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How we got into this financial mess...

tito887

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sounds like there are numerous factors leading to this economic failure. I guess I'll throw in that as a society we try and live way beyond our means. check out one of those charts showing the average square footage of a house 50 years ago compared to today. people want more and more which requires a lot of money. Money that most of us don't have. And lets not forget that our money is fiat currency, produced by the independent bank called the federal reserve. Our money will inevitably become devalued the longer we live on this system. Even more now thanks to this fiasco. :banghead:
 

AWDstylez

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Alexcabbie wrote:
You sound just like an Ubamanista mole to me.



You sound like you haven't even take an intro. level economics class to me, let alone know anything about what the country is going through right now. Hence the lack of a response with any useful content.
 

Toad

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I truly believe that the so called economic crisis is merely caused by the fact that Americans, generally, are now paying their debt off instead of acquiring new credit.
The solutions for the industries were simple either adjust to the current needs and trends of the people or close your doors; that’s business.
Unlike the government the people realized that you can not borrow your self out of debt. The Government did not like this so they forced new debt on to all of us by way of a socialist bail out plan.
 

AWDstylez

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Alexcabbie wrote:
What the country is going through right now is called DemonRat corruption. I shall see your elitist ass at the voting booth, mole.



Right, right. Rush Limbaugh told you so, didn't he? I guess anyone that actually has a clue what they're talking instead of talking out their ass is "elitist." :quirky

Keep playing the partisan game, that's exactly what they want you to do.



Toad wrote:
I truly believe that the so called economic crisis is merely caused by the fact that Americans, generally, are now paying their debt off instead of acquiring new credit.
The solutions for the industries were simple either adjust to the current needs and trends of the people or close your doors; that’s business.
Unlike the government the people realized that you can not borrow your self out of debt. The Government did not like this so they forced new debt on to all of us by way of a socialist bail out plan.

You might find this entertaining/helpful.

http://docs.google.com/TeamPresent?docid=ddp4zq7n_0cdjsr4fn&skipauth=true&pli=1
 

AbNo

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AWDstylez wrote:
Alexcabbie wrote:
What the country is going through right now is called DemonRat corruption. I shall see your elitist ass at the voting booth, mole.
Right, right. Rush Limbaugh told you so, didn't he? I guess anyone that actually has a clue what they're talking instead of talking out their ass is "elitist." :quirky

Keep playing the partisan game, that's exactly what they want you to do.
Ad hominid for the block, eh? Good job, you're REALLY proving him wrong. :p
 

AWDstylez

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AbNo wrote:
AWDstylez wrote:
Alexcabbie wrote:
What the country is going through right now is called DemonRat corruption. I shall see your elitist ass at the voting booth, mole.
Right, right. Rush Limbaugh told you so, didn't he? I guess anyone that actually has a clue what they're talking instead of talking out their ass is "elitist." :quirky

Keep playing the partisan game, that's exactly what they want you to do.
Ad hominid for the block, eh? Good job, you're REALLY proving him wrong. :p


There's no use arguing with an idiot. It's like trying toexplaintheoretical physics to a child thatjust keeps calling you a poopy head.

"My mind's made up. Don't confuse me with the facts." :quirky
 

Statesman

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I believe this topic is indeed indirectly related to firearms OWNERSHIP and regulation. If your ability to purchase firearms is diminished because your money is worth less and less each year, then it should be relevant. Please note that if this topic is locked for the reason that it is unrelated, it will be unfortunate for our cause.

I don't wish to get into details on the subject of who is our enemy here, but our enemies know they cannot take America by force, so another method was established to steal the wealth of America, to collapse the middle class, where the mass of wealth exists. These enemies are very patient, and have been conspiring for nearly 100 years.

Right now, the dollar is being prepared for hyperinflation, which is a rapid devaluing of the dollar, which will LOWER your standard of living, and eliminate your ability to purchase firearms, much less anything else that is not absolutely necessary to every day living. In fact, it is very possible, that the real confiscation of firearms may come by the way of a starving man giving it up in exchange for government food assistance, in times of economic crisis brought on by hyperinflation. This "confiscation" program will be 100% voluntary, just as your application to the Social Security Administration for an SSN paves the way for easy employment. There is no law that requires you to obtain an SSN.

The dollar will be replaced by the Amero, which has already been proposed for the replacement. The Amero will be the currency of the NAU (North American Union; Canada North America and Mexico). For this reason, I highly recommend everyone purchase what they wish to have as soon as possible, before the inevitable inflationary repsonse hits from the passage of this bailout package.

