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Thread: Open Carry

  1. #1
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    In reading some of the post, there was a reference made that open carry of handguns is being discussed in the state legislature. Is there any truth to this or did I misread what I read? I am new to this site, but find it very informative.

    Thanks..

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    buddyleeroe wrote:
    In reading some of the post, there was a reference made that open carry of handguns is being discussed in the state legislature. Is there any truth to this or did I misread what I read? I am new to this site, but find it very informative.

    Thanks..
    What post are you talking about?

    Open Carry is already lawful in CT of you hold the CT carry license.

  3. #3
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    That response is a bit misleading and could land the OP in prison... come on now.

    Technically, it isn't illegal, but try to do it and you will be arrested. There is a court case pending that should decide the issue for good. It would be best to wait until after that case is resolved before attempting to OC into your local gorcery store and getting shot full of holes by the local cops.

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    AWDstylez wrote:
    That response is a bit misleading and could land the OP in prison... come on now.

    Technically, it isn't illegal, but try to do it and you will be arrested. There is a court case pending that should decide the issue for good. It would be best to wait until after that case is resolved before attempting to OC into your local gorcery store and getting shot full of holes by the local cops.
    Huh?

    http://www.ct.gov/bfpe/cwp/view.asp?...18126&PM=1


    GUN PERMIT-RELATED QUESTIONS

    1. Is there any statute prescribing that firearms must be carried concealed?

    The answer is no. The law does not address this issue. But, with limited exceptions, it is illegal to carry a handgun, whether concealed or openly, without a permit, except in one's home or place of business(CGS § 29-35(a)).

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    Mike wrote:
    AWDstylez wrote:
    That response is a bit misleading and could land the OP in prison... come on now.

    Technically, it isn't illegal, but try to do it and you will be arrested. There is a court case pending that should decide the issue for good. It would be best to wait until after that case is resolved before attempting to OC into your local gorcery store and getting shot full of holes by the local cops.
    Huh?


    What?


    Again, very misleading. I wouldn't expect that coming for you of all people.


    http://www.ct.gov/bfpe/cwp/view.asp?...18126&PM=1

    This office does not give legal opinions and this report should not be construed as such.



    DPS and the state police make up and enforce their own laws, and that isn't even to mention the WIDELY pervasive idea (by everyone from local cops to people carrying)that CC is mandated by the CT permit. Until there is solid clarification from the court, open carry isn't a very good idea or youwill end up under arrest. If you'd like to test my logic, by all means attempt to open carry in CT. The enforcement of non-existant laws isn't right, but it's reality.


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    AWDstylez wrote:
    Mike wrote:
    AWDstylez wrote:
    That response is a bit misleading and could land the OP in prison... come on now.

    Technically, it isn't illegal, but try to do it and you will be arrested. There is a court case pending that should decide the issue for good. It would be best to wait until after that case is resolved before attempting to OC into your local gorcery store and getting shot full of holes by the local cops.
    Huh?


    What?


    Again, very misleading. I wouldn't expect that coming for you of all people.


    http://www.ct.gov/bfpe/cwp/view.asp?...18126&PM=1

    This office does not give legal opinions and this report should not be construed as such.



    DPS and the state police make up and enforce their own laws, and that isn't even to mention the WIDELY pervasive idea (by everyone from local cops to people carrying)that CC is mandated by the CT permit. Until there is solid clarification from the court, open carry isn't a very good idea or youwill end up under arrest. If you'd like to test my logic, by all means attempt to open carry in CT. The enforcement of non-existant laws isn't right, but it's reality.
    You should not be afraid of exercising your right. Your just helping DPS by caving in to their intimidation.

    Goldbergs carry incident resulted in a dismissal and although it took over a year it also resulted in the return of his permit with no concession on his part.

    If this isn't proof that open carry is legal that I don't know what else is.



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    Is there not a means of filing criminal charges against police officers for Official Oppression or Abuse of Office? That's what they're doing when they arrest someone for doing something that's not illegal.

