We're going to Norfolk City Council, again!

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I may have signed in last time; I really can't recall. I know no one demanded ID or threatened to photograph me. I would have told them which part of my anatomy they could photograph......let's just say it wouldn't have mattered if the sun were shining or not!:cuss:

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Sheriff wrote:

Thundar wrote:

You would think that Norfolk would have learned their lesson....

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I'm sorry, but I honestlythink certain policeofficers couldn't care less. It's not money out of their pocket, the taxpayers foot the bill for any and all damages in most cases. But.... if a jury were to award Danbus about $50,000 in punitive damages some day, and the city refuses to back up the officer(s), this is the only thing that will wake up the officers. Officers have to pay punitive damages if not insured or if the city refuses to pay for them.

Does it surprise me they messed with him again? No. Would it surprise me if they mess with him again and again and again? No. Do I think they will eventually find a serious crime to charge Danbus with? Yes. Do I think this serious crime will be a completely bogus setup? Yes. Ya see folks, some police officers never get over an award being paid out to a plaintiff. Ya see, it's pretty much the same thing as "contempt of cop". The award means you have beat them at their own game. And you beat them at their own game because they did said or did something wrong.

Without going into much detail at this time, I am highly qualified to state that once a person is awarded damages against a police officer(s), the police officer(s)will re-surface later to play the game again with the same individual.

As sad as it may seem in America, the best thing Danbus can do is have one or two witnesses WITH HIM when he walks in public in the future.

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I have to agree with Sheriff. Danbus may not see this as "him vs the Norfolk PD", but some of them might. What do you bet that the cop who drew down on Dan in the 1st event was "invited" to the bus stop to "verify" that Dan was "the guy"? If Dan's not alone, my guess is they won't mess with him.

The LEO's can play this game with unlimited resources.

One of the "rebuked" cop's buddies makes an anonymous 911 call from prepaid cell reporting "a black man with a gun just assaulted someone" while observing Dan nearby....

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We should get Dan one of those button cameras with audio:lol:

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Cell phone transmissions are not invisable. The number calling and location are easily located and tracked. Plus the voice can be IDd from the 911 recording. Are there ways to confused electronics? Sure. And ways to off-set those too.

Would be a good made for TV show though or a mega bucks settlement if a group of Norfolk's finest conspired to that degree to deprive Dan of his rights. Would expect personal liability judgements too.

All hypothetical anyway.

Yata hey

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BTT

While Danbus is our focus, let us not forget that there are those who are against us all around. See http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum4/16805.htmlas just one more example of our "brother in arms" trying to stick a knife in our backs.

I was going to Norfolk anyhow, but the thread above made me realize that it is not something I might do, but something I must do. I don't want any of the cops in my locality to think they can start getting away with what NPD is trying to do. So far there is no reason to believe they will try, but if the incident with Danbus is allowed to pass without protest it might signal that other cops can get away with it in other jurisdictions.

If we must keep drawing the same line in the sand over and over until NPD and their ilk "get it" then I guess that's what we do,

[/rant]

stay safe.

skidmark

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We really need to brand the city council as permittingand promoting civil rights abuses.

Paint them with the brush that they deserve.

My first cut at an address:

"You the GrandWizards of the Norfolk Chapter of theConstitutionalKleptomania Klan should be ashamed of your anti-civil rights record and actions. The police force of this city has a demonstrated civil rights abuse record. You as the council have a legal, moral and fiduciary duty to correct this abuse of citizens and to purge the police force of those that violate the civil rights of citizens.

You may not like the U.S. Constitution and the individual right to bear arms that it affirms, but you are duty bound to respect it and the citizens that exercise that right, a duty which you have abdicated. Rogue Norfolk Police take your silence and lack of action as a green light to abuse citizens at will.This is a cancer which harms the city and those police officers that have not yet become civil rights abusers.

I have a prescription to fix your city's civil rights cancer. Conduct an independent investigation of the civil rights violations. Make it you policy to terminate any officer with a repeat history of civil rights violations. Require all officers to receive civil rights training which includes the U.S. and State constitutions. Emphasize your commitment to civil rights and the termination policy for repeat violators.

You can ignore our pleas for justice and continue your cities despicable record of civil rights abuse, but we are not going away. Our numbers grow and we have lawyers., the constitution and morality on our side.

All that we ask is that your police respect our rights. It is a very sad day when we must come before you with such a plea."

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Thundar wrote:

We really need to brand the city council as permittingand promoting civil rights abuses.

Paint them with the brush that they deserve.

My first cut at an address:

"You the GrandWizards of the Norfolk Chapter of theConstitutionalKleptomania Klan should be ashamed of your anti-civil rights record and actions. The police force of this city has a demonstrated civil rights abuse record. You as the council have a legal, moral and fiduciary duty to correct this abuse of citizens and to purge the police force of those that violate the civil rights of citizens.

You may not like the U.S. Constitution and the individual right to bear arms that it affirms, but you are duty bound to respect it and the citizens that exercise that right, a duty which you have abdicated. Rogue Norfolk Police take your silence and lack of action as a green light to abuse citizens at will.This is a cancer which harms the city and those police officers that have not yet become civil rights abusers.

I have a prescription to fix your city's civil rights cancer. Conduct an independent investigation of the civil rights violations. Make it you policy to terminate any officer with a repeat history of civil rights violations. Require all officers to receive civil rights training which includes the U.S. and State constitutions. Emphasize your commitment to civil rights and the termination policy for repeat violators.

You can ignore our pleas for justice and continue your cities despicable record of civil rights abuse, but we are not going away. Our numbers grow and we have lawyers., the constitution and morality on our side.

All that we ask is that your police respect our rights. It is a very sad day when we must come before you with such a plea."

