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Thread: Yet another walmart post

  1. #1
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    So went into the wally world yesterday.

    As I was entering a female greeter asked me to hold on a minute, than called for a manager... Well I had absolutely no intention about waiting for someone else, so I asked her what this was about.

    Her = Is that a BB gun?

    Me = No

    Her = Can you do that?

    Me = Of course, OC is legal in WA

    Her = I have just never seen anyone besides a officer doing that, I don't know if you can come in

    Me = Walmarts corporate policy is to abide by state law

    Her = Oh... Okay

    And off I went, since nobody tracked me down I am guessing she just took me for my word or got confirmation from someone else.

    Anyways, inside the store. Had a positive short conversation with a gentleman who admitted having a CPL but had never heard of or seen OC before. Directed him to here of course.

    Once again the same sportings good employee I always see was there, and once again he thanked me for OC. He also informed me that all remington ammunition will be going up 3-6% here very shortly.

    Oh and GOOD NEWS SPOKANE CARRIERS! They are NOW FINALLY carrying 9mm blazer brass in Spokane wally worlds. For some odd reason they never did until now... And while it would have been better a long time ago (say 8 months ago when 100 rounds was only 12 bucks), with the current cost of ammo you will still be saving 2 dollars per hundred over even the normally cheapest Winchester White Box.

  2. #2
    Regular Member just_a_car's Avatar
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    Great report David.

    It will be a glorious day when Uneventful OC is the only kind of OC. *daydreams*
    B.S. Chemistry UofWA '09
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  3. #3
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    This is the type of encounter that I like to hear about. Nicely done.

  4. #4
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    lol I had a very mild walmart encounter about a week ago. I stoped by my local poulsbo walmart to grab some rounds before meeting a freind at the range. I was OCing and looking very un theating. I was wearing a tshirt, sandles and talking on my blue tooth. I had my XD on my hip and as I walked in of course I was meet by the greater. It went somthing like this

    "Hello and welcome to-WOW!"
    He did a little half jump as his eye cought my hip but said nothing ells and to be honest I didnt stop or stick around to give him the the opertunity. On my way out he asked if I was a cop, I kept walking didnt break my stride and said no fireman. I had my voice vercorder cliped to me and lissoned to it later that night, I feel kind of bad for scaring him but at the same time had to laugh.
    "Fight like you train, train like you fight"

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    fire suppressor wrote:
    I had my voice vercorder cliped to me
    Right on. So often, it seems like the people who are stopped aren't carrying a voice recorder. Just like carrying a firearm, carrying a voice recorder is for our protection. We need more OCers to start carrying them. It'll only take a few recorded stops for the police to learn that if they choose to stop us, the entire conversation, word for word, will be recorded.

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    fire suppressor wrote:
    lol I had a very mild walmart encounter about a week ago. I stoped by my local poulsbo walmart to grab some rounds before meeting a freind at the range. I was OCing and looking very un theating. I was wearing a tshirt, sandles and talking on my blue tooth. I had my XD on my hip and as I walked in of course I was meet by the greater. It went somthing like this

    "Hello and welcome to-WOW!"
    He did a little half jump as his eye cought my hip but said nothing ells and to be honest I didnt stop or stick around to give him the the opertunity. On my way out he asked if I was a cop, I kept walking didnt break my stride and said no fireman. I had my voice vercorder cliped to me and lissoned to it later that night, I feel kind of bad for scaring him but at the same time had to laugh.
    You didn't scare him, he startled himself.

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    I'm on my way to wallyworld with my gun!

    Not really, but I'll be sure to OC when I get around to going.

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    just_a_car wrote:

    It will be a glorious day when Uneventful OC is the only kind of OC. *daydreams*
    Antagonists are half the fun.

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    cynicist wrote:
    Antagonists are half the fun.
    I prefer the armed but curious. The majority of my conversations have been with people who admit to having a concealed license and just never knew OC was an option.

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    Being that in washington state it's illegal to record someone without there knowledge, do you notify a police officer when he stops you that you're going to be recording the conversation? And if so I'd imagine that they wouldn't allow it or that they'd take the recorder from you. Am I wrong here.