    For example, in Pennsylvania, there's Section 5301 of the criminal code which states:

    18 [/b]Pa.[/b] C.S. §5301. Official oppression.[/b]

    A person acting or purporting to act in an official capacity or taking advantage of such actual or purported capacity commits a misdemeanor of the second degree if, knowing that his conduct is illegal, he:

    1. subjects another to arrest, detention, search, seizure, mistreatment, dispossession, assessment, lien or other infringement of personal or property rights; or

    2. denies or impedes another in the exercise or enjoyment of any right, privilege, power or immunity.
    And as for someone "getting alarmed" at seeing a person lawfully carrying a handgun, a Disorderly Conduct charge won't hold because nothing illegal is being done.
    18 Pa, C.S. §5503. Disorderly conduct.[/b]

    (a) Offense defined. – A person is guilty of disorderly conduct if, with intent to cause public inconvenience, annoyance or alarm, or recklessly creating a risk thereof, he:

    (1) engages in fighting or threatening, or in violent or tumultuous behavior;

    (2) makes unreasonable noise;

    (3) uses obscene language, or makes an ob­scene gesture; or

    (4) creates a hazardous or physically offen­sive condition by any act which serves no legiti­mate purpose of the actor.
    [/b]

    Note the wording of Section 5503(a)(4). If you have a license and are carrying for self-defense, that in itself serves a legitimate purpose.

    You people have to take the offensive. Sue the towns, police forces, police officers, whatever. File criminal and civil complaints. With all the lawyers and such that you have in Connecticut, one wonders why you haven't done so yet.

    Right now we're raising Holy Hell with our State Representatives, State Senators, one County Sheriff in particular, and a few other state officials because a soccer mom (literally) lost her license because someone got upset over her open carrying. Here's her news story: http://www.ldnews.com/lebanonnews/ci_10545914

    You people have to start writing letters, lots of them.

    PEOPLE SHOULD NOT BE AFRAID OF THEIR GOVERNMENTS. GOVERNMENTS SHOULD BE AFRAID OF THE PEOPLE.


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    The issue at this point isn't whether it is legal or not. It is whether other statues, most often "breach of the peace" applies if someone becomes alarmed, and calls in a "man with a gun."
    The local Chief of Police told me personally that open carry with a pistol carry permit is absolutely legal, and my right, but said that he thinks that if someone called in, and was alarmed or feeling threatened, he would not rule out a "breach of the peace" arrest.
    So, even after the declatory judgement comes through saying open carry is legal (which you can get yourself by reading the statues), I think they may just move on to, in my opinion, misinterpreting and misusing the "breach of the peace" statute to achieve the same goal.

    Sec. 53a-181. Breach of the peace in the second degree: Class B
    misdemeanor. (a) A person is guilty of breach of the peace in the
    second degree when, with intent to cause inconvenience, annoyance or
    alarm, or recklessly creating a risk thereof, such person: (1) Engages
    in fighting or in violent, tumultuous or threatening behavior in a
    public place; or (2) assaults or strikes another; or (3) threatens to
    commit any crime against another person or such other person's
    property; or (4) publicly exhibits, distributes, posts up or
    advertises any offensive, indecent or abusive matter concerning any
    person; or (5) in a public place, uses abusive or obscene language or
    makes an obscene gesture; or (6) creates a public and hazardous or
    physically offensive condition by any act which such person is not
    licensed or privileged to do. For purposes of this section, "public
    place" means any area that is used or held out for use by the public
    whether owned or operated by public or private interests.

    (b) Breach of the peace in the second degree is a class B misdemeanor.

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    LKB3rd wrote:
    So, even after the declatory judgement comes through saying open carry is legal (which you can get yourself by reading the statues), I think they may just move on to, in my opinion, misinterpreting and misusing the "breach of the peace" statute to achieve the same goal.
    Your comment above makes no sense - how does one get a declaratory judgement "by reading the statues."

