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Thread: Another dog attack story

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    This all happened a couple weeks ago. I don't post here much but I thought you all would appreciate the story. Just FYI, the dog was tested and was NOT rabid. The attacking Pitt was obviously a fighter dog since it had numerous scars all over his body. About once a week, I'll hear dogs fighting and am convinced that someone nearby is holding illegal dog fights. God help them if I ever discover who that someone is. Dog fights are cruel, illegal, and just down right WRONG!!!

    Just FYI - I mention all three of my dogs by their names. Jack is a beagal, Lobo is a siberian husky, and cisco is a husky/pitt mix

    Anyway, let me go ahead and start off at the beginning. Wednesday, Lobo started barking and come to find out a dog was on the other side of the fence. I thought it was my neighbors dog so I cautiously brought him inside. Jack got real upset and started growling as soon as I brought him in. A few hours later, my neighbor comes home and lets me know that it's not her dog. So I let him go not thinking that curious little Jack is right behind me. Needless to say, the second after letting the stray dog go, he attacks Jack. When I say attack, I mean try to kill. The stray (it was a pittbull which is why I thought it was my neighbors) has a killer grip on Jack's lower jaw literally trying to rip it off his face. I jump in and try to pry the pitbull off Jack and get bit like crazy in the process. My neighbor started hitting the dog with a bucket which finally runs him off. I immediately run jack inside and get my 44 magnum revolver. By the time I got back outside, the pitbull had Lobo by the throat. So I shot the pitbull. I'm sure one shot would've eventually killed him but I'm not willing to see any dog suffer, so I emptied the cylinder into him. I then ran back inside and reloaded, after which I go out there and put one more in the dog's head. That was my biggest mistake because to see if a dog has rabies, you have to dissect the brain. Well after a 44 magnum to the head, I doubt there'll be anything left.

    An hour later, I was talking to animal control as they took the body. An hour after that, I'm in the hospital. They cleaned up the handokay but it still ended up getting infected so now I'm on the strongest antibiotic available, my hand hurts like crazy even though I've got some vicodin in me. Anyway, I got to go back for some rabies shots since I won't find out the results of the autopsy until monday or tuesday at the earliest.


    Just to follow up and add a few things. Like I said, the dog was not rabid so I never had to endure the painful rabies vaccinations. I wish I had gotten a picture of the damage the first round caused. You all would've appreciated it. I didn't have time to aim and the bullet hit a few inches behind the middle of his body. I'd have to guess but I'd say it opened a 3-4" hole on the ENTRANCE wound. The bullet went in, caused massive bleeding and juststopped. It never penetrated all the way throughI now trust my life to the 240gr. Gold Dots that are in my 4" Taurus revolver. Probably wouldn't do much to an attacking kodiak bear but the biggest thing I have to worry about here in Va. is ... you guessed it, a stray pitt bull. We've seen a few mountain lions and even fewer bears in my area but nothing like that has been seen for years.

    Either way, the attack shook me up pretty good. I had never taken a life in order to save a life and unless you've actually been there/did that, you can't say for certain how you would react. I'm a SLIGHTLY ashamed to say that after it was all over, I broke down crying. I was taught that 'big boys don't cry' but now know that's a load of B.S. Either way, I cried mainly because I though Jack was going to die. He was safely by my side the entire time I was crying but just the thought that I nearly lost at least 1 of my family members shook me up pretty good.

    As a final note, to all those that have had run ins with strange dogs, BE PREPARED!!! If the dog looks all scared up like this one did, take that as a warning that it will attack you or someone you love without hesitations. I'm not saying to go around shooting stray dogs, but what I am saying is just be cautious of dogs that you aren't familiar with.

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    The apologists for those who keep aggressive dogs and refuse to keep them under control would suggest it is your fault this dog attacked you. In fact, paraphrasing one of them, "you can't get seriously hurt by a dog bite, so there is no reason to ever shoot an attacking dog".

