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Thread: Constitutional Amendments

  1. #1
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    Being so new to this board, I am still learning the ropes so to speak. Tonight I read an article in the Va. section of the board which details the arrest of an individual for openly carrying his firearm at harborfest. The case against him was thrown out after it was realized that local communities violated a Va. state law which prohibits local communities from regulating firearms. The man sued in federal court claiming I believe violations of his 2nd and 4th Amendment rights.

    U.S. District Judge Henry Coke Morgan Jr. ruled Thursday that Szymecki cannot sue claiming constitutional violations under state or local law. Morgan ruled earlier this year that the city did not violate the Second Amendment for the same reason.
    "It is well settled law in this circuit that the Second Amendment does not apply to the states," Morgan wrote in dismissing Szymecki's constitutional claims. "Because the Second Amendment does not apply to the states, neither a state law nor a local ordinance can run afoul of any right guaranteed by the Second Amendment."




    The link to the story in its entirety is here http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum54/16111.html


    I asked the question there--and I ask it here.

    If the 2nd Amendment does not apply to the states--then how can the 4th, 5th, 6th and 8th Amendments apply to any citizen? We are, according to the 14th Amendment citizens both of the United States AND of the states wherein we reside. Am I missing something? Opinions?

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    Wow, good question!! I'm not sure of the answer. I do remember a buddy of mine saying that we are actually citizens of our home state, not of the US. Can't remember his citation ATM, but I'll have to try to find it.

    It does put a lot of things in a different perspective if the BOR does not apply to the several states.

  3. #3
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    suntzu wrote:
    If the 2nd Amendment does not apply to the states--then how can the 4th, 5th, 6th and 8th Amendments apply to any citizen? We are, according to the 14th Amendment citizens both of the United States AND of the states wherein we reside. Am I missing something? Opinions?
    The reason for this is the somewhat bizarre theory of selective incorporation the supreme court made up out of thin air. This amounts to the courts deciding on an individual basis which rights are subject to incorporation. The standard by which they decide such things is rather unclear.

    For instance, abortion is something that is never even remotely mentioned, yet the court decided it was somehow a right deserving of being protected in such a way.

    OTOH, they have not (at least yet) incorporated the right torequire a grand jury proceeding prior to being charged with a crime.

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    ilbob wrote:
    suntzu wrote:
    If the 2nd Amendment does not apply to the states--then how can the 4th, 5th, 6th and 8th Amendments apply to any citizen? We are, according to the 14th Amendment citizens both of the United States AND of the states wherein we reside. Am I missing something? Opinions?
    The reason for this is the somewhat bizarre theory of selective incorporation the supreme court made up out of thin air. This amounts to the courts deciding on an individual basis which rights are subject to incorporation. The standard by which they decide such things is rather unclear.

    For instance, abortion is something that is never even remotely mentioned, yet the court decided it was somehow a right deserving of being protected in such a way.

    OTOH, they have not (at least yet) incorporated the right torequire a grand jury proceeding prior to being charged with a crime.
    The kritocracy that we haveaccepted and continue to support will harm our Republic beyond our ability to repair it. There is a long convoluted and illogical precedence train that will only be repaired by the Supreme Court, though this is the same court that invented this problem with the Miller decision.
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Thundar wrote:
    ilbob wrote:
    suntzu wrote:
    If the 2nd Amendment does not apply to the states--then how can the 4th, 5th, 6th and 8th Amendments apply to any citizen? We are, according to the 14th Amendment citizens both of the United States AND of the states wherein we reside. Am I missing something? Opinions?
    The reason for this is the somewhat bizarre theory of selective incorporation the supreme court made up out of thin air. This amounts to the courts deciding on an individual basis which rights are subject to incorporation. The standard by which they decide such things is rather unclear.

    For instance, abortion is something that is never even remotely mentioned, yet the court decided it was somehow a right deserving of being protected in such a way.

    OTOH, they have not (at least yet) incorporated the right torequire a grand jury proceeding prior to being charged with a crime.
    The kritocracy that we haveaccepted and continue to support will harm our Republic beyond our ability to repair it. There is a long convoluted and illogical precedence train that will only be repaired by the Supreme Court, though this is the same court that invented this problem with the Miller decision.
    Would not a new Constitutional Amendment which would require the Bill of Rights to be applied to all states solve the problem? The Supreme Court would not necessarily have to rule on individual cases--merely a Constitutional Amendment causing the Bill of Rights to be applied to all states and all citizens equally. Yes? No?

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    suntzu wrote:
    Being so new to this board, I am still learning the ropes so to speak. Tonight I read an article in the Va. section of the board which details the arrest of an individual for openly carrying his firearm at harborfest. The case against him was thrown out after it was realized that local communities violated a Va. state law which prohibits local communities from regulating firearms. The man sued in federal court claiming I believe violations of his 2nd and 4th Amendment rights.

    U.S. District Judge Henry Coke Morgan Jr. ruled Thursday that Szymecki cannot sue claiming constitutional violations under state or local law. Morgan ruled earlier this year that the city did not violate the Second Amendment for the same reason.
    "It is well settled law in this circuit that the Second Amendment does not apply to the states," Morgan wrote in dismissing Szymecki's constitutional claims. "Because the Second Amendment does not apply to the states, neither a state law nor a local ordinance can run afoul of any right guaranteed by the Second Amendment."




    The link to the story in its entirety is here http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum54/16111.html


    I asked the question there--and I ask it here.

    If the 2nd Amendment does not apply to the states--then how can the 4th, 5th, 6th and 8th Amendments apply to any citizen? We are, according to the 14th Amendment citizens both of the United States AND of the states wherein we reside. Am I missing something? Opinions?
    If this is the case, the central government would have a hissy fit if we claimed that the 16th and 17th Amendments don't apply tothe states either.

  7. #7
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    If the US BOR doesn't apply to the states, then what's the point in having them?

    This sounds more like selective adherence.

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