    Mere open carry does not comport with the breach of peace statute you set forth above, and the charge, if filed, would go away quickly, and a civil law suit could then be filed for damages.

    Why are these CT people so afraid of their shadows?

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    The declaratory judgment will tell us nothing that you can't get yourself by reading the statutes. We don't need permission to do things that aren't forbidden by law, so merely reading the law has the same effect as a declaratory judgment saying "yes this is legal." They have been insisting that it is forbidden, so that is why the declaratory judgment has been filed.
    Those who expect this to end when they all have to admit that open carry is legal I think may be mistaken. They have been enforcing it all along using other statutes, and are likely to continue doing so until we force them to stop.

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    For a "Breach of Peace" charge to stand, the state has to prove"intent to cause inconvenience, annoyance or alarm, or recklessly creating a risk thereof." That's what the law says.

    How, pray tell, does the lawful carry of a firearm for self defense meet that standard?

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  13. #13
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    Mike wrote:
    LKB3rd wrote:
    So, even after the declatory judgement comes through saying open carry is legal (which you can get yourself by reading the statues), I think they may just move on to, in my opinion, misinterpreting and misusing the "breach of the peace" statute to achieve the same goal.
    Your comment above makes no sense - how does one get a declaratory judgement "by reading the statues."

    Mere open carry does not comport with the breach of peace statute you set forth above, and the charge, if filed, would go away quickly, and a civil law suit could then be filed for damages.

    Why are these CT people so afraid of their shadows?
    I just don't have the $$$$$ to fight a legal battle to get my permit/handgun back if i get arrested.....i don't have a problem OC..as i do everytime i am in NH/VT

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    buketdude wrote:
    Mike wrote:
    LKB3rd wrote:
    So, even after the declatory judgement comes through saying open carry is legal (which you can get yourself by reading the statues), I think they may just move on to, in my opinion, misinterpreting and misusing the "breach of the peace" statute to achieve the same goal.
    Your comment above makes no sense - how does one get a declaratory judgement "by reading the statues."

    Mere open carry does not comport with the breach of peace statute you set forth above, and the charge, if filed, would go away quickly, and a civil law suit could then be filed for damages.

    Why are these CT people so afraid of their shadows?
    I just don't have the $$$$$ to fight a legal battle to get my permit/handgun back if i get arrested.....i don't have a problem OC..as i do everytime i am in NH/VT


    Exactly. Getting arrested for something that can easily be avoided (since weall have CCW permits anyway) simply isn't worth it. If Mike would like to OC in CT and get arrested and fight/pay forthe near-endless legal battle, I'll be behind him 100%. I have neither the time, nor the money to get personally involved.

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    Believe me..if CT was like Virginia..i would be OC'ing all the time (minus the cold months..

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    "...or (6) creates a public and hazardous or
    physically offensive condition by any act which such person is not
    licensed or privileged to do."


    How can the act of open carry be a violation of the breach of peace law, when a person holds a permit to carry a firearm and no statute requires concealment? If a police officer openly carrying a firearm is not a behavior that constitutes breach of peace under the other sections of the statute, how could that very same behavior by a citizen licensed to carry a firearm be construed as such?

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    We keep asking ourselves the same question, but the police have managed to do it several times. Luckily this time Mr. Goldberg, Mr. Peruta, and Attorney Baird aren't letting them get away with it.

    Anyone up for an open carry dinner at the Glastonbury Chili's?

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    JUMPMASTER wrote:
    We keep asking ourselves the same question, but the police have managed to do it several times. Luckily this time Mr. Goldberg, Mr. Peruta, and Attorney Baird aren't letting them get away with it.

    Anyone up for an open carry dinner at the Glastonbury Chili's?


    I'd be down. I'm probably significantly younger than anyone else on here though. Not sure what that means, but I figured I'd throw it out there. I more than likely wouldn't actually OC to the meet though. #1, because I only own an IWB holster and #2, because of my age I'd be the first to be gunned down by the cops with no questions asked.

