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Thread: Voluntary gun inspections by police

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    http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.p...p;pageId=72906

    This is the most relevant part of the article.
    Oklahoma police investigating the shooting deaths of two girls have told area residents with guns to bring them in for a test to determine whether they were used in the attack, sparking concern among those who own guns for hunting and self-defense.

    According to reports in the Tulsa World the Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation sent letters to members of the community who were registered as owning .40-caliber handguns suggesting they voluntarily bring in their gun or guns for a test.

    The individuals who were "invited" to bring their guns in but didn't now will be included in the ongoing investigation, as well as people who were identified by former owners as having purchased that type of weapon recently, authorities said.

    "We'll be checking on them," Jessica Brown, a spokeswoman for the Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation, told the newspaper.

    The investigation is into the June 8 shooting deaths of Skyla Jade Whitaker, 11, and Taylor Paschal-Placker, 13, who died when they were shot several times on a road about four miles from Weleetka. Authorities say two guns were used in the killings, but they haven't released much information about the weapons until they now confirmed one was a .40-caliber.

    They have not yet identified the second type of weapon used.

    Authorities said they sent out about 60 letters, and about 40 gun owners voluntarily brought in their weapons to the Okfuskee County Courthouse at Okemah for testing over the weekend.

    Brown said those weapons were taken by investigators and test-fired, and the results of those tests now are being evaluated. She said nearly half a dozen former gun owners contacted authorities to identify new owners, and another 15 gun owners did not show up.

    Those who participated in a forum on the newspaper website expressed sympathy for the victims and their families, but worried about the maneuver of inspecting privately owned guns without a search warrant or probable cause.

    "This is a really sad story. My heart goes out to the families involved," said one participant. "For some reason, though, it bothers me that 60 gun owners were asked to 'voluntarily' relinquish their legally-owned firearms."

    Wrote a second, "Since when does Oklahoma have handgun registration? … I seriously hope they catch the vermin responsible for this, but I'm disturbed by the implication that Oklahoma, one of the most free states in the USA, has handgun registration."

    Another, identified only as ok sooner and who reported spending time in law enforcement, added, "I would never 'voluntarily submit their weapons for testing.' Get a warrant."

    "I'm with ok sooner," said a fourth. "I wouldn’t voluntarily submit my firearms to law enforcement without a warrant, either. This is really starting to bother me. Why ask 60 citizens to do this? Or maybe they're waiting for somebody to refuse to submit 'voluntarily' whereupon they do get a warrant."

    On the forums page for the Oklahoma Shooters Association, the readers were even more alarmed.

    "Why don't they just test fire all the .40 cal handguns in Oklahoma? Yeah, that's the ticket," said one person. "I hate to perhaps sound callous about the tragedy, that's not my intent at all, but this is some of the goofiest stuff I've ever heard of."

    "What the OSBI stupidly did was ensure that, if the real murderer still has the murder weapon and got one of these letters, he will now WITHOUT DOUBT destroy it POST HASTE," said another.

    "Human beings can only interact with one another through two methods: reason or force. If at any point, either party chooses force, the other must either submit or respond with force," warned another participant. "I prefer reason. But I am ready to respond with force. Submission is not an option."

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    I can't believe 40 people gave up their rights so willingly.

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    OK, so assuming that the killer isn't a complete idiot, I doubt he'll be bringing in HIS gun. And also assuming that the Oklahoma police are not complete idiots, they should know this.

    This is nothing more than a stupid PR move by the OK police agencies, to show they are "doing everything they can" to solve this case.

    Also, to say that if you do not comply, you will be in the 'suspect pool' is really just piss poor police work, and also will not hold up in any court. It is just scare tactics by the cops, because they have nothing else to go on.







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    AZkopper wrote:
    OK, so assuming that the killer isn't a complete idiot, I doubt he'll be bringing in HIS gun. And also assuming that the Oklahoma police are not complete idiots (big assumption--it is Oklahoma after all), they should know this.

    This is nothing more than a stupid PR move by the OK police agencies, to show they are "doing everything they can" to solve this case.

    Also, to say that if you do not comply, you will be in the 'suspect pool' is really just piss poor police work, and also will not hold up in any court. It is just scare tactics by the cops, because they have nothing else to go on.
    Well thats a fantastically bigoted way to look at Oklahomians. Delete your comment and I'll delete mine.

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    Regular Member rodbender's Avatar
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    I'm with you DV, that was totally uncalled for.
    The thing about common sense is....it ain't too common.
    Will Rogers

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    Flyer22 wrote:
    http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.p...p;pageId=72906

    According to reports in the Tulsa World the Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation sent letters to members of the community who were registered as owning .40-caliber handguns suggesting they voluntarily bring in their gun or guns for a test.

    The individuals who were "invited" to bring their guns in but didn't now will be included in the ongoing investigation,
    Well the OSBI can include me in the ongoing investigation. Since I own a .40-caliber handgun and consider Oklahomans my neighbors, I am a member of the community.

    But when the OSBI brings their investigation to my door they had best bring a warrant and have their legal ducks in a row. 'Cause I'm not giving up my rights and they won't care for the ensuing legal fallout. < note the rightious indignation >

    God love 'em, I hope they do catch the animal who committed this atrocity.

