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Thread: OC IN CLINTON TWP.

  1. #1
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    Ok, I called Clinton Twp Police Dept. a few months ago and ask what would happen if I was to OC and some one called in about me, would I be charged with disturbing the peace and he said no "but I would find a reason to arrest you and he also said this is not the wild west"I made the mistake ofnot getting his name!! Today I called again and got another officer and ask his name and he popped it offbut did not understand it and ask him to spell it out and he said my badge number is 146 and said thats all I have to give you and ask me who I was and I gave him. I ask the question of "If I were walking down the road and had my gun on my side and some one called on me what would you do????" He said "That is ahypathetical question I dont know what I would do" How messed up is this???? I called the station back up and ask the dispatcher how to spell officer 146 name and its Allis

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    Regular Member dougwg's Avatar
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    ok, so?

    What did you expect?

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    a real answer!!!

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    Regular Member dougwg's Avatar
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    And then what?

    If he said "no problem!" then what?

    If he said "I'll arrest you!" then what?



    You're trying to get the opinion of one LEO that answers the phone. My question is why do you need an answer from him at all?

    I'm not bashing you, I'm trying to get you to think.

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    Because I have been told from MSP and Sheriff Hackel that different cities have different rules!!

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    This is the info that you need to know regarding cities having their own laws:



    No local ordinance concerning firearm possession is enforceable due to Michigan’s preemption law.

    In 1990, the Michigan legislature enacted MCL 123.1102 which provides, in pertinent part: A local unit of government shall not impose special taxation on, enact or enforce any ordinance or regulation pertaining to, or regulate in any other manner the ownership, registration, purchase, sale, transfer, transportation, or possession of pistols or other firearms, ammunition for pistols or other firearms, or components of pistols or other firearms, except as otherwise provided by federal law or a law of this state.

    THE MICHIGAN COURT of APPEALS CONCLUDED: April 29, 2003 9:10 am. v No. 242237 In sum, we conclude that § 1102 is a statute that specifically imposes a prohibition on local units of government from enacting and enforcing any ordinances or regulations pertaining to the transportation and possession of firearms, and thus preempts any ordinance or regulation of a local unit of government concerning these areas.

    Further, we conclude that the specific language of the 2000 amendments to
    MCL 28.421 et seq., particularly §§ 5c and 5o, which were adopted more than a decade after the enactment of § 1102, do not repeal § 1102 or otherwise reopen this area to local regulation of the carrying of firearms.17 Accordingly, we hold that theFerndale ordinance is preempted by state law and, consequently, we reverse.
    MCRGO v. Ferndale: The Michigan Court of Appeals held that local units of government may not impose restrictions upon firearms possession.



    and to put it plainly, while cities/towns "think" they have laws saying that open carry is illegal, the preemption over-rides this making open carry in fact LEGAL in the state of Michigan. :celebrate




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    Regular Member dougwg's Avatar
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    Including Clinton Twp.

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    Regular Member Generaldet's Avatar
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    LEO's will most always tell you what they have to in order to deter you from OC'ing. Just remember you don't need permission from anyone to exercise your rights lawfully. Although I can understand being hesitant or feeling worried about your first LEO encounter especially if you are newer to OC like I am but as long as you have read, understand, and are comfortable with all the information provided, then you will be ok.

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    can you email me this?? My printer just took a sh#t and call the Clinton Twp. Police Dept. And play dumb and ask them about open carry see what they say to you!!

  10. #10
    Regular Member Generaldet's Avatar
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    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum30/13328-1.html

    start here if you haven't already. No need for me to call, it doesn't matter what they say. The law is very clear. Please make sure you are comfortable and knowledgeable before you OC.

  11. #11
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    that link did not work! And I want to open carry!!

  12. #12
    Regular Member Generaldet's Avatar
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    not sure why it didn't work, its the first forum on the main page here. it says to start there.

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    vtwjmsw wrote:
    can you email me this?? My printer just took a sh#t and call the Clinton Twp. Police Dept. And play dumb and ask them about open carry see what they say to you!!
    You need to calm down. STOP calling the police department and asking questions. You can find EVERYTHING you need right here on OCDO, wihtout having to be lied to by the police. The Michigan State Police website shows you beyond a shadow of a doubt that OC is legal. STOP, LEARN, LISTEN, READ and RE-READ...you WILL be all the better for it.

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    MrsRuger45 wrote:
    This is the info that you need to know regarding cities having their own laws:



    No local ordinance concerning firearm possession is enforceable due to Michigan’s preemption law.

    In 1990, the Michigan legislature enacted MCL 123.1102 which provides, in pertinent part: A local unit of government shall not impose special taxation on, enact or enforce any ordinance or regulation pertaining to, or regulate in any other manner the ownership, registration, purchase, sale, transfer, transportation, or possession of pistols or other firearms, ammunition for pistols or other firearms, or components of pistols or other firearms, except as otherwise provided by federal law or a law of this state.

    THE MICHIGAN COURT of APPEALS CONCLUDED: April 29, 2003 9:10 am. v No. 242237 In sum, we conclude that § 1102 is a statute that specifically imposes a prohibition on local units of government from enacting and enforcing any ordinances or regulations pertaining to the transportation and possession of firearms, and thus preempts any ordinance or regulation of a local unit of government concerning these areas.