    But Chili's? Why? Have you ever been to Red Robin? The crazy atmosphere and very laid back staff would make for a much more receptive environment IMO.

  19. #19
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    I was working in New Haven yesterday, and there was a police officer directing traffic at a phone company work site, so I decided to ask him what he would do if he saw someone openly carrying a handgun, in a holster, with a carry permit. I told him to assume that the person was minding his own business, just walking down the street. answer: "I'd arrest him for breach of the peace, and take his permit, and send it to the DPS. Inconvenience, annoyance, and alarm." I told him the reason i was asking was because I had read on the .gov website about the OLR saying that openly carrying was legal with a permit. He interrupted me, and said it was a "concealed carry permit." I told him that they had said it wasn't. He looked a little bit confused. Then he seemed to second guess himself about confiscating the permit, and brought up the point that being accused of a crime was different than being convicted of it, and told me a story about how he knew a guy who had a disorderly conduct charge nolle'd and he had to wait 13 months to get his permit back. Then he said his attitude was to "arrest them, and let the court sort it out."
    /slap forehead
    I thanked him for his thoughts, and told him it was time to get back to work, since they didn't pay me to stand around chit chatting.

  20. #20
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    LKB3rd wrote:
    I was working in New Haven yesterday, and there was a police officer directing traffic at a phone company work site, so I decided to ask him what he would do if he saw someone openly carrying a handgun, in a holster, with a carry permit.
    Never ask a police officer for legal opinions - what would you expect him to say - that open carry is legal? Come on - comments like that just get police officers in trouble or fired.

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    cops are terrible at legal advice....I have been told by a Hartford cop that i was breaking the law for "drinking alcohol as a passenger in a motor vehicle".....i told him that was "non-sense" and i would not pour it out. He then tried to trick me by telling me to step out the vehicle to which i left the bottle of whiskey in the car (there is a local ordinance about open alcohol on public streets)....i told him (politely) to please not touch my alcohol as i was over 21 and it is not against the law to have an open bottle of alcohol in a car in this state....he did a sobriety test on the driver..talked to some superior of his and let us go without saying a word to me.....

  22. #22
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    buketdude wrote:
    cops are terrible at legal advice....I have been told by a Hartford cop that i was breaking the law for "drinking alcohol as a passenger in a motor vehicle".....i told him that was "non-sense" and i would not pour it out. He then tried to trick me by telling me to step out the vehicle to which i left the bottle of whiskey in the car (there is a local ordinance about open alcohol on public streets)....i told him (politely) to please not touch my alcohol as i was over 21 and it is not against the law to have an open bottle of alcohol in a car in this state....he did a sobriety test on the driver..talked to some superior of his and let us go without saying a word to me.....
    Good analogy. It is a myth in Virginia that passengers cannot drink while in a vehicle - completely untrue.

  23. #23
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    Never ask a police officer for legal opinions - what would you expect him to say - that open carry is legal? Come on - comments like that just get police officers in trouble or fired.
    I was asking him because I wanted to see if he knew the laws. I wasn't asking him for legal advice. If I have to defend every post I make from your negative comments, we are going to waste a lot of time here.

    edited with quote

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    LKB3rd wrote:
    I was asking him because I wanted to see if he knew the laws. I wasn't asking him for legal advice. If I have to defend every post I make from your negative comments, we are going to waste a lot of time here.
    i meant in no way to offend you..i have asked multiple police in casual conversation in CT there opinion on open carry and what they would do and from some of their answers i question if they would arrest even for conceal carrying..haha....I believe there are lots of laws they don't know....4-5 years ago I witnessed an officer in Hartford tell a woman that "she needed to wear a helmet if she was going to be a passenger on a motorcycle.".....she then said she would go find one and i told her unless you are 16 or 17, you don't need to wear a helmet...she then got on and the dude riding took off and a cop went after them..i have no idea what happened but i would have been really pissed....

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    That was directed toward Mike. As I typed it, the other posts came up. I should have quoted him to make that clear.

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