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Open Carry in front of Obama Rally - Chesapeake Thursday Evening
- Thread starter Thundar
- Start date
hsmith
Regular Member
imported post
Be mindful of the "1000 foot" federal law for those w/o a permit.
Be mindful of the "1000 foot" federal law for those w/o a permit.
SouthernBoy
Regular Member
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hsmith wrote:
If you are speaking about carrying within 1000 feet of a school in Virginia, I'm pretty sure there is no such law anymore. If I'm not mistaken, you can take a walk on the sidewalk right by a school in session OC'ing, no permit of course, of CC'ing with a permit.
If this is wrong, please someone correct me, but I think it is correct.
hsmith wrote:
If you are speaking about carrying within 1000 feet of a school in Virginia, I'm pretty sure there is no such law anymore. If I'm not mistaken, you can take a walk on the sidewalk right by a school in session OC'ing, no permit of course, of CC'ing with a permit.
If this is wrong, please someone correct me, but I think it is correct.
mkl
Regular Member
imported post
SouthernBoy wrote:
The 1000 feet is from Federal Gun Free Safety Zone Act rewritten in 1996. Concealed carry permit holders are exempted, but ONLY if they have a permit from the state where the school is. So if you are in a state other than where your permit is from, but it has reciprocity, you are illegal within 1000 feet of a school.
See: http://www.handgunlaw.us/documents/batf_school_zone.pdffor a letter from the ATF in 2002 on the school zone issues with out of state permits.
I don't see any information about the GFSZA being modified after being re-written in 1996. Not to say it isn't out there though, corrections are welcome as always.
SouthernBoy wrote:
The 1000 feet is from Federal Gun Free Safety Zone Act rewritten in 1996. Concealed carry permit holders are exempted, but ONLY if they have a permit from the state where the school is. So if you are in a state other than where your permit is from, but it has reciprocity, you are illegal within 1000 feet of a school.
See: http://www.handgunlaw.us/documents/batf_school_zone.pdffor a letter from the ATF in 2002 on the school zone issues with out of state permits.
I don't see any information about the GFSZA being modified after being re-written in 1996. Not to say it isn't out there though, corrections are welcome as always.
tripledipper
Regular Member
imported post
The Secret Service Protection Detail may supercede any and all regulations. I think this might just not be the right time for OC or CC unless you are willing to be tossed, cuffed, questioned and ultimately released.
The Secret Service Protection Detail may supercede any and all regulations. I think this might just not be the right time for OC or CC unless you are willing to be tossed, cuffed, questioned and ultimately released.
67GT390FB
Regular Member
imported post
tripledipper wrote:
tripledipper wrote:
maybe thundar will become the OCDO version of "don't tase me bro" it might garner some good press.
hsmith
Regular Member
imported post
Thundar, this thread we all discussed it, look for LEO's post http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_topic.php?id=11380&forum_id=54&highlight=school+federal
Thundar, this thread we all discussed it, look for LEO's post http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_topic.php?id=11380&forum_id=54&highlight=school+federal
Virginiaplanter
Regular Member
imported post
How does somebody know they are 1,000 feet from the school and not 99'11"? If there are two schools 500 feet apart, where does the measuring begin? From the corner of the first school or from the front door of either school if they are built parallel to each other and you are standing in front or in back of the school?
Do you see the legal flaw in the law?
How does somebody know they are 1,000 feet from the school and not 99'11"? If there are two schools 500 feet apart, where does the measuring begin? From the corner of the first school or from the front door of either school if they are built parallel to each other and you are standing in front or in back of the school?
Do you see the legal flaw in the law?
hsmith
Regular Member
imported post
Virginiaplanter wrote:
but i agree with your typo. it is a stupid law.
Virginiaplanter wrote:
If you couldn't tell 99' 11'' from 1000' you might have a problem
but i agree with your typo. it is a stupid law.
