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Thread: Carry at Redrock?

  1. #1
    inNV
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    By Redrock, I of course mean the park, not the casino. Can you OC or CC at Redrock if you go hiking?

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    I can't cite any regulations, but I was asked to leave a state park once because I had a weapon. I was bowfishing at the Floyd Lamb state park off of Durango and a park volunteer informed me of the law. I thought it was stupid, I've got a bow, an arrow, and arrow is attached to the bow with a string. Can't really go on a killing spree with that kind of "weapon"

  3. #3
    inNV
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    What law did he inform you of? I can see you not being allowed to do that..you are not allowed to spear fish on the coast in Florida.

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    Sheepdawg wrote:
    I can't cite any regulations, but I was asked to leave a state park once because I had a weapon. I was bowfishing at the Floyd Lamb state park off of Durango and a park volunteer informed me of the law. I thought it was stupid, I've got a bow, an arrow, and arrow is attached to the bow with a string. Can't really go on a killing spree with that kind of "weapon"
    Yes, those evil ammo-recycling bows. BAN THEM ALL!!!

    /Sarcasm



    You can CC in the park, but not OC. They may try to tell you that you can't CC either, but I don't see any exceptions listed in the following that would allow them to make that rule. I believe the NAC is written by the state legislature, so it is not preempted by them. They kinda contradict themselves concerning bow and arrow (italics).
    Nevada Administrative Code
    NAC 407.105 Possession or use of weapons. (NRS 407.0475, 407.065)
    1. In any park, a person shall not:
    (a) Use a bow and arrow,slingshot or paint ball launcher;
    (b) Possess a firearm, unless:
    (1) The firearm is unloaded and inside a vehicle; or
    (2) The person in possession of the firearm has a permit to carry a concealed firearm issued pursuant to the provisions of NRS 202.3653 to 202.369, inclusive, and is carrying the firearm in conformity with the terms of the permit;
    (c) Discharge a weapon, including, without limitation, an air rifle, spring gun or air pistol; or
    (d) Throw a knife, hatchet, spear, stone or projectile,
    Ê except as authorized by the Administrator.
    2. The Administrator may designate zones in which a person may, for the purposes of hunting a species that is designated by the Board of Wildlife Commissioners as a game mammal or game bird pursuant to chapter 503 of NAC, carry and discharge a firearm or bow in accordance with the regulations of the Department of Wildlife. At each park in which a zone is designated pursuant to this subsection, the ranger in charge of the region or the supervisor of the park shall post at the headquarters of the park, and at each area within the park which is designated as a zone in which a person may carry and discharge a firearm or bow for the purposes of hunting, maps of the designated zones within that park.
    3. Target shooting is prohibited in all areas of a park, except in an area designated as a firing range.
    4. Use of a bow to kill, capture or injure a fish is prohibited within 100 feet of a swimmer.
    (Added to NAC by Div. of St. Parks, 12-31-85, eff. 1-1-86; A 3-9-88; 7-25-90; 11-12-93; 3-20-96, eff. 4-1-96; R164-97, 3-1-98; R145-99, 1-18-2000; R118-01, 12-17-2001; R149-05, 5-4-2006)

  5. #5
    inNV
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    Hey thanks for that. But that is ashame. I guess I have to wait until I get my CC to go hiking.

    I wish they would just put ALL the gun laws in one place, instead of all over the place, lol.




    Edit: could "park" mean a park like Sunset, or one of the little ones scattered around town? And not the state parks?

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    inNV wrote:
    Hey thanks for that. But that is ashame. I guess I have to wait until I get my CC to go hiking.

    I wish they would just put ALL the gun laws in one place, instead of all over the place, lol.




    Edit: could "park" mean a park like Sunset, or one of the little ones scattered around town? And not the state parks?
    In my CCW class, the instructor said it's pretty much the same with city parks.

    On the other hand, the NAC is administrative code for state agencies, so it may only apply to state parks. I'd contact the NV Attorney General about it. yeahYeah told me he had some luck getting helpful answers from them concerning gun laws.

    Edit: I've seen city parks with signs saying "No unlicensed possession of firearms" or something to the effect. That was a park run by the city.

  7. #7
    inNV
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    Ok thanks

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    Red Rock is federal property managed by the BLM.

  9. #9
    inNV
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    I thought it was, so what does it mean? Can you carry on BLM property?

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    kenny wrote:
    Red Rock is federal property managed by the BLM.
    But it is NOT a National Park and therefore is not restricted as to Concealed carry, with a permit.