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    good job. you saved your dogs life man and maybe even someone elses dog that the pit hasnt gotten to yet. sucks about your hand though but if i were in your shoes id say it was well worth it to save you dog. too bad you dont have any pictures

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    To be honest, I think the pictures would have been a little too graphic for me to comfortably post them anyway. I mean it litereally split it's gut wide open. You couldn't even cover the wound with an open hand! I was really amazed at the performance of the Gold Dot ammo. The problem was, it didn't even seem to phaze the dog, he just circled around kinda stupified and started to takeone step towards me, that's when I unloaded on him. He eventually ran/stumbled over to the edge of the yard, laid down and died. I was pretty sure that he was dead when I put the final round into him but wasn't about to touch him and find out out that he was just passed out.

    Either way, The dog was in full out fight mode and a 44 mag didn't even phaze him. What would a measily little 9mm or even .40 caliber do? I've trusted my life to a G27 .40 caliber for years but if that's all I had to defend myself with, it would've taken at least 3-4 WELL PLACED shots to accomplish the same as one misplaced shot from the 44.

    The moral of the story, if you ever need to draw your weapon, make damn sure it's going to do the job. I know I go by 357luvr on here and I'm not doubting the power of a 357 as a BUG but for me, it's go big or go home. That means 44 mag or better. Currently all I own is the 4" Taurus 44 and a Puma M92 44 mag lever action rifle. I trust my life to these weapons and will continue to do so until I get a 454 or 500S&W.

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    Im glad you and your dogs are ok. Ive had to call the police about a dog thats always loose down the road from me. Its a bull mastiff and is a little aggressive for my comfort. Everytime we walk by his yard, out he comes, slow trot mind you, but barking and growling nontheless. I told the police officer about it, and he went down there and wrote the owner a citation for not keeping his dog tied up. Even though he appears to be tied up now, I still go armed when we go for walks.
    The only terrorists I see nowadays are at the Capital.


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    An unfortunate necessity. Good job protecting your own pack. That's your job.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    I then ran back inside and reloaded
    lesson learned: ALWAYS carry a reload with you.

    Had it been a person you might have been in a serious world of hurt.

    Quote Originally Posted by Open Carry.org Member View Post
    I really disgree with this one! That means that we can have any yahoo running around with a gun with out the proper training. This really scares the hell out of me. Just my two-cents!
    Quote Originally Posted by KansasMustang View Post
    Joe Schmedlap out there with a loaded weapon thinking he's going to deter crime and he's not even trained to fire his weapon safely just kinda makes my hair on the back of my neck stand up.

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    catass wrote:
    I then ran back inside and reloaded
    lesson learned: ALWAYS carry a reload with you.

    Had it been a person you might have been in a serious world of hurt.
    A couple things;
    1) I didn't even have a gun on me at the time the attack began. I had to wrestle Jack (my beagle) out from the jaws of the attacking pit BEFORE running inside to get the gun.
    2) A fight that requires more than 6 rounds of 44 magnum is a fight that I'll probably loose anyway.
    3) I have since bought a couple speed loaders and have them full at all times. HOWEVER...
    4) It takes me a good couple of seconds to reload therevolver even with speed loaders. Had the dog still been charging at me after the 6th round was fired, my only choice would have been to "pistol" whip the dog.

    I understand what your saying but I'm rarely seen outside my home armed (neighbors like to accuse me of brandishing) and like I said, a fight that's going to take more than 6 rounds of a VERY powerful cartridge (44 mag) is a fight that almost any oneof us would loose anyway. I'm not saying that I'm against carrying reloads, I see them as a very valuable resource but it takes a lot more skill to reload a revolver than it does an automatic.

    Having said all that, if I end up with another automatic, I'll most likely carry an extra magazine on me at all times. I prefer the recoil of a .40 caliber over any other automatic pistol cartridge but I am well aware of it's lack of stopping power. After this incident, if I ever end up with an pistol with less than a 15+1 capacity (and 9mm doesn't count, that's a sissy caliber <- only half serious about that, let's not turn this into a caliber debate) you can bet you're annual income I'll be carrying extra ammo. However, even with say a G20 (15+1 10mm), if I get into a fight that requires me to empty the weapon and then reload. Then I'm going to be reloading whileRUNNING my butt out of dodge!