I'm not speaking of Freddie and Fanny, as they are merely symptoms of the larger problem, which is the Federal Reserve System, a criminal international banking cartel. It is criminal since:
  1. The U.S. Constitution does not grant congress the power to delegate money creation to a GSE (Goverment Sponsored Entity), which is the Federal Reserve System, which was created by charter. It does however, grant Congress the ability to "Coin" money, which means GOLD and Silver coins.
  2. The Coinage Act of 1792 explicity states:
    Section 19. Penalty on debasing the coins
And be it further enacted, That if any of the gold or silver coins which shall be struck or coined at the said mint shall be debased or made worse as to the proportion of the fine gold or fine silver therein contained, or shall be of less weight or value than the same out to be pursuant to the directions of this act, through the default or with the connivance of any of the officers or persons who shall be employed at the said mint, for the purpose of profit or gain, or otherwise with a fraudulent intent, and if any of the said officers or persons shall embezzle any of the metals which shall at any time be committed to their charge for the purpose of being coined, or any of the coins which shall be struck or coined at the said mint, every such officer or person who shall commit any or either of the said offenses, shall be deemed guilty of felony, and shall suffer death.

Why was there capital punishment for debasing coins? Because the founders knew the danger of the Central Bank, which existed in Europe at the time. They wanted to make sure that our monetary system was safe, because they knew it was abolutely essential to the survival of America.

Freddie and Fanny, as well as most financial institutions that issue the credit that caused this current mess, were able to do so because of the ability of The Fed to issue paper money. As a result of this ability, the Fed has created what's known as a "moral hazard" in the financial industry, whereby banks become loose with their lending standards in the interest of making the most profits possible. While the tendency for bankers to loosen lending practices is natural human behavior, such behavior is exacerbated ten fold when the money is easy to obtain through the Federal Reserve money creation mechanism (a printing press). No amount of regulation can regulate long term monetary policy, which can easily shift with the political climate. One law that regulates Fannie and Freddie lending standards, can be deregulated at a later date, when it becomes politically feasible.

Only the Gold Standard (and Silver) can provide a natural restraint on money creation, and that's why Congress only has the power to emit Coins gold and silver.

The Fed is the direct result of Keynesian economics, which is in the opinion of many (including myself), a severely flawed economic system based on the issuance of credit in the form of debt. It is the antithesis of a free market system, and strongly encourages central economic planning, which is also the opposite of a free market system.

Most people don't understand what money IS and what it IS NOT. For a better understanding of why we're in this mess, see a Youtube video called Money as Debt. It is highly entertaining and informative, if you want to see how we truly arrived at this financial fiasco. Here's a hint at what you will learn. Most people believe that when they want money, they go to a bank to obtain it. The problem is, the bank really doesn't have any money to lend, until you come to borrow it! Your signature on the dotted line, promising to repay interest on money that doesn't exist, IS what creates the credit entry in the banks ledger. As frighteningly simple as it is, there IS NO MONEY FOLKS!

From what I've understood, the Federal Government now OWNS 70% or more of existing mortgages. If you have one of these loans, the government now owns your house. Now, what does that say about the guns inside their house?

God save us all.
 

AWDstylez

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Statesman wrote:
While the tendency for bankers to loosen lending practices is natural human behavior, such behavior is exacerbated ten fold when the money is easy to obtain through the Federal Reserve money creation mechanism (a printing press).



Come on man. Lay off the conspiracy theories and try to keep yourself grounded in reality. Does the source you got all that crap from haveany evidence to back any of it up? Nope.

Things like thatare designed to appeal to joe idiot and get him all up an frenzy because he doesn't understand how anything actually works. What's the works cited list look like on that piece? Non-existent I'm sure.



For one, the Fed doesn't print money, nor does it "make money". Again, appeals to joe idiotwho thinks that sounds reasonable. Banks create money through loans. It's calleda fractional reserve banking system. The Fed has indirect control on the money supply through manipulation of the interest rate and the buying and selling of bonds to the banks. This is intro. level economics, people. Come on now.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional-reserve_banking

Don't believe every wack-talk thing you hear on the internet. Research it for yourself and educate yourself. Just because it sounds plausible doesn't make it true.
 

Alexcabbie

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Just a little ray of sunshine into this gloomy topic: Oddly enough the dollar is UP vs the Euro and the price of oil is DOWN. So by the way is the stock market which means that there are bargains to be found there. (buy low, sell high, remember?) And though we may be in for a bit of rough sledding our unique society, culture, and political system will see us through. J.P. Morgan once observed that anybody who bets against the American economy will lose his ass. It's an ill wind after all that does not blow a little good somebody's way. Literally: a guy I was in Boy Scouts with runs a contracting business that cleans up after storms.

Note to Mr. Mole: I listen more to Mark Levin. You ought to call his show. He will hand you your behind before you know it's off.
 

