• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

MouseGuns

Marco

Marco

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2007
Messages
3,905
Location
Greene County
imported post

Bear 45/70 wrote:
Triple Tap wrote:
So what is the smallest caliber gun? Commercially made.
Click to expand...
17 HMR
Click to expand...
Incorrect.
17 Mach 2 and 17 Aguila are smaller/weaker than 17 HMR,they have shorter cases.
The Mach 2 cartidge uses a 17gr bullet and a Stinger casingwhich is longer than a standard .22lr casing.
TheAguila uses a 20gr bullet and a standard 22lr casing.

The chambers of Mach 2 guns allow the use of Aguila but not the reverse.

However, theyall have the same bullet dia.

The advantage of these rounds over 22lr, 0.0 drop at 100yrds when fired from a rifle.
 
B

BlaineG

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 15, 2008
Messages
149
Location
, ,
imported post

Agent19 wrote:
Bear 45/70 wrote:
Triple Tap wrote:
So what is the smallest caliber gun? Commercially made.
Click to expand...
17 HMR
Click to expand...
Incorrect.
17 Mach 2 and 17 Aguila are smaller/weaker than 17 HMR,they have shorter cases.
The Mach 2 cartidge uses a 17gr bullet and a Stinger casingwhich is longer than a standard .22lr casing.
TheAguila uses a 20gr bullet and a standard 22lr casing.

The chambers of Mach 2 guns allow the use of Aguila but not the reverse.

However, theyall have the same bullet dia.

The advantage of these rounds over 22lr, 0.0 drop at 100yrds when fired from a rifle.
Click to expand...
The bullet starts dropping the instant it leaves the barrel.....You zero a rifle for a certain distance, but you must raise the muzzle of the weapon (vis-a-vis the sights) to do so.
 
B

Bear 45/70

Regular Member
Joined
May 22, 2007
Messages
3,256
Location
Union, Washington, USA
imported post

BlaineG wrote:
Agent19 wrote:
Bear 45/70 wrote:
Triple Tap wrote:
So what is the smallest caliber gun? Commercially made.
Click to expand...
17 HMR
Click to expand...
Incorrect.
17 Mach 2 and 17 Aguila are smaller/weaker than 17 HMR,they have shorter cases.
The Mach 2 cartidge uses a 17gr bullet and a Stinger casingwhich is longer than a standard .22lr casing.
TheAguila uses a 20gr bullet and a standard 22lr casing.

The chambers of Mach 2 guns allow the use of Aguila but not the reverse.

However, theyall have the same bullet dia.

The advantage of these rounds over 22lr, 0.0 drop at 100yrds when fired from a rifle.
Click to expand...
The bullet starts dropping the instant it leaves the barrel.....You zero a rifle for a certain distance, but you must raise the muzzle of the weapon (vis-a-vis the sights) to do so.
Click to expand...
I've got a 45/70 shooting 405 LFN bulletsthat has zero drop at a 100 yards, by this theory. :lol: But even my 22-250 has drop at 100 yards, not much with a 40 grain bullet at 4000 fps, but I will bet it is less than any if the rimfire 17s.
 
Marco

Marco

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2007
Messages
3,905
Location
Greene County
imported post

Bear 45/70 wrote:
I've got a 45/70 shooting 405 LFN bulletsthat has zero drop at a 100 yards, by this theory. :lol: But even my 22-250 has drop at 100 yards, not much with a 40 grain bullet at 4000 fps, but I will bet it is less than any if the rimfire 17s.
Click to expand...

22-250 vs 17 rimfire, apples to oranges.:lol:
Now, 17 Remington would give it a run for it's money.


My favortive 45/70 load 300gr TSXFN over 47.5 grains(max) of Vit-N120 for 2301 fps

My 45/70 CAS load 300gr LFP over 10.0 grains of Win231.

Use at your own risk.
 
Marco

Marco

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2007
Messages
3,905
Location
Greene County
imported post

BlaineG wrote:
Agent19 wrote:
The advantage of these rounds over 22lr, 0.0 drop at 100yrds when fired from a rifle.
Click to expand...
The bullet starts dropping the instant it leaves the barrel.....You zero a rifle for a certain distance, but you must raise the muzzle of the weapon (vis-a-vis the sights) to do so.
Click to expand...
You are correct.
I should have stated the rounds has a flat trajectory.

For those that have never seen.


L is 17 Mach 2
R is 17 HMR
Hornady bullets.
 
just_a_car

just_a_car

Regular Member
Joined
May 28, 2007
Messages
2,558
Location
Auburn, Washington, USA
imported post

FE427TP wrote:
.17 is a moot point, the question was smallest caliber commercially offered, and the winner is
rev_main.jpg
2.34 mm .091 caliber. Non importable to the US because of the unconstitutional "sporting" clause
Click to expand...
I was going to bring this up yesterday, but I don't believe the round itself is commercially produced. I believe you have to have it custom-made by the manufacturer of the gun... and Tripple Tap did specify "commercially made" caliber.
 
