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oc vs cc technicalities

Bear 45/70

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gsx1138 wrote:
Bear 45/70 wrote:
gsx1138 wrote:
I've wondered these things as well. I have a supertuck that is comfortable as hell but I like having the grip on my pistol exposed. Mainly because I put grip tape on my pistol and sandpaper on the love handles hurts.
Ok, this is to easy to pass up..........aaaah can you say diet and exercise?
missingteeth.gif

Oh, I can say it all day. It's the actual doing it that's the problem. :p

Aint that the truth. I've been threatened with death if I don't loose some pounds. So 30 pounds later and I'm still to heavy (fat is such and ugly word), but the fight goes on. Old and fat are such a bad combination. As my mother in law say,

"Old is not for sissies!'
rolleyes.gif
 

jddssc121

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joeroket wrote:
jddssc121 wrote:
joeroket wrote:
4. The signs have no legal authority. If I must go into store that is posted the I conceal.
Regardless if I like it or not, it's private property, and they're allowed to make their own rules. I respect them, and either shop elsewhere, or leave it in the car.

It's not "illegal" (you could be trespassed if confronted and don't leave....), but it's the right thing to do. You want people to respect your rights, correct? Then respect their rights too; they have the right to say they don't want a firearm on their property.
You're right I can be asked to leave. If they ask then I will and will not return. The point is that the sign itself carries no legal weight.

my point is not if it's legal or not. my point is to have some respect. It's a two way street. You want them to respect your right to carry, but won't respect their right to have their private property operate as they see fit. Amazingly hypocritical in my book.

It doesn't matter if you like it or not, if you see a sign that says "no firearms" you should respect their wishes or leave. Not sneak it in and pat yourself on the back....
 

joeroket

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jddssc121 wrote:
joeroket wrote:
jddssc121 wrote:
joeroket wrote:
4. The signs have no legal authority. If I must go into store that is posted the I conceal.
Regardless if I like it or not, it's private property, and they're allowed to make their own rules. I respect them, and either shop elsewhere, or leave it in the car.

It's not "illegal" (you could be trespassed if confronted and don't leave....), but it's the right thing to do. You want people to respect your rights, correct? Then respect their rights too; they have the right to say they don't want a firearm on their property.
You're right I can be asked to leave. If they ask then I will and will not return. The point is that the sign itself carries no legal weight.

my point is not if it's legal or not. my point is to have some respect. It's a two way street. You want them to respect your right to carry, but won't respect their right to have their private property operate as they see fit. Amazingly hypocritical in my book.

It doesn't matter if you like it or not, if you see a sign that says "no firearms" you should respect their wishes or leave. Not sneak it in and pat yourself on the back....
You have the right to not go in armed and I have the right to go in armed. When the law gives signs authority I will abide by them. My family's safety is more important than a non-legal binding sign.

I say we agree to disagree. Everyone has thier own way and it is often that people do not see eye to eye.
 

jddssc121

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joeroket wrote:
You have the right to not go in armed and I have the right to go in armed. When the law gives signs authority I will abide by them. My family's safety is more important than a non-legal binding sign.

I say we agree to disagree. Everyone has thier own way and it is often that people do not see eye to eye.

So "Respect me, but i won't respect you"...?

not a very even argument....you're still missing my point :banghead:. I'm not talking about what's legal, I'm talking about some mutual respect for one another. Respect their right to makes their rules as they see fit....nobody is forcing you to shop there....

anyhow, we've probably hijacked this thread enough....I guess you're entitled to one more post back to keep it even ;) but i'll stop replying
 

heresolong

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Bear 45/70 wrote:
Well, you can carry the 1911 with a round in the chamber and hammer down, as the firing pin will not reach the primer.
Although my recollection was that the 1911, according to Browning, was safer cocked and locked than with the hammer on the pin. A drop will not unlock and fire the pistol but a drop can hit the hammer and pin combo and lead to a fire.
 

Machoduck

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jddssc121 wrote:
joeroket wrote:
You have the right to not go in armed and I have the right to go in armed. When the law gives signs authority I will abide by them. My family's safety is more important than a non-legal binding sign.

I say we agree to disagree. Everyone has thier own way and it is often that people do not see eye to eye.

So "Respect me, but i won't respect you"...?

not a very even argument....you're still missing my point :banghead:. I'm not talking about what's legal, I'm talking about some mutual respect for one another. Respect their right to makes their rules as they see fit....nobody is forcing you to shop there....

anyhow, we've probably hijacked this thread enough....I guess you're entitled to one more post back to keep it even ;) but i'll stop replying

I don't understand your point about mutual respect, jddssc121. If a private enterprise, one which hopes to capture some of my money, says I can't exercise a G-d given, constitutionally guaranteed right, while selecting something to give them money for, please tell me where their respect for me is. I'm not a cash cow. I'm already showing them respect by entering their store to shop.

MD
 

jddssc121

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Machoduck wrote:
jddssc121 wrote:
joeroket wrote:
You have the right to not go in armed and I have the right to go in armed. When the law gives signs authority I will abide by them. My family's safety is more important than a non-legal binding sign.

I say we agree to disagree. Everyone has thier own way and it is often that people do not see eye to eye.