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    My friend had to shoot his Pitt with a rifle two times before hekilled it. He shot it once the dog charged, and he had to shoot him again.Dogs are tough when in fight mode. Your story is a bitconvincing that I need to carrya bigger round. But I carry 17 shots of .40 185gr Gold Speer. I do not think a BG will continue to attack after the first 2 shots.

    That story reminds me, I came home and my wife took in a stray Pitt and Lab. she wanted to keep them, but my Doberman Pharaoh was trying to kill those dogs.

    Oh he had to kill it because the dog was just too mean, it went crazy.


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    The simple fact is, ANY animal (including humans) that are in all out attack mode will likely need more than one shot. Obviously, if you get a head shot or are armed with an RPG then that changes things. However, having been in a shoot or die situation, I know that when you're shooting DEFENSIVELY, you shoot for the biggest available target. You can say 'well I'll just aim for the head then' all you want but if/when you're in that type of situation, you don't, can't, and won't aim, you're just going to point and pull the trigger. True, if I'd aimed and got a heart/lung shot or then most likely he would've taken a step or two and then passed away. Instead, I hit about 6" behind the perfect heart/lung shot without even aiming from about 5-7 yards. The bullet shattered the last 3 ribs (I could see the broken bones when I examined the body when animal control removed the body), halfway tore off a piece of flesh the size of an open hand, and (I'm guessing) stopped somewhere inside the intestines. The dog was still alive for a good 3-5 minutes after that. That was more than enough time to come back for some more. Fortunatly enough for me, that didn't happen.

    Overall, I'm still sorry that I had to take a life. However, that day, someone or some thing had to die and I'm NOT sorry that it was the attacking dog.

    What disturbs me the most is that this was obviously a fighter dog. One that had been fighting in the past for quite some time. That gets to me. Anyone who watches, participates, or is even interested in dog fights should have their testicles monkey stomped! I still say that someone close by is holding dog fights and seeing as how the primary animal control officer is an old teacher of mine from high school who is a great lady and will always have my utmost respect, I hope I find out who is holding these fights so that they can be suitably punished.

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    Alwayspacking wrote:
    I do not think a BG will continue to attack after the first 2 shots.
    One would be VERY suprised what a determined person is capable of doing, even after being shot multiple times.
    Quote Originally Posted by Open Carry.org Member View Post
    I really disgree with this one! That means that we can have any yahoo running around with a gun with out the proper training. This really scares the hell out of me. Just my two-cents!
    Quote Originally Posted by KansasMustang View Post
    Joe Schmedlap out there with a loaded weapon thinking he's going to deter crime and he's not even trained to fire his weapon safely just kinda makes my hair on the back of my neck stand up.

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    catass wrote:
    Alwayspacking wrote:
    I do not think a BG will continue to attack after the first 2 shots.
    One would be VERY suprised what a determined person is capable of doing, even after being shot multiple times.
    +10 I used to think a 5 shot 357 was good enough for a primary sidearm. I now feel differently. Basically, my philosophy is that BG's come in packs and if I can't take down 3 of them WITHOUT a reload, I don't have a bigenough gun. I stand by my comment that a 15+1 round fight is one that I will most likely loose and you certainly can't REASONABLYhavetoo much ammo but the way I see it, think about the unthinkable, think outside the box, but most of all think! I've always heard that areflex is always faster than areaction and if you don't believe me go herehttp://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_is_a_r...ntary_reactionso taking that into account, plan ahead! It may save your life one day!

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    Yep, I know it takes a few shots to take down a person. They could be mortally wounded and continue the attack and die later. But to think of a DOG taking multiple .44mag rounds and not droppingis scary when I think aboutmy little .40cal.but I do have 17 shots.

    There are only magic bullets in the movies one/two shot will not always stop a person. If I were to carry a 44.mag or a .460on the streets the DA will have a field day with that size round.

    AlsoI woke up this morning thinking about your topic, and figured I need a .44mag or a shotgun for home defence.