LRS76251
Regular Member
imported post
I would strongly advise everyone who is not active law enforcement to NOT ATTEMPT approaching the metaltometers at the entrance of the rally while armed. Any type of carrying of weapons by non-LEO will have to be done outside the security perimeter that is established by the Secret Service. I know it sucks and agree it sucks but thats one of the rules of attending Presidential rallies. Don't even think about doing it!!
I would strongly advise everyone who is not active law enforcement to NOT ATTEMPT approaching the metaltometers at the entrance of the rally while armed. Any type of carrying of weapons by non-LEO will have to be done outside the security perimeter that is established by the Secret Service. I know it sucks and agree it sucks but thats one of the rules of attending Presidential rallies. Don't even think about doing it!!
imported post
For the sake of clarification, you would not want to walk through the metal detectors with a gun or some other weapon either. Even if you're law enforcement, if you're not working the event then they will have no way to distinguish you from anyone else. Otherwise, have fun.
I've been to publc events for Presidents Ford (1976) and Clinton (1996). The detectors are so far away from the podiums that you can't even see the stage from the security area.
What you want is a group of four or five OCers congregating near one of those TV satellite trucks. The TV trucks is where you want to be, not near the Secret Service or the candidate's political supporters.
:celebrate
For the sake of clarification, you would not want to walk through the metal detectors with a gun or some other weapon either. Even if you're law enforcement, if you're not working the event then they will have no way to distinguish you from anyone else. Otherwise, have fun.
I've been to publc events for Presidents Ford (1976) and Clinton (1996). The detectors are so far away from the podiums that you can't even see the stage from the security area.
What you want is a group of four or five OCers congregating near one of those TV satellite trucks. The TV trucks is where you want to be, not near the Secret Service or the candidate's political supporters.
:celebrate
LRS76251
Regular Member
imported post
[align=left]Actually, there are ways to identify active LEO from others at events such as this but i'm not going to go into that since its a public forum. My advice is to stay away from the security perimeter ARMED if you aren't LEO and are attending the rally.
[/align]
[align=left]Actually, there are ways to identify active LEO from others at events such as this but i'm not going to go into that since its a public forum. My advice is to stay away from the security perimeter ARMED if you aren't LEO and are attending the rally.
[/align]
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It is a classic news story when some sheriff's deputy who is not working stumbles into the Secret Security people and makes a mess. I recall once back in the Carter Administration when a guy with a carry permit asked where he should check his gun before taking the White House tour. It caused a few minutes of confusion, but eventually he made it through.
:celebrate
They have it all arranged so that the security is far, far away from the dignitaries, so there's never a risk there. But the satellite trucks are full of electronics that cost a fortune and aren't made to be shot, either intentionally or accidentally. OCing near a satellite truck doesn't worry the Secret Service or the candidate's supporters, but one accidental discharge can cause about $750,000 in damage.
:celebrate
It is a classic news story when some sheriff's deputy who is not working stumbles into the Secret Security people and makes a mess. I recall once back in the Carter Administration when a guy with a carry permit asked where he should check his gun before taking the White House tour. It caused a few minutes of confusion, but eventually he made it through.
:celebrate
They have it all arranged so that the security is far, far away from the dignitaries, so there's never a risk there. But the satellite trucks are full of electronics that cost a fortune and aren't made to be shot, either intentionally or accidentally. OCing near a satellite truck doesn't worry the Secret Service or the candidate's supporters, but one accidental discharge can cause about $750,000 in damage.
:celebrate
SouthernBoy
Regular Member
imported post
mkl wrote:
Thanks for your response. May I ask this, then? What about a Virginia resident taking a walk (perhaps walking his dog) past a school while the school is in normal session, and this resident is open carrying his weapon.. not on school property. I believe LEO 229 once said that this was fine and since no permits are required in Virginia for OC, you would not even need any sort of ID.
