow minded who only vote on one issue and one issue only and that is guns or your gun rights and you constantly live in fear... Nobody and I mean nobody is going to take your guns away from you. Hell, I have a P220 a long with a SP101. You act like there has never been a democrat in office! Guess what, to me ourlong term energy problems and the Iraq/Afganistan messtrumps anyissues out there plain and simple.

Go ahead live in fear... Be like the little sheepyou are. Hell, even the NRA is freaking out now cause theygot caughtwith there pants down, oops...

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Please explain this in the context of the last 30 years in Washington DC. While I realize the good people of DC have recently won a victory, they most certainly had their guns effectively taken away for the last 30 years. Please note that I'm not asking for a political debate. I'd just like to know how you can believe your statement to be true.

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ThunderRanch wrote

Please explain this in the context of the last 30 years in Washington DC. While I realize the good people of DC have recently won a victory, they most certainly had their guns effectively taken away for the last 30 years. Please note that I'm not asking for a political debate. I'd just like to know how you can believe your statement to be true.

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I'm thinking he's never heard of the Lautenberg Amendment, the Hughes Amendment to the FOPA, the Sporting Purposes clause, the 1968 Gun Control Act, the 1934 National Firearms Act or the 1994 Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act all of which did take guns away that or he's still cranky because they finally found out about Mary Lou McFate

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FE427TP wrote:

ThunderRanch wrote

Please explain this in the context of the last 30 years in Washington DC. While I realize the good people of DC have recently won a victory, they most certainly had their guns effectively taken away for the last 30 years. Please note that I'm not asking for a political debate. I'd just like to know how you can believe your statement to be true.

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I'm thinking he's never heard of the Lautenberg Amendment, the Hughes Amendment to the FOPA, the Sporting Purposes clause, the 1968 Gun Control Act, the 1934 National Firearms Act or the 1994 Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act all of which did take guns away that or he's still cranky because they finally found out about Mary Lou McFate

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And we still have our guns, right? Not really cranky about Mary Lou McFate being a mole, just funny she got caught and now the NRA is embarressed by the uncovering of her. Hell, LaPierre is probably sweating out his 6 or 7 figure salary. Cranky, na...

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Dukester wrote:

FE427TP wrote:

ThunderRanch wrote

Please explain this in the context of the last 30 years in Washington DC. While I realize the good people of DC have recently won a victory, they most certainly had their guns effectively taken away for the last 30 years. Please note that I'm not asking for a political debate. I'd just like to know how you can believe your statement to be true.

Click to expand...

I'm thinking he's never heard of the Lautenberg Amendment, the Hughes Amendment to the FOPA, the Sporting Purposes clause, the 1968 Gun Control Act, the 1934 National Firearms Act or the 1994 Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act all of which did take guns away that or he's still cranky because they finally found out about Mary Lou McFate

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And we still have our guns, right? Not really cranky about Mary Lou McFate being a mole, just funny she got caught and now the NRA is embarressed by the uncovering of her. Hell, LaPierre is probably sweating out his 6 or 7 figure salary. Cranky, na...

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Your really are a moron, why should the NRA be embarrassed. She's been in place for years and yearsand the nitwit anti gunners just found out and they didn't actually dig her out, someone else did. Not only that but it's not even illegal so BFD!

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Bear 45/70 wrote:

Dukester wrote:

FE427TP wrote:

ThunderRanch wrote

Please explain this in the context of the last 30 years in Washington DC. While I realize the good people of DC have recently won a victory, they most certainly had their guns effectively taken away for the last 30 years. Please note that I'm not asking for a political debate. I'd just like to know how you can believe your statement to be true.

Click to expand...

I'm thinking he's never heard of the Lautenberg Amendment, the Hughes Amendment to the FOPA, the Sporting Purposes clause, the 1968 Gun Control Act, the 1934 National Firearms Act or the 1994 Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act all of which did take guns away that or he's still cranky because they finally found out about Mary Lou McFate

Click to expand...

And we still have our guns, right? Not really cranky about Mary Lou McFate being a mole, just funny she got caught and now the NRA is embarressed by the uncovering of her. Hell, LaPierre is probably sweating out his 6 or 7 figure salary. Cranky, na...

Click to expand...

Your really are a moron, why should the NRA be embarrassed. She's been in place for years and yearsand the nitwit anti gunners just found out and they didn't actually dig her out, someone else did. Not only that but it's not even illegal so BFD!

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We have now resorted to name calling, tsk tsk. I thought you were better than that but I guess I was wrong. You are just another half crazed Neo Con Nut... You are just a freak!