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Thread: First Time Questioned About OC

  1. #1
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    My wife and I take a nightly walk around our community, I OC for protection. Tonight, for the first time, as we walked by a community common area, I was hollered at, across the way, by a man.

    Him: "Sir, are you an officer?"

    Me: "No Sir, I am not."

    Him: Do you realize your carrying a firearm in the open?!"

    Me: "Yes, sir I am."

    Him: "Do you realize you are brandishing a firearm right now?"

    Me: "Sir, my weapon is holstered and Utah Unloaded"

    Him: "So theres no bullets in that gun?"

    Me: "Sir, i have 16 in my magazine with an empty breech."

    Him: "You can't do that"

    ......

    He was initially RELATIVELY combative, I slowly approached him with my wife, as he started talking about how he has taken many concealed firearm classes and that one of his family members teaches the class and that he knew you could not openly carry a firearm. He proceeded to say that he would not get a concealed carry permit because of "all the restrictions". (????)

    I told him I was well within my rights to be carrying and offered him the "Utah Gun Law: a quick reference for utah citizens" pamphlet (http://www.utahconcealedcarry.com/sh...ah_Gun_Law.pdf) and I verbally told him that within UT code 76-10-505 I was within the law. He initially refused to take the pamphlet, stern with the response that he knew the laws.

    The man proceeded to be argumentative, next asking if the gun was loaded (All the while, I am OVERLY aware of my demeanor, being careful not to be offensive at all.):

    Me "no sir, the gun is Utah unloaded."

    The man seemed most concerned about the definition of "loaded" he kept repeating:

    (Him) "You need '2 motions...'"

    ...and that my gun, being holstered, needing to be cocked, and the trigger pulled didn't count. (Now that I'm sitting at home reading my second copy of the same pamphlet I realize that it don't even need two actions, just not have a round in the chamber. That that was something BCI states, and they aren't law makers) I then began to cite UT-75-10-505 along with an explication, of course. I mentioned that the Attorney General Mike Shurtleff understood the law the same as I did. He seemed to recognize the name before i could finish my sentence.

    After finishing the short conversation the man did end up taking the pamphlet, but was still confident he was right - stating he "didn't want us to get in trouble".

    In closing:

    While my wife thinks i did "Alright", I personally feel like I did a mediocre job, at best. i thought that i was prepared for this situation, but when this all that happened, i seemed to freeze. being so self aware that i forgot the laws i had jammed in my head.
    I was, above all, watching my attitude with this man. For some reason, THAT was my primary concern. I was doing my best to keep my hand away from my weapon, watch my tone, and even simply being sure not to interrupt him.

    I would give myself a definite "A for effort", but a 'C+' for delivery. It iwas easier to type all this to you with fluidity, than it was with my studdering and fumbling when speaking to this man.

    I am open to critique and hope i didn't embarrass anyone on this forum by my actions or statements, or lack thereof. i have done my best to give an honest account.



    CLARIFICATION: i want to be clear that while the man seemed, in my opinion, very aggressive and stern, i wouldn't classify his behavior as 'rude'. i honestly believe that he thought that he was right, and i was breaking the law.



  2. #2
    State Researcher Kevin Jensen's Avatar
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    I think you did a fantastic job. Keeping cool under pressure is what makes this encounter a great one. It does not matter that "he knows the law", or your delivery technique. What matters is you kept a level head, and did not make gun owners look like angry idiots.

    Good job! :celebrate
    "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life." Robert A. Heinlein

  3. #3
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    ProtectedBy9mm wrote:
    SNIP I am open to critique...
    Which is more than the other guy will be willing to say about himself.

    You did fine. Sounds like he wasa self-important, busy-body, somewhat aggressor.

    It almost doesn't matter what you say, as long as you keep calm, don't escalate, and gently try to disengage.

    For example, "Hey,thanks for the tip. I'll check it out as soon as I get home."

    And then make a superhuman effort to not let word "idiot" escape under your breath as you walk away.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  4. #4
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    SGT Jensen wrote:
    I think you did a fantastic job. Keeping cool under pressure is what makes this encounter a great one....
    You should'a seen me when i got back in my house! i was sweating and pacing through what just happened in my head. trying to figure out if i needed to brace myself for a knock on the door by a LEO. It was really odd how I felt i had to convince myself that i didn't do anything wrong. Just an odd sensation..

    Citizen wrote:
    "And then make a superhuman effort to not let word "idiot" escape under your breath as you walk away. "
    lolz -

  5. #5
    State Researcher Kevin Jensen's Avatar
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    ProtectedBy9mm wrote:
    You should'a seen me when i got back in my house! i was sweating and pacing through what just happened in my head.
    This is how I felt during my encounter with the Sheriffs yesterday. I am sure they could tell that I was nervous as hell, but I remained calm and collected. I have carried openly for a year and a half now, and that was my first LEO encounter that did not end in under a minute.
    "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life." Robert A. Heinlein

  6. #6
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    I might have handled it a bit different.

    Man: Are you an officer?

    Me: No. Are you a Peace Officer with powers of arrest?

    Man: No.

    Me: Have a nice day. (As I slowly walk away)

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