david.ross
Regular Member
imported post
Here is what I sent to OMI and CPRB.
This incident happened on July 4th, 2008
btw, yes the fireworks were beautiful.
edit: also another note. My Alaska CCW does *NOT* have an address, which was the only ID I had on me. Next time I leave the CCW in the car. I'll be ID-less whenever I do OC.
Letter 1 of 2
INCIDENT #070408-01
Officer in question:
Pedley, Robert J. (Robert J. Pedley, Robert Pedley)
Zone 3
Badge # 4082
Issues I want to cover:
1) Officer Pedley's safety procedures:
1.his handling of MY firearm
2.his own safety
3.He was very nervous over a non-issue
2) The illegal seizure of my firearm and property on my person
Officer Pedley's handling procedures:
1) pointed /waved gun in the direction of my legs
2) He did not check to see if the gun was loaded
3) laid a LOADED gun on the tire mounted to the back of the vehicle POINTED towards traffic and where the other officers were standing.
I was walking down the hill from where another and I were watching the boat races and waiting on the fireworks. The location I was walking from was Grandview Ave, across from the Monterey Bay Fish Grotto which has a view of the Monterey Bay. I was really hungry when I started walking down to across the other side of the bay where I could pick up some food. I started jogging down to down via Greenleaf St where I came down to the location where the street intersected with Route 19. I saw officer R Pedley, badge number 4082 who is on location for zone 3, standing there in a safety vest making sure nobody turned up the hill which motor vehicles were being restricted from traveling up the road.
I turned right thinking there was a sidewalk, but then turned straight looking for a time in which I could safely cross the road. Officer Pedley then proceeded to detain me asking me what I was doing. I then told him I was trying to cross the road. He then asked me to step aside while he questioned me. He thought OC was illegal, then he thought I had to conceal since I had a CCW license. He asked me for my ID, I informed him I didn't have to provide ID since I wasn't doing anything wrong. This went on for about 20 seconds before he told me he'd cuff me if I wasn't going to comply, I reiterated the law also stating he should call the Lieutenant. He cuffed me, then I stood there while he called on the radio. I proceeded to ask him for his badge number since he felt it so needy to cuff me. One officer which was already near came over and proceeded to observe. I'm not sure if he was already parked or proceeded to the location once called. I asked the officer if I could stand to the side of the road as to not be where a vehicle may hit me and he gave an okay. Both officers were confused on what the laws were specifically regarding open carry, the second officer on scene told Officer Pedley he didn't know the answer to the CCW and open carry laws surrounding this incident. More officers eventually made it to the scene, who also happened to not be updated on the current laws surrounding firearms and open carry. One officer who arrived by motorcycle stated his opinion, then proceeded to discuss my illegally seized CCW license which is granted from the State of Alaska and also discussed my firearm. The officer then stated the opinion an Alaska CCW isn't valid in PA. I reiterated what I told Officer Pedley about not needing a license to carry a firearm(LTCF) nor a CCW license to carry a firearm openly on foot. I also informed him he should ask the (attorney) general, he said he would. The officers gave their opinion on how citizens should act and give in to police requests without giving a hard time, which they're okay to give their opinion. I replied correctly and tried my best to not be snappy to the other officers since they were only responding to a call from a fellow cohort. Different officers did ask me for my drivers license several times, some more than once, but I informed them I was not required to give them any identification since I wasn't doing anything illegal. To some of the replies, I did tell them I left it at my hotel room for reasons of pick pockets. They asked me why I'd be concerned about a theft in that regard and I informed them I've already ran in to panhandlers who tried to pick pocket me when trying to distract my awareness.
I also told them its my only means of identification to get back on my flight back to Alaska without hassle. I told one of the officers at one time the only identification I had was my CCW license. I also stated they did not need anything but my name, DOB, city and state of residence to get a result from NLETS. I must have reiterated this 5 times during the whole encounter, and did snap in a mean fashion at Officer Pedley at the very end because he asked me for my address yet again. He informed me it was for the incident records, and I only gave it so my info would be in the local Pittsburgh database. I don't mind my information being public, I just don't like stop and ID when a person is doing nothing wrong, especially when there isn't any type of crime in the area with a description of a person which may be mistaken as me being the perpetrator of a crime.
Opinion and misinformation must have gone on for 10 more minutes, but eventually they were able to contact someone to tell them, "it's okay for him to have the gun." The officers all left, except Officer Pedley, who then inserted my illegally seized CCW license and wallet back in to my pocket and inserted my closed pocket knife back in to my right hand pocket. I informed Officer Pedley to I didn't like people handing me a loaded gun and to take the mag and round out of the chamber. He told me he was going to directly insert the firearm back in to my holster. I watched him the whole time very carefully as he did so, since his firearm safety handling leaves much be desired. I don't feel like being on the wrong side of a DEA-agent like incident, Springfield XDs don't have a manual safety.