    Further, we conclude that the specific language of the 2000 amendments to
    MCL 28.421 et seq., particularly §§ 5c and 5o, which were adopted more than a decade after the enactment of § 1102, do not repeal § 1102 or otherwise reopen this area to local regulation of the carrying of firearms.17 Accordingly, we hold that theFerndale ordinance is preempted by state law and, consequently, we reverse.
    MCRGO v. Ferndale: The Michigan Court of Appeals held that local units of government may not impose restrictions upon firearms possession.



    and to put it plainly, while cities/towns "think" they have laws saying that open carry is illegal, the preemption over-rides this making open carry in fact LEGAL in the state of Michigan. :celebrate



    o'k my wife has been doing her home work and helping people out you go girl.i guess if i have a ? i will ask her first.

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    vtwjmsw wrote:
    can you email me this?? My printer just took a sh#t and call the Clinton Twp. Police Dept. And play dumb and ask them about open carry see what they say to you!!
    I recommend you follow warlockmatized's advice.

    Read the info thread. More than once.

    Also, learn about your rights during a police encounter, and how to assert them without being confrontational. Some officers will take it as confrontational anyway, which is why you need to now how to assert them in a non-confrontational way.

    If you choose to OC, make sure you have a good understanding of how to read people. Some police will be receptive, some won't. You need to know how to properly handle both.

    If you get stopped by that officer who promised to arrest you, just remember the questions.
    1. "Under suspicion of what crime are you detaining me?"
    2. "What is your reasonable suspicion?" (If the officer claims RS is the gun, calmly ask him to clarify if that is the extent of his RS)
    3. "Am I free to go?"
    **Wash, rinse, repeat as necessary (that means until your arrested, or released).
    Understand that you could well be arrested, but if you stick to this, chances are that anything after the stated RS should be thrown out, as holstered gun is not RS to a stop.

    Also, understand the difference between a "stop", and an "involuntary interview". This is one of the reasons why it is important to ask the officer for RS and the Crime he suspects you of.

    You can argue your rights and the law all day with the officer, but if he doesn't care what you have to say, your only giving him more opportunity to find something on you.

    PS.

    You also might consider doing the certified mail like I suggested earlier.

  16. #16
    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Very well stated, ghostrider!
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

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    Thank You!!! I just dont know what to say if stopped for OC. But thank You!!

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    vtwjmsw wrote:
    Thank You!!! I just dont know what to say if stopped for OC. But thank You!!
    Well, if you get into a situation with law enforcement, and you are not comfortable with what to say, you can always do the smart thing:

    DON'T SAY ANYTHING!

    Don't "explain" yourself, don't volunteer your purpose, don't say a damn thing.

    There only thing that should be coming out of your mouth; the only things you should even THINK about saying are:

    "Officer, my full legal name is (your name here)."
    "Officer, I will not answer questions without my attorney present."

    Don't modify these statements, don't elaborate on them, don't quantify them. Act like a freakin' parrot, that knows two sentences...

    Here is why:

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...02514885833865


    The worse case scenario: You take a ride to the police station. The police charge you with some bogus-ass charge. You go to court, get charge thrown out. You file civil rights lawsuit.

    The only thing you can do when talking to the police is hurt yourself. Watch the danged video. It will be the best 30 minutes you have ever spent on learning about the law, and how it effects your life in the real world.

    EDIT: If you didn't get the hint the first time, WATCH THE VIDEO! Here, I will help you: http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...02514885833865

  19. #19
    Regular Member dougwg's Avatar
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    You can lead a horse to water, but some times you have to damn near drown them to get um to drink.

  20. #20
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    dougwg wrote:
    You can lead a horse to water, but some times you have to damn near drown them to get um to drink.
    chuck norris can lead a horse to water AND make it drink
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  21. #21
    Regular Member Tucker6900's Avatar
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    smellslikemichigan wrote:
    chuck norris can lead a horse to water AND make it drink
    Well Chuck Norris is the reason why Aliens dont live on this planet.
    The only terrorists I see nowadays are at the Capital.


    The statements made in this post do not necessarily reflect the views of OCDO or its members.

  22. #22
    Regular Member DanM's Avatar
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    Tucker6900 wrote:
    smellslikemichigan wrote:
    chuck norris can lead a horse to water AND make it drink
    Well Chuck Norris is the reason why Aliens dont live on this planet.
    Ok, adding to the "Chuck Norris" internet meme, and making it OC-related:

    OC should belegal because Chuck Norris can't be everywhere. Check that. Chuck Norris can be everywhere.OC should belegal becauseChuck Norris chooses not to be everywhere.
    "The principle of self-defense, even involving weapons and bloodshed, has never been condemned, even by Gandhi . . ."--Dr. Martin Luther King Jr

    He who cannot protect himself or his nearest and dearest or their honor by non-violently facing death, may and ought to do so by violently dealing with the oppressor. He who can do neither of the two is a burden.--M. K. Gandhi

    "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." --M. K. Gandhi

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    I have copied the link to an e-mail and will have to watch it later on a different computer, I am a single parent and have only dial up So 30 mins. is like at least an hour of download!But Thank You so much for your time on this!! Vincent

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