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Open Carry is a fundamental Human Right, not a partisan issue

Michigander

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Gun ownership and possession in general is a constitutional right, and some believe God given. It need not be related to politics. And the same is true of our cause, we should keep political arguments out of things as much as possible. It's kind of like Ted Nugent. If he didn't go and insult Democrats so much, he'd be much more respected. We need to keep things like that in mind.
 

Grapeshot

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cccook wrote:
marshaul wrote:
I feel that the open carry movement has great potential; greater than that of most every other gun-rights group. Part of that potential is the ability to demonstrate to naysayers and those "on the fence" that Americans can be trusted with guns. I think we can maximize that potential by working to present OC as human rights issue, without respect to the politics of either major party.
So perhaps the OC movement is the "third party" that NOOblet45 is speaking off. Not necessarilyas a political party but in a "we the sovereign people" sort of way. And by remaining separate from partisan politics we may exercise greater affect on the human condition in America.
One can hope!

Each one of us is an emissary.

Yata hey
 

marshaul

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cccook wrote:
marshaul wrote:
I feel that the open carry movement has great potential; greater than that of most every other gun-rights group. Part of that potential is the ability to demonstrate to naysayers and those "on the fence" that Americans can be trusted with guns. I think we can maximize that potential by working to present OC as human rights issue, without respect to the politics of either major party.
So perhaps the OC movement is the "third party" that NOOblet45 is speaking off. Not necessarily as a political party but in a "we the sovereign people" sort of way. And by remaining separate from partisan politics we may exercise greater affect on the human condition in America.

This is my thinking on the matter. I believe it is a realistic goal we can work towards, starting right here on this forum.

Personal responsibility is an incredibly powerful concept. When you give people responsibility, they will eagerly embrace it. It's not a political party, but it is the Personal Responsibility movement.
 

snake021

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Open Carry is a fundamental Human Right, not a partisan issue
You know, it's easy to say this, but with the election just around the corner, is it true? The reality is that gun ownership period, comes into question when looking at the candidates. You can't even get deep enough into the argument of OC'ing/CC'ing, machine guns etc. without first seeing who is more favorable for the RTBA.

Just off the top of my head without looking up any statistics, I would say thatRepublicans have been more gun friendly than the Dems. That doesn't hold true all the time I know. Our Dem. Gov here in OH is more 2nd Amendment friendly, and has passed more favorable laws, than our last Republican weenie.

But still, when you look at the voting records of Bama/Biden vs. McCain/? and a Democrat majority Congress, how can you seperate politics from gun ownership, much less OC/CC?
 

marshaul

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My initial inclination is to point out that there are more rights than just RKBA, rights which are unambiguously being trashed by the forces of partisan politics.

But this thread is about 2nd amendment rights, so I'll address your argument directly. The Republican party does not have a history of supporting a "right" to bear arms, only a privilege to own them. For example, the current GOP candidate for POTUS is a well-established "gun-grabber."

http://www.gunowners.org/mccaintb.htm

So, essentially your argument boils down to the same tired, old lesser-of-two-evils baloney. Take a look down at the bottom of the following page, and you'll see what I (and a few others) think about that. ;)

http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum4/15313-2.html

Edit: I didn't "separate politics from gun ownership," I decried the negative effects of partisan politics on same. Discussing abrogation of rights is very much political.

Furthermore, it is exactly that kind of complacent/terrorized (take your pick) reliance on your political party of choice to "have a better record" that has dug us into this hole in the first place. It's exactly that partisanship I'm attempting to address with this thread.
 

MetalChris

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snake021 wrote:
Open Carry is a fundamental Human Right, not a partisan issue
Our Dem. Gov here in OH is more 2nd Amendment friendly, and has passed more favorable laws, than our last Republican weenie.
Gov Strickland FTW!!!
 

snake021

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marshaul wrote:
...
Furthermore, it is exactly that kind of complacent/terrorized (take your pick) reliance on your political party of choice to "have a better record" that has dug us into this hole in the first place. It's exactly that partisanship I'm attempting to address with this thread.

Like it or not, it's the way it is. Simply declaring that "it ain't so on this board" will not change our system. I am with you 100% in the other thread , I read more than I post;).

I'm not saying I love McCain's voting record, just that it should be used for consideration,if you believe that the 2nd Amendment issue is your biggest criteria in choosing between the two, IF you vote.
 

marshaul

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So, because "that's the way it is" we should continue to engage in behavior that we are able to recognize as a major cause of the problem? I can't fathom this logic for the life of me. :?
 

snake021

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marshaul wrote:
So, because "that's the way it is" we should continue to engage in behavior that we are able to recognize as a major cause of the problem? I can't fathom this logic for the life of me. :?
What do you suggest? Is not voting, which is what I do, accomplishing anything?
 

marshaul

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Statistically, voting (in a Presidential election) does accomplish very little. That doesn't mean you shouldn't do it, but we're fools to rely on a President or our votes for him to achieve the freedom we require.

However, that doesn't mean that individuals are powerless to effect change. In order for the two-party system to "evolve" into something that can restore to us our birthright of individual human liberty, "the people" as a whole will have to reject the any party or politician who would infringe upon said liberty.

You might ask, what, then, can an individual do to work towards this seemingly impossible change? I believe the American people hunger for this change, even as they are being mislead by the likes of Barack Obama to vote against it. Thus, the individual should remain (or become) critical (e.g. of both Barack Obama and John McCain), vocal, and active.

And that's what the OC movement is all about. The activism aspect is, in effect, working to change society, one person at a time. And we're achieving the desired result! That's the great thing about personal responsibility and individual action: not only do you have more direct effect than by, say, voting, but you encourage others to assume and demand personal responsibility themselves. And only by assuming responsibility can the people take back what our government has stolen.

What we have here could be the proverbial "light at the end of the tunnel." What I'm suggesting is that we recognize the incredibly powerful effect we can have -- not just with regards to RKBA -- and not allow it to become tainted with ineffectual, short-sighted partisanship. Instead, we should take it beyond such partisanship, and work to unite Americans with respect for human rights and demand for personal responsibility.

In summary, we should treat OC as more than a partisan issue not just because it's a fundamental human right, but because doing so may be part of the bigger solution to America's "rights crisis."
 

marshaul

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And if you read my above post, you'll see why I didn't mention CC in my original post or thread title. Not because CC isn't also a fundamental human right (which it is), but because it's not really relevant to the immense value I see in our OC movement.

Like all our other freedoms (constitutionally enumerated and otherwise), CC is one freedom that we can work towards with OC (but not vice versa).

That is, if we minimize the partisanship. :p
 
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