    Thanks, Eric

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    Eric-WA wrote:
    Being that in washington state it's illegal to record someone without there knowledge, do you notify a police officer when he stops you that you're going to be recording the conversation? And if so I'd imagine that they wouldn't allow it or that they'd take the recorder from you. Am I wrong here.



    Thanks, Eric
    A conversation between you and a police officer engaged in official business is not "private conversation" under the definition of the law.

    They can't stop you from recording it, nor can they take the recorder from you. At least not legally. I seem to remember a story where someone had two recorders, one obvious one and a second lapel mike type that was not obvious. The police illegally took the first and then the second recording was used to prove that they had broken the law when they took the first recorder. OTW it would have been their word against the detainee.



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    Should post the recording

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    My understanding of the law is it's illegal to record a private conversation without two-party consent. If you're out in public within earshot of other people, it seems to me this is not a private conversation and thus the law has not been violated if you fail to inform the officer.

    I have several criminal defense lawyers in my family and they take a dim view of police after the things they've seen. They told me to keep my mouth shut and don't say a word about any recordings I'm making, lest the officer simply decide to shoot me and figure out how to make it legit after the fact and they claim they've seen it happen. If you really wind up needing the recording to roast the cop in court, spending a little to fight the BS "illegal wiretapping" charge they'll throw your way in retribution is better than being shot on the street because you pissed off the wrong cop.

    That's their opinion and I abide by it. I, personally, would wear a completely hidden recording device and keep my mouth shut about it the entire time. If you tell a cop you've got it, they may very well (illegally) demand you turn it off, and when you don't abide by their illegal order, you'll be arrested on BS charges.

    As always, don't take legal advice from some random goober like me on the Internet, research the laws yourself, consult an attorney and make your own decision how to proceed. This is your potential freedom we're talking about, so tread carefully.

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    Eric-WA wrote:
    Being that in washington state it's illegal to record someone without there knowledge, do you notify a police officer when he stops you that you're going to be recording the conversation? And if so I'd imagine that they wouldn't allow it or that they'd take the recorder from you. Am I wrong here.



    Thanks, Eric
    A conversation between you and a police officer engaged in official business is not "private conversation" under the definition of the law.

    They can't stop you from recording it, nor can they take the recorder from you. At least not legally. I seem to remember a story where someone had two recorders, one obvious one and a second lapel mike type that was not obvious. The police illegally took the first and then the second recording was used to prove that they had broken the law when they took the first recorder. OTW it would have been their word against the detainee.

    Thanks for the clarification.



    Eric

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    As always, don't take legal advice from some random goober like me on the Internet, research the laws yourself, consult an attorney and make your own decision how to proceed. This is your potential freedom we're talking about, so tread carefully.

    Always good advice!



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    Eric-WA wrote:
    [...] I'd imagine that they wouldn't allow it
    Then their only recourse is to stop talking. An order to stop recording would be an unlawful order as it would infringe upon your 1A newsgathering rights, and your rights to collect evidence on your behalf.

    or that they'd take the recorder from you. Am I wrong here.
    Unless it were pursuant to an arrest, it would be an illegal seizure under the 4th amendment.


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    It is Flora vs State that allow the non-consent recording of a LEO while he is acting in official capacity.

    http://forum.nwcdl.org/index.php?act...downfile;id=27
    "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."

    "though I walk through the valley in the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for I know that you are by my side" Glock 23:40

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    Getting this thread back to Wall-Mart, they can't even keep the policy straight in the same store. I have been to the Renton one three time to buy ammo while OC.

    The first time I was in my BUS uniform and they sold it to me no questions. The second time they thought I wasLEO so they said it was ok, but then I told them I wasn't. Todayhe asked if I was LEO, I said no, he said if someone come in with and gun and wants to buy ammo, he has to get his supervisor. She shows up, asks all the stupid questions(why? real?) calls her manager, he doesn't know what the policy is.They said they can't sell a gun and ammo at the sametime, I said I'm not buying a gun. He said only LEO and people with CPL could carry in the store. He asked to see my CPL, I said sure, but I don't need it to OC and if I was CC you wouldn't know it to ask for my CPL. He was on the phone and either got tired of dealing with me or got the ok and said ring him up.