    Ken

  11. #11
    inNV
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    From BLM website: I can only find pertaining to CA..

    Hunting is permitted on public lands administered by the Bureau of Land Management (BLM). State of California hunting regulations must be followed on Federal lands.

    Target Shooting is allowed on public lands. However, you must provide your own targets and remove your debris when you leave your site. It is illegal to deface or destroy trees, signs, outbuildings, or other objects on federal lands that are for the public's enjoyment. CFR 8365.1-5 (a) (1) & (2). Please use paper targets only. Shooting glass objects is prohibited.

    When you are finished target shooting, we require you to remove all your targets, gun shells, clay pigeons, and any and all items used for your target shooting.

    Bureau of Land Management California policy is to allow the use of firearms on public lands, as provided for in state law, and to cooperate with state authorities in the enforcement of firearms regulations.

    Persons have the permission of the Bureau of Land Management to possess and use firearms, including lawfully registered assault weapons, on BLM-administered public lands, except when prohibited by other applicable laws and regulations.

    Proper Access to public lands must be through public roads. Crossing private lands to access public lands is not permitted unless you first obtain permission from the private landowner. Surface management maps may help you in locating public (Federal) lands.

    Safe and prudent actions should be followed at all times, (for example shooting with a berm). As you know, the BLM is a multi-use agency, so please be aware of the other public land visitors who may be utilizing the same areas for other recreational uses, i.e., camping, hiking, biking, and rock-hounding.

    If you have specific questions on areas that may be appropriate for hunting or shooting, you are encouraged to contact the BLM Field Office having jurisdiction over the area:

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    Red Rock is posted at the entrance. The sign reads "No Loaded Weapons". At least it was there Wednesday August 13, 2008.

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    inNV wrote:
    From BLM website: I can only find pertaining to CA..

    Hunting is permitted on public lands administered by the Bureau of Land Management (BLM). State of California hunting regulations must be followed on Federal lands.

    Target Shooting is allowed on public lands. However, you must provide your own targets and remove your debris when you leave your site. It is illegal to deface or destroy trees, signs, outbuildings, or other objects on federal lands that are for the public's enjoyment. CFR 8365.1-5 (a) (1) & (2). Please use paper targets only. Shooting glass objects is prohibited.

    When you are finished target shooting, we require you to remove all your targets, gun shells, clay pigeons, and any and all items used for your target shooting.

    Bureau of Land Management California policy is to allow the use of firearms on public lands, as provided for in state law, and to cooperate with state authorities in the enforcement of firearms regulations.

    Persons have the permission of the Bureau of Land Management to possess and use firearms, including lawfully registered assault weapons, on BLM-administered public lands, except when prohibited by other applicable laws and regulations.

    Proper Access to public lands must be through public roads. Crossing private lands to access public lands is not permitted unless you first obtain permission from the private landowner. Surface management maps may help you in locating public (Federal) lands.

    Safe and prudent actions should be followed at all times, (for example shooting with a berm). As you know, the BLM is a multi-use agency, so please be aware of the other public land visitors who may be utilizing the same areas for other recreational uses, i.e., camping, hiking, biking, and rock-hounding.

    If you have specific questions on areas that may be appropriate for hunting or shooting, you are encouraged to contact the BLM Field Office having jurisdiction over the area:
    According to that, you can walk into BLM land (And I would think, if it applied to California it would apply to a much more gun-lax state like Nevada) with an AR-15 slung over your back.

    As for the sign that says "No loaded weapons", it means just that; No loaded weapons. So, if a ranger sees your gun (even if it is an AR-15), all you have to do is show him it is unloaded and he can (legally) do nothing about it. Keep a loaded mag in your pocket just in case you get attacked by a Necrophile, a Mountain Lion, or a Necrophile with a pet Mountain Lion.

    You can protect yourself, all the while staying perfectly legal. If they arrested you, all you had to do is point towards the sign and they can do nothing about it.

    My 2 cents.

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    AnakinsKid wrote:
    In my CCW class, the instructor said it's pretty much the same with city parks.



    As far as I know that NAC only applies to state parks.

    NAC 407.009[size= ]“Park” defined. (NRS 407.0475, 407.065)[size=]“Park” means any area that has been designated as a state park, historic state park, historic site, management area, monument or recreational area and is under the jurisdiction of the Division.

    (Added to NAC by Div. of St. Parks, eff. 9-13-85; A 11-12-93; R149-05, 5-4-2006)
    National parks of course are off limits to all carry.