The entire incident must have gone on for 30 minutes. While I don't know the time the encounter stated, I do know the end time of the encounter was 2026. I started walking about 1930 down the road to town since I was hungry and wanted to grab something to eat so I wouldn't feel fatigued later. So much for obtaining food to eat, I stayed hungry until after 2300 hours shortly after traffic cleared from the area.
Letter 2 of 2
To whom this may concern,
The following is an action plan for future events if an incident occurs similar to the incident I encountered with Officer Pedley on July 4th of 2008. I've taken some time to think on what I could do if there is a next time, which there shouldn't be if Pittsburgh police officers were informed on carry laws regarding firearms, like an encounter which occurred on July 4th.
My action plan is as follow:
1) Upon detainment, to delay, I will start my video recorder on my phone, which will records both video and audio. Law enforcement have no expectation of privacy during their normal duties.
2) Inform the officer he is under recording, if he doesn't know the law I'll give him an expected amount of time based on my own schedule. I'll inform him I will walk away if he is done, since there is no legal basis for stopping someone legally carrying a firearm. There has been no RAS when I was carrying in the past encounters, I was not acting suspicious in any way nor will I ever act suspicious while carrying a firearm. The PROPER action would be to observe, though I don't mind talking to officers if they just have a question long as I'm not being detained.
(side note: I had another encounter in Pittsburgh while I was looking for a place to eat while the bike races were in session. I engaged in the scenario 1984, aka giving my ID. The encounter on July 4th I engaged the scenario, "Hawkins")
3) If the encounter turns out to be like the one which was on July 4th, I will give OMI time to research the incident. If nothing is done, I'll post the video, snapshots of the officer with information regarding the officer on various websites. I for one do not want an officer who can't follow the laws in positions which require interaction with drugs, doing undercover work, or any other position which requires the officer to be not known.
I made a note on the bottom of this letter in pen. My statement was something like, "I only write this, since I plan on moving to Pittsburgh 6 months to a year". Then I initialed the statement afterward since I already signed the letter.
I'm more likely to have encounters, good and bad, since I'm an active person and tend to jog with my firearm. It's not like I'm wanting to have encounters. When I was in Pittsburgh I only had a half dozen people come up to me, they were rather curious or asked me for help(directions, questions, etc).
EDIT: Updated name so search engines will pick it up for indexing.
Here is what I sent to OMI and CPRB.
This incident happened on July 4th, 2008
btw, yes the fireworks were beautiful.
edit: also another note. My Alaska CCW does *NOT* have an address, which was the only ID I had on me. Next time I leave the CCW in the car. I'll be ID-less whenever I do OC.
Letter 1 of 2
INCIDENT #070408-01
Officer in question:
Pedley, Robert J. (Robert J. Pedley, Robert Pedley)
Zone 3
Badge # 4082
Issues I want to cover:
1) Officer Pedley's safety procedures:
1.his handling of MY firearm
2.his own safety
3.He was very nervous over a non-issue
2) The illegal seizure of my firearm and property on my person
Officer Pedley's handling procedures:
1) pointed /waved gun in the direction of my legs
2) He did not check to see if the gun was loaded
3) laid a LOADED gun on the tire mounted to the back of the vehicle POINTED towards traffic and where the other officers were standing.
I was walking down the hill from where another and I were watching the boat races and waiting on the fireworks. The location I was walking from was Grandview Ave, across from the Monterey Bay Fish Grotto which has a view of the Monterey Bay. I was really hungry when I started walking down to across the other side of the bay where I could pick up some food. I started jogging down to down via Greenleaf St where I came down to the location where the street intersected with Route 19. I saw officer R Pedley, badge number 4082 who is on location for zone 3, standing there in a safety vest making sure nobody turned up the hill which motor vehicles were being restricted from traveling up the road.