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    trevorthebusdriver wrote:
    Getting this thread back to Wall-Mart, they can't even keep the policy straight in the same store. I have been to the Renton one three time to buy ammo while OC.

    The first time I was in my BUS uniform and they sold it to me no questions. The second time they thought I wasLEO so they said it was ok, but then I told them I wasn't. Todayhe asked if I was LEO, I said no, he said if someone come in with and gun and wants to buy ammo, he has to get his supervisor. She shows up, asks all the stupid questions(why? real?) calls her manager, he doesn't know what the policy is.They said they can't sell a gun and ammo at the sametime, I said I'm not buying a gun. He said only LEO and people with CPL could carry in the store. He asked to see my CPL, I said sure, but I don't need it to OC and if I was CC you wouldn't know it to ask for my CPL. He was on the phone and either got tired of dealing with me or got the ok and said ring him up.
    I would at the very least try to take it up with the store manager. Inform him that his employees are not aware of the proper policies and it needs to be handled because they don't know what to do, are handing out poor information, and just generally wasting everyones time.

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    (1), I would never show my CC permit to some weaselly retail store manager. It's none of their damn business. If a cop wants to see it, that's different.

    (2), Don't argue with these people. WalMart's Corporate Security Chief, Jason Schmidt, says OC in their stores is OK. He overrules the goofy store managers. His phone number is 253-770-4399. You tell the manager if he has a problem to call Mr. Schmidt, because Mr. Schmidt said it's OK, and if he doesn't stop violating his company's own policies and ring your purchase up like any other customer, you'll be sure to have a conversation with Mr. Schmidt yourself regarding the manager's and his employees' behavior.

    I bought ammo at the Pasco, WA Wal-Mart last week while OCing and nobody said a word.


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    tricityguy wrote:
    (1), I would never show my CC permit to some weaselly retail store manager. It's none of their damn business. If a cop wants to see it, that's different.

    (2), Don't argue with these people. WalMart's Corporate Security Chief, Jason Schmidt, says OC in their stores is OK. He overrules the goofy store managers. His phone number is 253-770-4399. You tell the manager if he has a problem to call Mr. Schmidt, because Mr. Schmidt said it's OK, and if he doesn't stop violating his company's own policies and ring your purchase up like any other customer, you'll be sure to have a conversation with Mr. Schmidt yourself regarding the manager's and his employees' behavior.

    I bought ammo at the Pasco, WA Wal-Mart last week while OCing and nobody said a word.
    I believe I saw in a thread that Jason has moved on, but the number should still be valid for Corporate Security

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    OK. Then don't use Jason's name, just say "Wal-Mart Corporate Security says..." and everything else still applies.

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    tricityguy wrote:
    OK. Then don't use Jason's name, just say "Wal-Mart Corporate Security says..." and everything else still applies.
    Or take tricityguy shopping with you so he can bitch them out for you. Then you can just say "Yeah, what he said!!!!"

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    I would never show my CC permit to some weaselly retail store manager.
    If you're not concealing, fine, but if you are then you might actually be obligated to.

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    If you're not concealing, fine, but if you are then you might actually be obligated to.
    Nope. 9.41.050 only requires me to display to, besides LEOs, "any other person when and if required by law to do so." There is no law that spells out the circumstances under which I would be required by law to do so, ergo, I don't have to do it. Effectively, that wording is useless; it means nothing without the backing of whatever law it speaks of.

    My assumption here is that 9.41.050 leaves the door open for cities to enact laws requiring CPL holders to display upon demand to whomever they choose (perhaps city officials, etc); but there is no state law, so unless the city you're in has one and if the store manager is well versed in it and if you're concealing and if the manager calls the police and if the police want to take you to the station under that city law and if the local prosecutor wants to bring charges under a law that would undoubtedly be unpopular ("I have to stop what I'm doing and show my permit to any goon who asks for it?").. then you could have a problem. That's a huge load of "ifs"...


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