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    Alwayspacking wrote:
    Snip
    AlsoI woke up this morning thinking about your topic, and figured I need a .44mag or a shotgun for home defence.
    Shotgun

    :celebrate

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    357luvr wrote:
    What disturbs me the most is that this was obviously a fighter dog. One that had been fighting in the past for quite some time. That gets to me. Anyone who watches, participates, or is even interested in dog fights should have their testicles monkey stomped! I hope I find out who is holding these fights so that they can be suitably punished.
    +100

    That dog, if it was a "fighter", may very well have been fed gunpowder, starved of food for days ay a time, beaten etc...that's a few of the lovely practices of those friggin' idiots.
    I've owned "pits" for over 20 years and have NEVER had an issue with any of them...all have been real family members that I would have done the same as you did for. PLEASE, everyone...blame the deed and not the breed...they're one of the best breeds around for resposible owners.
    Here is an interesting site about fatal dog attacks: http://www.nationalcanineresearchcouncil.com/

    Good on ya' 357lvr....I hope you and Jack both heal up 100%

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    Jack's doing just fine and besides a half dozen scars, my hand is just fine as well. Thanks for all of y'alls concern!

    There is a couple things I want to mention though. Jack, even though he's a dosile little beagle, he proved to me that day that he loves me and that he has the heart of a lion. Looking back on it, he was trying to protect me from the pitt (a dog that was easily 3x larger than him) from the get go. I haven't had him around many other dogs but he had never ONCE growled at anything up until then. He proved that he was willing to possibly give his life to protect mine. What more can you ask for?

    The other thing I wanted to mention is that ... well ... the little mutt has an attitude now. He thinks he's all big and bad and struts his stuff on a daily basis. And if you don't believe me, try feeding him, he'll darn near take you hand off! LOL That's no problem though, he earned my respect that day as I'm sure I earned his.

    Here's a picture of the beloved Jack.


    Oh and Comp-techis right, blame the deed not the breed! I've never had any inclination to get a pitt but my long time friend and neighbor loves them and wouldn't have any other breed. His dogs are well behaved and would not attack unless they felt threatened. So, just don't do anything stupid and you'll walk away with a new best friend. Especially after they try to hump your leg! LOL



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    Either way, The dog was in full out fight mode and a 44 mag didn't even phaze him. What would a measily little 9mm or even .40 caliber do? I've trusted my life to a G27 .40 caliber for years but if that's all I had to defend myself with, it would've taken at least 3-4 WELL PLACED shots to accomplish the same as one misplaced shot from the 44.

    .44 is a good round, but a .357 will do the job just as well. I've said it before on other threads that I have had to shoot dogs and they are tough critters to put down. Some humans can be just as tough and thats why I carry a .357 and at leasttwo speedloaders.

    One good tip for dog attacks. If at all possible, aim for their shoulder with one or two initial shots. If you break their shoulder, that can slow 'em down enough to take careful, aimed shots and finish them off before they get to you.

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    Loneviking wrote:
    Either way, The dog was in full out fight mode and a 44 mag didn't even phaze him. What would a measily little 9mm or even .40 caliber do? I've trusted my life to a G27 .40 caliber for years but if that's all I had to defend myself with, it would've taken at least 3-4 WELL PLACED shots to accomplish the same as one misplaced shot from the 44.

    .44 is a good round, but a .357 will do the job just as well. I've said it before on other threads that I have had to shoot dogs and they are tough critters to put down. Some humans can be just as tough and thats why I carry a .357 and at leasttwo speedloaders.