    As far as I know, the only regulation that would be in effect inacity park (as a "roadside park"is that you could recieve a fine for "exhibiting" a firearm (NAC 408.615), which I would not consider a holstered firearm to be. Even thenthe NAC pertaining to "exhibiting firearms" is aNAC created by the dept. of transportation and I'm not totally sure (due to preemption) if its within their authority to regulate that although they have authority to regulate roadside parks in general. (NRS 408.215) saysonly "
    The Director shall adopt such regulations as may be necessary to carry out and enforce the provisions of this chapter.
    and I don't know of any provisions of the chapter that should give them that authority but I could be wrong.

    I really have no idea how much these state departments have authority to regulate firearms and I almost wonder if the division of state parks does. As far as I know, the only state department that has been given explicit authority by the legislature to make regulations concerning firearms is the department of motor vehicles and public safetyfor the purposes of regulating the CCW permit process.

    I guess the question is, does the legislature saying "The department has authority to establish regulations in a certain area" include firearm regulations or does the legislature have to actually tell them they have that authority.


    After all, the preemption codes state
    Except as otherwise provided by specific statute, the Legislature reserves for itself such rights and powers as are necessary to regulate the transfer, sale, purchase, possession, ownership, transportation, registration and licensing of firearms and ammunition in Nevada,

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    Hey, I think I just realized further insight into the definition of "exhibit" as pertaining to roadside parks.

    The department has authority to make regulations to enforce the statutes, and thestatutes says about roadside parks that...

    "NRS 408.433 Roadside parks and rest areas: Unlawful acts; penalties.

    1. It is unlawful for any person, firm, corporation, association or other entity, other than a public utility, to:

    (a) Sell, exhibit or offer for sale any goods, wares, products, merchandise or services; or

    (b) Erect, place, post or maintain any sign, billboard, placard, notice or other form of advertising,

    Ê in any roadside park or safety rest area in this state, or in the approaches thereto.

    2. Any person who violates any provision of this section or any regulation adopted under this chapter governing roadside parks or safety rest areas shall be punished by a fine of not more than $100 for a first offense and not more than $500 for each subsequent offense.

    (Added to NRS by 1979, 207)
    [/quote]
    So I would say that carrying a firearm openly in a roadside park should not constitute "exhibition" as implied by the NRS.


  16. #16
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    Specific to state parks, the NAC prohibiting weapons without a CCW is:

    NAC 407.105
    NAC 407.105[size= ]Possession or use of weapons. (NRS 407.0475, 407.065)
    1. In any park, a person shall not:

    (a) Use a bow and arrow, slingshot or paint ball launcher;

    (b) Possess a firearm, unless:

    (1) The firearm is unloaded and inside a vehicle; or

    (2) The person in possession of the firearm has a permit to carry a concealed firearm issued pursuant to the provisions of NRS 202.3653 to 202.369, inclusive, and is carrying the firearm in conformity with the terms of the permit;

    (c) Discharge a weapon, including, without limitation, an air rifle, spring gun or air pistol; or

    (d) Throw a knife, hatchet, spear, stone or projectile,

    Ê except as authorized by the Administrator.

    2. The Administrator may designate zones in which a person may, for the purposes of hunting a species that is designated by the Board of Wildlife Commissioners as a game mammal or game bird pursuant to chapter 503 of NAC, carry and discharge a firearm or bow in accordance with the regulations of the Department of Wildlife. At each park in which a zone is designated pursuant to this subsection, the ranger in charge of the region or the supervisor of the park shall post at the headquarters of the park, and at each area within the park which is designated as a zone in which a person may carry and discharge a firearm or bow for the purposes of hunting, maps of the designated zones within that park.

    3. Target shooting is prohibited in all areas of a park, except in an area designated as a firing range.

    4. Use of a bow to kill, capture or injure a fish is prohibited within 100 feet of a swimmer.

    (Added to NAC by Div. of St. Parks, 12-31-85, eff. 1-1-86; A 3-9-88; 7-25-90; 11-12-93; 3-20-96, eff. 4-1-96; R164-97, 3-1-98; R145-99, 1-18-2000; R118-01, 12-17-2001; R149-05, 5-4-2006)
    Here is what the law has to say about the ability of the division of state parks to create regulations.


    NRS 407.0475 Administrator: Regulations; penalty for violation of regulations.

    1. The Administrator shall adopt such regulations as he finds necessary for carrying out the provisions of this chapter and other provisions of law governing the operation of the Division. The regulations may include prohibitions and restrictions relating to activities within any of the park or recreational facilities within the jurisdiction of the Division.