F

FE427TP

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2008
Messages
86
Location
South Western, Washington, USA
imported post

.17 is a moot point, the question was smallest caliber commercially offered, and the winner is
rev_main.jpg
2.34 mm .091 caliber. Non importable to the US because of the unconstitutional "sporting" clause
 
F

FE427TP

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2008
Messages
86
Location
South Western, Washington, USA
imported post

just_a_car wrote:
I was going to bring this up yesterday, but I don't believe the round itself is commercially produced. I believe you have to have it custom-made by the manufacturer of the gun... and Tripple Tap did specify "commercially made" caliber.
Click to expand...
ok, but then the 5.7*28 isn't a commercial catridge either as only FN produces it or a contractor for FN to distribute
 
B

Bear 45/70

Regular Member
Joined
May 22, 2007
Messages
3,256
Location
Union, Washington, USA
imported post

Agent19 wrote:
Bear 45/70 wrote:
I've got a 45/70 shooting 405 LFN bulletsthat has zero drop at a 100 yards, by this theory. :lol: But even my 22-250 has drop at 100 yards, not much with a 40 grain bullet at 4000 fps, but I will bet it is less than any if the rimfire 17s.
Click to expand...

22-250 vs 17 rimfire, apples to oranges.:lol:
Now, 17 Remington would give it a run for it's money.


My favortive 45/70 load 300gr TSXFN over 47.5 grains(max) of Vit-N120 for 2301 fps

My 45/70 CAS load 300gr LFP over 10.0 grains of Win231.

Use at your own risk.
Click to expand...

No more a fair comparison than the 22-250 to the rimfire 17s. The 17 Remington is the most powerful of the 17s while the 22-250 isn't the top runner in the 22 centerfires. I haven't been able to find a ballistics chart for the 17 yet to do a proper comparison. I did find this info though for the 17 HMR.





Ballistic performance

Bullet weight/type Velocity Energy

17gr (1.1g) 2,550ft/s (780m/s) 245ft·lbf (332J)

20gr (1.3g) 2,350ft/s (720m/s)250ft·lbf (340J)



and this for the lowest powered of the 22 centerfires, the 22 Hornet and you can reload the Hornet.


Ballistic performance

Bullet weight/type Velocity Energy

35gr (2.3g) VMax 3,060ft/s (930m/s) 728ft·lbf (987J)

40gr (2.6g) SP 2,826ft/s (861m/s) 710ft·lbf (960J)

45gr (2.9g) SP 2,787ft/s (849m/s)776ft·lbf (1,052J)

50gr (3.2g) SP 2,713ft/s (827m/s) 817ft·lbf (1,108J)

55gr (3.6g) SP 2,652ft/s (808m/s) 859ft·lbf (1,165J)

[/suP]
Fixed the charts.
 
T

Tomahawk

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 1, 2006
Messages
5,117
Location
4 hours south of HankT, ,
imported post

.22 WMR NAA Minirevolver, which has a 5 rd capacity. For those times when you have to carry but can't have something heavy on your belt. I much prefer to carry a 1911, but there are situations when it's either a cell phone-sized pocket gun or no gun at all, so these things have their place.
naa_mini_22mag_158.jpg
 
B

Bear 45/70

Regular Member
Joined
May 22, 2007
Messages
3,256
Location
Union, Washington, USA
imported post

Tomahawk wrote:
.22 WMR NAA Minirevolver, which has a 5 rd capacity. For those times when you have to carry but can't have something heavy on your belt. I much prefer to carry a 1911, but there are situations when it's either a cell phone-sized pocket gun or no gun at all, so these things have their place.
naa_mini_22mag_158.jpg
Click to expand...

I would rather have the PUG version.

http://www.naaminis.com/pug.html
 
B

Bear 45/70

Regular Member
Joined
May 22, 2007
Messages
3,256
Location
Union, Washington, USA
imported post

Tomahawk wrote:
Bear 45/70 wrote:
I would rather have the PUG version.

http://www.naaminis.com/pug.html
Click to expand...

I like the sights. What is that blade thingy underneath the barrel on the Pug?

Personally, I like having a slightly longer barrel for a few extra fps; the thing is still so small and easy to conceal.
Click to expand...
The maunal doesn't say but I suspect it has to do with the cylinder pin retension.
 
marshaul

marshaul

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
11,188
Location
Fairfax County, Virginia
imported post

bcp wrote:
From:
http://www.shootingtimes.com/ammunition/17M2/

Based on the .22 Long Rifle rimfire case, the new .17 Mach 2 (.17M2)...

...

...the matching overall length and case-body dimensions of the .17M2 and the .22 LR will allow the .17M2 to function in standard .22 LR magazine configurations of all types,...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Yeah I made that post on my way out the door. I guess I didn't bother to actually read the post I was responding to. :cry: :lol:

Bear 45/70 wrote:
The only down side of the 22 WMR is the cost. Power wise, I would choose it over a 25 or a 32 and when it comes to the 380 I call it a push.
Click to expand...

This is true. Pricey, but it also makes an excellent varmit round when fired out of a rifle. Velocity has its advantages. :)
 
B

Bear 45/70

Regular Member
Joined
May 22, 2007
Messages
3,256
Location
Union, Washington, USA
imported post

marshaul wrote:
bcp wrote:
From:
Bear 45/70 wrote:
The only down side of the 22 WMR is the cost. Power wise, I would choose it over a 25 or a 32 and when it comes to the 380 I call it a push.
Click to expand...

This is true. Pricey, but it also makes an excellent varmit round when fired out of a rifle. Velocity has its advantages. :)
Click to expand...
I guess I'm spoiled, I have 2 different22 Hornet rifles and one pistol. I reload for the Hornet so two of thethree 22WMRs I have sit on the pegs, stored and the derringer goes with mewhen I can't carry my Charter Arms Bulldog.
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top