So "Respect me, but i won't respect you"...?

not a very even argument....you're still missing my point :banghead:. I'm not talking about what's legal, I'm talking about some mutual respect for one another. Respect their right to makes their rules as they see fit....nobody is forcing you to shop there....

anyhow, we've probably hijacked this thread enough....I guess you're entitled to one more post back to keep it even ;) but i'll stop replying

I don't understand your point about mutual respect, jddssc121. If a private enterprise, one which hopes to capture some of my money, says I can't exercise a G-d given, constitutionally guaranteed right, while selecting something to give them money for, please tell me where their respect for me is. I'm not a cash cow. I'm already showing them respect by entering their store to shop.

MD
it's you respecting their right to make their own rules on their own property.
 

bcp

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What, if any, property rights does someone give up when they open a business and invite the public onto their property? This is not the same as a member of the public coming into your house or yard.
 

jddssc121

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bcp wrote:
What, if any, property rights does someone give up when they open a business and invite the public onto their property? This is not the same as a member of the public coming into your house or yard.

well, they don't give up the right to not want you on their property....if they did, then the ability to trespass you wouldn't exist.....but again, I am not going for a legal argument here...just a simple respect of the others person's (in this case company's) wishes....if they've gone to the trouble of posting a no firearm sign, it's obviously they don't want them in the store....respect that even if you think it's stupid
 

jddssc121

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Machoduck wrote:
I say again, where is their respect fot me?

MD
they respectfully put up a sign for you. :)

seriously though.......you respecting their rules shouldn't be dependent on them respecting your wishes
 

Triple Tap

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If they create a no gun zone by posting it and making a policy, they should carry the full weight of the liability if something should happen. But then that wont help the poor victim laying in the morgue at the hand of someone that couldnt read the sign.

Signs, Signs, everywhere there's signs.
 

jddssc121

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Triple Tap wrote:
If they create a no gun zone by posting it and making a policy, they should carry the full weight of the liability if something should happen. But then that wont help the poor victim laying in the morgue at the hand of someone that couldnt read the sign.

Signs, Signs, everywhere there's signs.
I agree!

Look. I think it's dumb, and I would LOVE for state preemption to extend out to commercial property where the public routinely gathers such as stores, etc....

but until that happens I'll follow their signs and take my business elsewhere. Maybe i was just raised weird :what:, but i won't disregard their right to make the rules on their property that they see fit.

As a side note, I have gotten in the habit of calling the store(s) that have those signs to complain, let them know they've lost my business, and outline why i think their policy is stupid
 

jddssc121

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I don't understand your point about mutual respect, jddssc121. If a private enterprise, one which hopes to capture some of my money, says I can't exercise a G-d given, constitutionally guaranteed right, while selecting something to give them money for,

MD
it's a two way street. Who says they can't exercise THEIR right to run THEIR PRIVATE PROPERTY as they see fit?

(sorry, caps is not shouting, just highlighting :) )
 

Triple Tap

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This is why I think this would work - needs to be a law that states, if they do make these rules and or policies they will have the full weight of the liability for not providing the security needed. This doesnt stop them from making their own rules for thier property, it just makes them aware that their actions will bare the responsabilitys of said actions.
 

Machoduck

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jddssc121, it just can't be that you can't see my point (that mutual respect calls for them respecting me and my life.) I believe that you're refusing to see my point. Well, actually you do see my point, you just refuse to name it, hoping that it'll go away. Even if I grow bored with a discussion where the other party refuses to acknowledge my point and I go away, the point doesn't go away.

MD
 

jddssc121

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Machoduck wrote:
jddssc121, it just can't be that you can't see my point (that mutual respect calls for them respecting me and my life.) I believe that you're refusing to see my point. Well, actually you do see my point, you just refuse to name it, hoping that it'll go away. Even if I grow bored with a discussion where the other party refuses to acknowledge my point and I go away, the point doesn't go away.

MD
I get your point. your respect for them is dependent on their respect for you....

Mine is that the two aren't inter-dependent. I'll respect their right to make stupid rules, regardless if i agree with them or not....

Nobody is forcing you to shop there. If you don't feel they're respecting you, take your $ elsewhere. That's what i do.
 

Nivek

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Temporary threadjack in 3...2...1...

Bear 45/70 wrote:
I never have figured out why the US Military did not listen to John M. Brownings instructions on how to operate his pistol. But then we are speaking of the US military.
rolleyes.gif

Uncle same was already using the Beretta 92's when I joined up. What was the standard mode of carry for 1911's?
 

Bear 45/70

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Nivek wrote:
Temporary threadjack in 3...2...1...

Bear 45/70 wrote:
I never have figured out why the US Military did not listen to John M. Brownings instructions on how to operate his pistol. But then we are speaking of the US military.
rolleyes.gif

Uncle same was already using the Beretta 92's when I joined up. What was the standard mode of carry for 1911's?
No round in chamber and hammer down. You had to jack the slide to be ready to go, which probably meant you were dead. But then right after 9-11 the National Guard were protecting us in the airports with no mag in the weapons. Yep, ready for a fight or was it just a show?
 

bcp

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But then right after 9-11 the National Guard were protecting us in the airports with no mag in the weapons. Yep, ready for a fight or was it just a show?
Brings back memories of standing guard at night at a petroleum tank farm in Korea, with no ammunition. "If we are attacked, we will send a truck around with ammunition."

Bruce
 
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