    2. Any regulations relating to the conduct of persons within the park or recreational facilities must:

    (a) Be directed toward one or both of the following:

    (1) Prevention of damage to or misuse of the facility.

    (2) Promotion of the inspiration, use and enjoyment of the people of this State through the preservation and use of the facility.

    (b) Apply separately to each park, monument or recreational area and be designed to fit the conditions existing at that park, monument or recreational area.

    3. Any person whose conduct violates any regulation adopted pursuant to subsection 1, and who refuses to comply with the regulation upon request by any ranger or employee of the Division who has the powers of a peace officer pursuant to NRS 289.260 , is guilty of a misdemeanor.

    (Added to NRS by 1973, 978; A 1975, 801; 1977, 1130; 1985, 368; 1993, 2532)
    and

    NRS 407.065 General powers and duties of Administrator.

    1. The Administrator, subject to the approval of the Director:

    (a) Except as otherwise provided in this paragraph, may establish, name, plan, operate, control, protect, develop and maintain state parks, monuments and recreational areas for the use of the general public. The name of an existing state park, monument or recreational area may not be changed unless the Legislature approves the change by statute.

    (b) Shall protect state parks and property controlled or administered by the Division from misuse or damage and preserve the peace within those areas. The Administrator may appoint or designate certain employees of the Division to have the general authority of peace officers.

    (c) May allow multiple use of state parks and real property controlled or administered by the Division for any lawful purpose, including, but not limited to, grazing, mining, development of natural resources, hunting and fishing, in accordance with such regulations as may be adopted in furtherance of the purposes of the Division.

    (d) Shall impose and collect reasonable fees for entering, camping and boating in state parks and recreational areas. The Division shall issue, upon application therefor and proof of residency and age, an annual permit for entering, camping and boating in all state parks and recreational areas in this State to any person who is 65 years of age or older and has resided in this State for at least 5 years immediately preceding the date on which the application is submitted. The permit must be issued without charge, except that the Division shall charge and collect an administrative fee for the issuance of the permit in an amount sufficient to cover the costs of issuing the permit.

    (e) May conduct and operate such special services as may be necessary for the comfort and convenience of the general public, and impose and collect reasonable fees for such special services.

    (f) May rent or lease concessions located within the boundaries of state parks or of real property controlled or administered by the Division to public or private corporations, to groups of natural persons, or to natural persons for a valuable consideration upon such terms and conditions as the Division deems fit and proper, but no concessionaire may dominate any state park operation.

    (g) May establish such capital projects construction funds as are necessary to account for the parks improvements program approved by the Legislature. The money in these funds must be used for the construction and improvement of those parks which are under the supervision of the Administrator.

    2. The Administrator:

    (a) Shall issue an annual permit to a person who pays a reasonable fee as prescribed by regulation which authorizes the holder of the permit to enter each state park and each recreational area in this State and, except as otherwise provided in subsection 3, use the facilities of the state park or recreational area without paying the entrance fee; and

    (b) May issue an annual permit to a person who pays a reasonable fee as prescribed by regulation which authorizes the holder of the permit to enter a specific state park or specific recreational area in this State and, except as otherwise provided in subsection 3, use the facilities of the state park or recreational area without paying the entrance fee.

    3. An annual permit issued pursuant to subsection 2 does not authorize the holder of the permit to engage in camping or boating, or to attend special events. The holder of such a permit who wishes to engage in camping or boating, or to attend special events, must pay any fee established for the respective activity.

    4. Except as otherwise provided in subsection 1 of NRS 407.0762 and subsection 1 of NRS 407.0765, the fees collected pursuant to paragraphs (d), (e) and (f) of subsection 1 or subsection 2 must be deposited in the State General Fund.

    (Added to NRS by 1961, 180; A 1963, 831; 1971, 2078; 1973, 247; 1977, 794, 1131; 1979, 108; 1985, 287; 1993, 217, 1029, 2532; 1999, 977; 2003, 1216, 3221)
    Does allowing them to create regulations to "preserve the peace" , "prevent damage," and "promote enjoyment" authorize them to create firearms regulations or does the legislature have to specifically say "regulate firearms."

    The Chapter 503 of the NAC referring to the department of wildlife refers to hunters carrying firearms while hunting, and the NRS does provide for some departmental regualtion of hunters and use of firearms for hunting, but if you aren't hunting I'm not sure where the authority comes from.

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