    One good tip for dog attacks. If at all possible, aim for their shoulder with one or two initial shots. If you break their shoulder, that can slow 'em down enough to take careful, aimed shots and finish them off before they get to you.
    The reason I chose the 44 over the 357 is because I have TTD which is of course the Tim Taylor Disease. I used to have a 4" Taurus Tracker 357 (basically the same gun except for the tracker being a smaller framed weapon)and I loved it for plinking. However, I judge the power of a cartridge by the recoil from firing it. I know that isn't very accurate since a lot of guns are different size, weight, action, etc. but I figure a 4" revolver is a gooddecision maker. Let's just say this, the last time I shot the 44, I shot it until I had a good sized piece of flesh rubbed from web of my right hand. I LOVED IT!!!:celebrateEspecially considering I only had to shoot about 5-6 cyclinders worth of pretty hot reloads to do it. Now if shooting the darn thing at something/someone is gonna hurt the shooter, imagine what it'll do to the target.The tracker though, hmph, I could shoot that thing all day long! I'm not trashing the 357 at all though. My uncle has a S&W 340PD which is a ***12*** ounce .357 j frame revolver. Correct me if I'm wrong but as far as I know it's the best gun in the world when it comes to weight/power ratio. That thing is a beast but I'd love to have it.

    Oh and as far as aiming for the shoulder, that's pretty much what I was trying to do. Not specifically the shoulder but the area directly behind it. I didn't have time to aim, I just pointed and squeezed. I need to practice one handed shooting more often because I obviously missed the kill zone.

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    357luvr wrote:
    I understand what your saying but I'm rarely seen outside my home armed (neighbors like to accuse me of brandishing) ......
    Stand up for your civil rights.A pistol, legally carried in a holster is not brandishing. Accuse them of being idiots and go about your business with your gun on your hip.
    President/ Founding Member
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    yale wrote:
    357luvr wrote:
    I understand what your saying but I'm rarely seen outside my home armed (neighbors like to accuse me of brandishing) ......
    Stand up for your civil rights.A pistol, legally carried in a holster is not brandishing. Accuse them of being idiots and go about your business with your gun on your hip.
    This is a long story (most of which has been discussed here) but to make that long story short, these are not neighbors I want to piss off. Walking up the driveway to take pictures of something THEY had done has recently led to mebeing technically guilty of assualt. I just got back from court from them revoking my CC permit. I never did a thing, just like I never did a thing when they got me arrested andaccused me of brandishing a firearm. It's just that they're good at lying and they have a habit of lying in groups so like I said, I just don't want to piss them off.

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    Couple notes on this one. First off, glad you're ok, and my best to brave little Jack. This is a great example of what I have said from the get-go. A determined attacker is different from your average BG. This is an attacker that has one goal... kill you. They are a different "breed" no pun intended, than an average mugger. A determined attacker is alot harder to stop, even with mighty .357's and .44's. In alot of instances, humans have been able to take personal defense rounds, in lethal doses, and keep coming, at least achieving the goal of killing you before succumbing to wounds. In fight for flight, when the brain decides to fight, aggresive people, by nature, give themselves to the fight, they disregard pain, and other factors that would stop most people in their tracks. It really doesn't matter what caliber you carry in this instance, what is important is your ability to kill, quickly and efficiently. I am not trying to sound like a nut here, but I have personally seen a grown man take seven 9mm shots to the chest and he seemed to not even care. He died later, from overwhelming gunfire when we realized the 9mm wasn't doing the job, but he damn near blew about forty U.S. Soldiers sky high. This one instance is why I am so touchy on the kill subject. When you have to fire, you have to kill. I know that sounds rough, but it is a fact. If you are not ready to end the life of another in your defense, leave the gun at home. IT WILL GET YOU KILLED! That said, Mr. 357luvr proved his worth by empying that cannon into his target. It might have gone different had he just waited for the dog to die thinking he'd done enough damage. I am sorry for the more sensitive souls out there, but guns kill! And they should always kill when used in a defensive role!

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    flyin_ryan wrote:
    Couple notes on this one.
    You'll want to become familiar with civilian self-defense law. And tactics.

    Shoot to stop. Shoot to stop. Shoot to stop. If the attacker dies as a result, its coincidental. The defender's goal is to stop the attack right now.

    For example,ashot that breaks the attacker's pelvic bone will stop an attackutilizing a contact weapon--knife, bludgeon,etc.