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Delete the purple prose and you are good to go. It's really very good and I hope you say every word (except the purple prose).

Name calling, especially at the very beginning, will just shut their ears. Reminding them of the liability they face ought to (fingers, toes, eyes and other body parts crossed) listen carefully.

See you there. I'll be the guy wearing the GUNS SAVE LIVES button.

stay safe.

skidmark

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skidmark wrote:

See you there. I'll be the guy wearing the GUNS SAVE LIVES button.

stay safe.

skidmark

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Skidmark,

Last year everybody except the council was wearing the orange guns save lives buttons.:celebrate

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Thundar wrote:

skidmark wrote:

See you there. I'll be the guy wearing the GUNS SAVE LIVES button.

stay safe.

skidmark

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Skidmark,

Last year everybody except the council was wearing the orange guns save lives buttons.:celebrate

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We are one - strength in numbers!

Someone should offer the city council members buttons.

Yata hey

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Thundar wrote:

skidmark wrote:

See you there. I'll be the guy wearing the GUNS SAVE LIVES button.

stay safe.

skidmark

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Skidmark,

Last year everybody except the council was wearing the orange guns save lives buttons.:celebrate

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Thundar -

I was just trying to make it easier for folks like you to recognize me.

Attempt #2 - you can go to any post office and see my picture - most places have it on a clipboard along with pictures of some other folks, but in some POs its tacked to the wall. I'm the one with the beard.

stay safe.

skidmark

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skidmark wrote:

snip....... you can go to any post office and see my picture - most places have it on a clipboard along with pictures of some other folks, but in some POs its tacked to the wall. I'm the one with the beard.

stay safe.

skidmark

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Is nailed to the wall and he was framed too.

Actually, he is very easy to recognize by his hat.

Yata hey

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Thundar wrote:

skidmark wrote:

See you there. I'll be the guy wearing the GUNS SAVE LIVES button.

stay safe.

skidmark

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Skidmark,

Last year everybody except the council was wearing the orange guns save lives buttons.:celebrate

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It always amazes me how people pick and choose which Civil Rights they like.

This would be completely different if they asked him to sit in back of the bus.

This isn't to say that he is being targeted because he is black. Amendments to the Constitution should all carry the same weight. The one that prevents enforcement of him being forced to the back of the bus, shouldn't be more important than the Amendment that protects his individual right to keep and bear arms.

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If anybody was on the fence about going to the Norfolk City Council meeting, check out http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_topic.php?id=16904&forum_id=54&jump_to=277807.

Come meet danbus (Danladi Moore, soon to be the sole owner of the City of Norfolk.) OK, maybe co-owner with Chet.

stay safe.

skidmark

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Tell councilman Wright that I will try not to offend him by wearing my gun on my hip. If I am healthy enough I will come wearing my EBR slung over my shoulder.:what:

Insults for holstered handguns by the Norfolk City Council???

Fine, as you wish. Time for long gun open carry.

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Is there any reason not to sign in? To me I see the sign in sheet as documented proof we were all there. But I work for a municipality (not Norfolk) as well where the policy is "paperwork, or it never happened."

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Kevin108 wrote:

Is there any reason not to sign in? To me I see the sign in sheet as documented proof we were all there. But I work for a municipality (not Norfolk) as well where the policy is "paperwork, or it never happened."

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The next step is: "Your papers, Comrade."

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While it is your right (assuming Norfolk doesn't have hunting or other ordinance forbidding loaded rifles) and no one can tell you what to do, the problem from VCDL's standpoint is that rifle carry at this meeting will become the main focusanddistract away from the point everyone is coming to make, which has nothing to do with rifles.



Any other meetingwould be preferable for rifle carry, rather than this oneat which so many people are taking time to try to be heard on an important issue.

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Riverdance wrote:

snip......... is that rifle carry at this meeting will become the main focusanddistract away from the point everyone is coming to make........

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What else is there to say!

Yata hey

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Kevin108 wrote:

Is there any reason not to sign in? To me I see the sign in sheet as documented proof we were all there. But I work for a municipality (not Norfolk) as well where the policy is "paperwork, or it never happened."

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By "signing in" or being photographed as a condition of attending a public meeting, the government agency has a record of who attended. The uses they can put to that record are legion.

I am not by any means making a comparison between Norfolk City Council and the Gestapo or the KGB, but there is historical record of whattwo of those agencies did to many of the folks whose names or faces were recorded as having attended public meetings.

Why does there need to be "documented proof we were all there"? Do you believe that somehow some sort of revisionist history will be attempted, where it will be said we never showed up? With all the press coverage that is anticipated, it would take more than Stalin's machine to erase all traces of our presence.

"Paperwork, or it never happened" is good for government actions - IMHO it is essential that there be a documented, traceable record of government action. But we are not talking about government action, we are talking about the government wanting to know who was there - especially in a case where those in attendance were opposing the actions of the government.

I have lived in many countries where the government keeps a heavy eye on its citizens, and exerts a heavy hand on those who do not meekly go along with whatever the government does and says. While I do not fear being "disappeared" for attending the meeting, I do wonder why I have to ID myself in order to watch the government in action.

A final note - I am not aware of any other municipality that has such a requirement. I also recall the Crime Commission meeting at the General Assembly last month, where the CApitol Police were trying to insist we all "sign in" until they read their own Standard Operating Procedures Manual which specifically excluded signing in for the purpose of attending a public meeting. So - why does Norfolk City Council insist we must sign in or be photographed?

stay safe.

skidmark

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Very well put!

Should signing in be considered mandatory this afternoon to gain entry, does that mean Norfolk feels they can change the law at their whim and I can change my name to Mickey M. Ouse whenever I feel like it?