I turned right thinking there was a sidewalk, but then turned straight looking for a time in which I could safely cross the road. Officer Pedley then proceeded to detain me asking me what I was doing. I then told him I was trying to cross the road. He then asked me to step aside while he questioned me. He thought OC was illegal, then he thought I had to conceal since I had a CCW license. He asked me for my ID, I informed him I didn't have to provide ID since I wasn't doing anything wrong. This went on for about 20 seconds before he told me he'd cuff me if I wasn't going to comply, I reiterated the law also stating he should call the Lieutenant. He cuffed me, then I stood there while he called on the radio. I proceeded to ask him for his badge number since he felt it so needy to cuff me. One officer which was already near came over and proceeded to observe. I'm not sure if he was already parked or proceeded to the location once called. I asked the officer if I could stand to the side of the road as to not be where a vehicle may hit me and he gave an okay. Both officers were confused on what the laws were specifically regarding open carry, the second officer on scene told Officer Pedley he didn't know the answer to the CCW and open carry laws surrounding this incident. More officers eventually made it to the scene, who also happened to not be updated on the current laws surrounding firearms and open carry. One officer who arrived by motorcycle stated his opinion, then proceeded to discuss my illegally seized CCW license which is granted from the State of Alaska and also discussed my firearm. The officer then stated the opinion an Alaska CCW isn't valid in PA. I reiterated what I told Officer Pedley about not needing a license to carry a firearm(LTCF) nor a CCW license to carry a firearm openly on foot. I also informed him he should ask the (attorney) general, he said he would. The officers gave their opinion on how citizens should act and give in to police requests without giving a hard time, which they're okay to give their opinion. I replied correctly and tried my best to not be snappy to the other officers since they were only responding to a call from a fellow cohort. Different officers did ask me for my drivers license several times, some more than once, but I informed them I was not required to give them any identification since I wasn't doing anything illegal. To some of the replies, I did tell them I left it at my hotel room for reasons of pick pockets. They asked me why I'd be concerned about a theft in that regard and I informed them I've already ran in to panhandlers who tried to pick pocket me when trying to distract my awareness.
I also told them its my only means of identification to get back on my flight back to Alaska without hassle. I told one of the officers at one time the only identification I had was my CCW license. I also stated they did not need anything but my name, DOB, city and state of residence to get a result from NLETS. I must have reiterated this 5 times during the whole encounter, and did snap in a mean fashion at Officer Pedley at the very end because he asked me for my address yet again. He informed me it was for the incident records, and I only gave it so my info would be in the local Pittsburgh database. I don't mind my information being public, I just don't like stop and ID when a person is doing nothing wrong, especially when there isn't any type of crime in the area with a description of a person which may be mistaken as me being the perpetrator of a crime.
Opinion and misinformation must have gone on for 10 more minutes, but eventually they were able to contact someone to tell them, "it's okay for him to have the gun." The officers all left, except Officer Pedley, who then inserted my illegally seized CCW license and wallet back in to my pocket and inserted my closed pocket knife back in to my right hand pocket. I informed Officer Pedley to I didn't like people handing me a loaded gun and to take the mag and round out of the chamber. He told me he was going to directly insert the firearm back in to my holster. I watched him the whole time very carefully as he did so, since his firearm safety handling leaves much be desired. I don't feel like being on the wrong side of a DEA-agent like incident, Springfield XDs don't have a manual safety.
The entire incident must have gone on for 30 minutes. While I don't know the time the encounter stated, I do know the end time of the encounter was 2026. I started walking about 1930 down the road to town since I was hungry and wanted to grab something to eat so I wouldn't feel fatigued later. So much for obtaining food to eat, I stayed hungry until after 2300 hours shortly after traffic cleared from the area.
Letter 2 of 2
To whom this may concern,
The following is an action plan for future events if an incident occurs similar to the incident I encountered with Officer Pedley on July 4th of 2008. I've taken some time to think on what I could do if there is a next time, which there shouldn't be if Pittsburgh police officers were informed on carry laws regarding firearms, like an encounter which occurred on July 4th.
My action plan is as follow:
1) Upon detainment, to delay, I will start my video recorder on my phone, which will records both video and audio. Law enforcement have no expectation of privacy during their normal duties.
2) Inform the officer he is under recording, if he doesn't know the law I'll give him an expected amount of time based on my own schedule. I'll inform him I will walk away if he is done, since there is no legal basis for stopping someone legally carrying a firearm. There has been no RAS when I was carrying in the past encounters, I was not acting suspicious in any way nor will I ever act suspicious while carrying a firearm. The PROPER action would be to observe, though I don't mind talking to officers if they just have a question long as I'm not being detained.
(side note: I had another encounter in Pittsburgh while I was looking for a place to eat while the bike races were in session. I engaged in the scenario 1984, aka giving my ID. The encounter on July 4th I engaged the scenario, "Hawkins")
3) If the encounter turns out to be like the one which was on July 4th, I will give OMI time to research the incident. If nothing is done, I'll post the video, snapshots of the officer with information regarding the officer on various websites. I for one do not want an officer who can't follow the laws in positions which require interaction with drugs, doing undercover work, or any other position which requires the officer to be not known.
I made a note on the bottom of this letter in pen. My statement was something like, "I only write this, since I plan on moving to Pittsburgh 6 months to a year". Then I initialed the statement afterward since I already signed the letter.
I'm more likely to have encounters, good and bad, since I'm an active person and tend to jog with my firearm. It's not like I'm wanting to have encounters. When I was in Pittsburgh I only had a half dozen people come up to me, they were rather curious or asked me for help(directions, questions, etc).
EDIT: Updated name so search engines will pick it up for indexing.
Ah, I keep saying "illegally detained", I need to use the correct terminology("Unlawfully") so I speak clearly in the future.