    When the attack stops, whether the attacker is alive, dying, or dead, the defender had better stop shooting. When the danger ceases so does thejustification for lethal force according to my understanding.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    flyin_ryan wrote:
    Couple notes on this one. First off, glad you're ok, and my best to brave little Jack. This is a great example of what I have said from the get-go. A determined attacker is different from your average BG. This is an attacker that has one goal... kill you. They are a different "breed" no pun intended, than an average mugger. A determined attacker is alot harder to stop, even with mighty .357's and .44's. In alot of instances, humans have been able to take personal defense rounds, in lethal doses, and keep coming, at least achieving the goal of killing you before succumbing to wounds. In fight for flight, when the brain decides to fight, aggresive people, by nature, give themselves to the fight, they disregard pain, and other factors that would stop most people in their tracks. It really doesn't matter what caliber you carry in this instance, what is important is your ability to kill, quickly and efficiently. I am not trying to sound like a nut here, but I have personally seen a grown man take seven 9mm shots to the chest and he seemed to not even care. He died later, from overwhelming gunfire when we realized the 9mm wasn't doing the job, but he damn near blew about forty U.S. Soldiers sky high. This one instance is why I am so touchy on the kill subject. When you have to fire, you have to kill. I know that sounds rough, but it is a fact. If you are not ready to end the life of another in your defense, leave the gun at home. IT WILL GET YOU KILLED! That said, Mr. 357luvr proved his worth by empying that cannon into his target. It might have gone different had he just waited for the dog to die thinking he'd done enough damage. I am sorry for the more sensitive souls out there, but guns kill! And they should always kill when used in a defensive role!
    Well said! I agree with you 100%. I committed (sp?) myself to being willing to kill if needed the first day I picked up my first gun (H&K USPc .40) and strapped it onto my hip. That was when I was 5 years ago. Since then, I've had a couple instances where I was more comfortable knowing that I could defend myselfif needed. But up until this incident, I'd never had to even pull my weapon in self defense, much less pull the trigger.

    As far as emptying my 'cannon' into the target, let me clarify a few things. First off, as soon as he attacked Jack, I knew he was a dead dog walking. I figured that if he would attack a harmless little beagle THAT viciously then he was a threat to even the meanest of dogs. Knowing that4 out of my6 neighbors have dogs and knowing that I was the 'closest gun', I knew my only choice was to take the threat out. Having said all that, I shouldn't have completely emptied the cylinder. After I shotthe first time, he was on his way out. He took another step and I prepared for another shot which scared him away. He started walking away from me and eventually came to the corner of my partially fenced in yard. I was there within seconds but I knew as soon as he laid down that he was dead. I know that's different from what I first said but I've basically blocked a lot of this outand am just now remembering things correctly.However my fight or flight senses were in full force and I was determined to win this fight. I at that time (approx. 5-10 seconds after his last movement) emptied the other 5 rounds into his limp body. One hit his leg,two hit about the same place as the first just on the opposite side, and two hit in the heart/lung area. To add to the insult to injury, the final round to the head is something that just upsets me to think about. I knew for sure that he was dead but I was determined 'to make a point.' What that point was or who I was trying to make it to is a mystery. I had hoped that I would perform 'better' if I was ever under this particular type of situation. The reason I say that is that if it had been an attacking human in the same situation, emptying the cylinder and/or reloading and putting another round into his head would have crossed the legal/illegal line long before the final round was fired.

  24. #24
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    Citizen wrote:
    When the attack stops, whether the attacker is alive, dying, or dead, the defender had better stop shooting. When the danger ceases so does thejustification for lethal force according to my understanding.
    Yeah that's basically what I was trying to say. You just said it better. Thanks for helping me clarify it to everyone.

  25. #25
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    Post imported post

    deepdiver wrote:
    An unfortunate necessity. Good job protecting your own pack. That's your job.
    I'm definitely glad that both the OP and the OP's dog are well but if I'm reading his original story correctly, it's a far cry from an "unfortunate necessity".

    "Wednesday, Lobo started barking and come to find out a dog was on the other side of the fence. I thought it was my neighbors dog so I cautiously brought him inside."

    Wouldn't have letting the dog remain on the other side of the fence potentially avoided the entire situation all together?


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