AWDstylez

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Alexcabbie wrote:
Note to Mr. Mole: I listen more to Mark Levin. You ought to call his show. He will hand you your behind before you know it's off.



LOL @ conservative talk radio. Listening to highly biased sources is always your best betwhen you want to be given your opinion. :lol:

Limbaugh would hand memy ass oncertain subjectsas equally well as Chomsky, or myself,would hand you yours. Ass handing isn't exactly a barometer for being right. It just shows relative levels of education and/or debating skillon a particular subject. Much like your total lack of an education has shown grosslyon the subject of economics.
 

thorvaldr

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Why do we have a thread consisting almost entirely of AWDstylez making personal attacks on people who disagree with his (not even gun related) political viewpoints?
 

AWDstylez

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thorvaldr wrote:
Why do we have a thread consisting almost entirely of AWDstylez making personal attacks on people who disagree with his (not even gun related) political viewpoints?



The thread is a DISCUSSION about the financial crisis. There's no DISCUSSION when people post stuff like this...

Alexcabbie wrote:
What the country is going through right now is called DemonRat corruption. I shall see your elitist ass at the voting booth, mole.


...and this...

Alexcabbie wrote:
You sound justlike an Ubamanista mole to me



...and call it a "response." There is ZERO information in that post. I don't care if he disagrees with me; do it with some intelligence and back up your opinions. Shooting "I'm right and you're wrong," back at people isn't conducive to a DISCUSSION.

And FYI, someone pointing out where you're wrong and slapping you in the face with facts isn't a "personal attack" and neither is someone calling you out on a lack of intelligence or knowledge on a subject. Calling someone a "mole" is.
 

Alexcabbie

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AWDstylez wrote:
Alexcabbie wrote:
Note to Mr. Mole: I listen more to Mark Levin. You ought to call his show. He will hand you your behind before you know it's off.
LOL @ conservative talk radio. Listening to highly biased sources is always your best betwhen you want to be given your opinion. :lol:

Limbaugh would hand memy ass oncertain subjectsas equally well as Chomsky, or myself,would hand you yours. Ass handing isn't exactly a barometer for being right. It just shows relative levels of education and/or debating skillon a particular subject. Much like your total lack of an education has shown grosslyon the subject of economics.
CHOMSKY!?!???? NOAH FREAKING CHOMSKY???? YOU THINK I AM UNEDUCATED YOU DAMNED COMMUNIST???? Thanks for finally totally revealing yourself for who you are. And by the way, it was Mark Levin, not Limbaugh. If you are so damned smart then why can't you even get what I am saying straight?? You sir are complete justification for the resurrection of the House Un-American Activities Committee once the Republican party gets back in charge.
 

AWDstylez

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Alexcabbie wrote:
AWDstylez wrote:
Alexcabbie wrote:
Note to Mr. Mole: I listen more to Mark Levin. You ought to call his show. He will hand you your behind before you know it's off.
LOL @ conservative talk radio. Listening to highly biased sources is always your best betwhen you want to be given your opinion. :lol:

Limbaugh would hand memy ass oncertain subjectsas equally well as Chomsky, or myself,would hand you yours. Ass handing isn't exactly a barometer for being right. It just shows relative levels of education and/or debating skillon a particular subject. Much like your total lack of an education has shown grosslyon the subject of economics.
CHOMSKY!?!???? NOAH FREAKING CHOMSKY???? YOU THINK I AM UNEDUCATED YOU DAMNED COMMUNIST???? Thanks for finally totally revealing yourself for who you are. And by the way, it was Mark Levin, not Limbaugh. If you are so damned smart then why can't you even get what I am saying straight?? You sir are complete justification for the resurrection of the House Un-American Activities Committee once the Republican party gets back in charge.

Actually I do think you're uneducated because I don't know who NOAH Chomsky is, although I'm sure NOAM Chomsky, the linguistics department head at MIT (among numerous other accomplishments), knows a hell of a lot more than you do about anything.Calling him a communist because of his humanitarian background and disagreement with US foreign policy is exactly what I would expect from someone as woefully uninformed as yourself.

The difference between someone likemyself and someone like you is thatI can defendmy opinion in a dynamic way with facts, data, andthe support of educated and experienced people because I understand why I believe what I believe and my beliefs are formed from my own research and self-education. You, on the other hand, are given your opinion by people you perceive to be right. You neither understand it, nor do you question it, nor can you defend it in any kind of dynamic argument. Thus you resort to rhetoric, insults, and one liners you heard from Limbaugh. When you wake up and face reality, it sucks to realize that you have no real basis for anything you believe, just a whole lot ofemotion.
 
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