Do you have any knowledge of this? One of the posters gave several examples of how someone may not even know how far they are from a school while carrying. This is very possible since schools are all over the place, in residential areas as well as being close to commercial areas.
mkl wrote:
Thanks for your response. May I ask this, then? What about a Virginia resident taking a walk (perhaps walking his dog) past a school while the school is in normal session, and this resident is open carrying his weapon.. not on school property. I believe LEO 229 once said that this was fine and since no permits are required in Virginia for OC, you would not even need any sort of ID.
Do you have any knowledge of this? One of the posters gave several examples of how someone may not even know how far they are from a school while carrying. This is very possible since schools are all over the place, in residential areas as well as being close to commercial areas.
hsmith
Regular Member
imported post
SouthernBoy wrote:
It really needs to be repealed.
AFAWK (as far as we know) - it is a "tack on" law, where you have committed other crimes, they will tack this on to add more charges to your case. Apparently no one has ever been just chaged with this.
SouthernBoy wrote:
And that is why it is a terrible law. Even a quick "thinking through it" comes up with so many vague "could happens." Hell, I am currently sitting 1500ft from a school, if I got in my car and drove over 501ft and didn't have a permit I would be breaking the law!
It really needs to be repealed.
AFAWK (as far as we know) - it is a "tack on" law, where you have committed other crimes, they will tack this on to add more charges to your case. Apparently no one has ever been just chaged with this.
Thundar
Regular Member
imported post
tripledipper wrote:
The Secret Servicedoes not have any supra legal powers. They must operate within the bounds of the law. Lex Rex.
tripledipper wrote:
Citation?
The Secret Servicedoes not have any supra legal powers. They must operate within the bounds of the law. Lex Rex.
LRS76251
Regular Member
imported post
Presidential rallies at this point in time (within 120 days of elections) become National Security Events therefore USSS has control of all things inside the perimeter. You won't get passed the metaltometers while armed if you aren't active LEO so don't even bother trying unless you want a lot of NEGATIVE attention. Presidential rallies are NOT the proper place to try and make a statement about OC. It just gives a negative impression of OCers to the public. If you try to break the perimeter while armed you WILL be arrested. Warning to the wise. Don't do it at Presidential rallies this close to an election. USSS authorization to direct NSE's falls under PDD-62, which has since been codified into 18 USC 3056. Breaking a USSS Security Perimeter is chargeable under 18 USC 1752 and is punishable by up to 10 years in Federal prison and/or fines if the violator is in possession of a firearm. If no firearm possessed, then its imprisonment up to 1 year and/or fines.
Presidential rallies at this point in time (within 120 days of elections) become National Security Events therefore USSS has control of all things inside the perimeter. You won't get passed the metaltometers while armed if you aren't active LEO so don't even bother trying unless you want a lot of NEGATIVE attention. Presidential rallies are NOT the proper place to try and make a statement about OC. It just gives a negative impression of OCers to the public. If you try to break the perimeter while armed you WILL be arrested. Warning to the wise. Don't do it at Presidential rallies this close to an election. USSS authorization to direct NSE's falls under PDD-62, which has since been codified into 18 USC 3056. Breaking a USSS Security Perimeter is chargeable under 18 USC 1752 and is punishable by up to 10 years in Federal prison and/or fines if the violator is in possession of a firearm. If no firearm possessed, then its imprisonment up to 1 year and/or fines.
tripledipper
Regular Member
imported post
So, who took a collar? Anybody? I don't think so. LRS should be listened to, very carefully.
So, who took a collar? Anybody? I don't think so. LRS should be listened to, very carefully.
hsmith
Regular Member
imported post
LRS76251 wrote:
LRS76251 wrote:
He doesn't have to break perimeter to protest. I see nothing wrong with OC'ing and protesting.
Marco
Regular Member
imported post
hsmith wrote:
1+
I know someone from this board that CC'd at a McCain event in VA without issues.
No, it wasn't me.
hsmith wrote:
1+
I know someone from this board that CC'd at a McCain event in VA without issues.
No, it wasn't me.