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    Regular Member Decoligny's Avatar
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    Now, what if the shooter actually owns a legal registered .40 and an illegally obtained .40 that isn't registered?

    Wouldn't bringing in the legal .40 effectively remove the person from the suspect pool?

    There have been cases of the occasional smart criminal you know.

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    We had a similar murder in Warner Robins Ga quite a few years ago. It was of a teen on a bycycle. It was never solved. The theory was that it was some sort of an initiation into a gang. The assignment was to go to a random town, murder someone and come back to the gang. They picked Warner Robins and the child was a target of opertunity. It would have been easy to do, exit the interstate, kill someone, get back on the interstate and go back to whatever scum pond you came from.

    I think the police are looking to close to home.

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    If 40 would do it VOLUNTARILY, i wonder how many would do it if it were statewide or nationwide.

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    Regular Member rodbender's Avatar
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    yeahYeah wrote:
    If 40 would do it VOLUNTARILY, i wonder how many would do it if it were statewide or nationwide.
    They sent out 60 letters and 40 volunteered, so that's about 2/3. I'm not sure that reflects national average, but you figure it out. Well, we know there are 40 idiots in OK.
    The thing about common sense is....it ain't too common.
    Will Rogers

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    by bringing their gun down there, they in essence registered them with the police. the police got all their data INCLUDING the firing pin/case markings.

    tsk tsk tsk

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    Theres no way I'd ever agree to this!

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    They are of course assuming the murderer used a registered firearm. They are also assuming that the murderer lived in close proximity to the shooting. As well they assume that he/she doesn't know the legality behind the issue.

    It is a bit surprising that 40 people did show up and willing relinquish their firearms, even if it was only for a moment.



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    I sympathize with the parents, and especially the young victims in their final moments.

    This sort of police tactic makes me start to re-evaluate the societal value of police weighed against threat to liberty.

    Just within the last (6?) months we've also seen Boston try door-to-door requests for consent to search homes.

    Recently the same in DC.

    And wasn't therea jurisdiction where parents could call and police would come and search the teenager's room, with no questions asked if a so-called illegal gun was found--unless it had been used in a crime?

    And some people have ridiculed me for objecting to police asking permission to search a car during a traffic stop, or objecting to police badgering a stoppee for standing on his rights in an effort to get him to waive them.

    This is what we get whengovernment begins to think thatrights aren't sacred, that loopholes in case law are for exploitation.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    There is no requirement in OK to register firearms in the first place.

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    DopaVash wrote:
    I can't believe 40 people gave up their rights so willingly.
    +1 ... though we know that many will do it, just to be "good citizens."

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    "Another, identified only as ok sooner and who reported spending time in law enforcement, added, "I would never 'voluntarily submit their weapons for testing.' Get a warrant."

    My sentiments exactly!

    AZkopper, you obviouslythink Oklahomans in general, are stupid hicks. I've been there many times (my brother lives there) and you could'nt be more wrong, they're great folks. Your comment was totally uncalled for.




    "You can teach 'em, but you cant learn 'em."

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    One particular reference was especially chilling: former owners are turning in new owners. As in the guy you bought the gun from has told the police he sold it to you.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Somebody call Bloomberg and get him in on this...I am sure he has some good ideas.



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    40 people ... 2/3 ...
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    What bugs me the most is that the police are completely wasting time....


    There are only 2 possible scenarios:


    A) The shooter has a registered firearm, and the police sent him/her a letter.

    B) The shooter is not registered, and the police did not send him/her a letter.



    If (A) is the case, then obviously the shooter disposes of the weapon somewhere far away, and either replaces the weapon, says has sold the weapon, etc.

    If (B) is the case, then the police are just wasting valuable time checking on the registered owners. Also, this is the most likely scenario, as people who take the time to go register their firearms with the police are usually not the type to take to shooting 11 and 13 year old kids.

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    Citizen wrote:
    And wasn't therea jurisdiction where parents could call and police would come and search the teenager's room, with no questions asked if a so-called illegal gun was found--unless it had been used in a crime?
    IIRC Bahsston, MA

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    Regular Member rodbender's Avatar
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    Should they test all the 10MM's as well? Damn, I may have just given themthe missing clue.
    The thing about common sense is....it ain't too common.
    Will Rogers

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    Ok, Ok, Ok.....I shot from the hip and was unfair to the inhabitants of Oklahoma.

    I"m sorry, I apologize, and I've edited my post.

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    Phoenixphire wrote:
    What bugs me the most is that the police are completely wasting time....


    There are only 2 possible scenarios:


    A) The shooter has a registered firearm, and the police sent him/her a letter.

    B) The shooter is not registered, and the police did not send him/her a letter.



    If (A) is the case, then obviously the shooter disposes of the weapon somewhere far away, and either replaces the weapon, says has sold the weapon, etc.

    If (B) is the case, then the police are just wasting valuable time checking on the registered owners. Also, this is the most likely scenario, as people who take the time to go register their firearms with the police are usually not the type to take to shooting 11 and 13 year old kids.

    You missed a scenario:

    C) The gun itself snuck out and went on a murderous rampage, then snuck back in and put itself away.

    That's the only chance the police have of solving the crime with this method.

    ...Eliminate the impossible, and whatever is left, however improbable, must be the answer!...
    ...Orygunner...


    Edit: Corrected for clarity.

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