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Thread: 3d Draft of Texas Open Carry Rights Restoration Bill Now Posted for final comments

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    Comments appreciated only on the changes to Sections 46.02 and 46.035 noted below:

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    it appears to me that 46.035 is to be *completely* scrapped.

    I understand why 46.035(a) should be scrapped, but I'm not sure why (a)-(j) should be cut out.

    Maybe I'm just misreading this.

    as for 46.02, I'm all for the modifications as they are.

    Cheers!
    -Tico

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    by the way, is it possible to post copies of these changes either in HTML or PDF (not Microsoft Word) so they're easier to read on public computers in coffeeshops, libraries, et cetera?

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    tico wrote:
    I understand why 46.035(a) should be scrapped, but I'm not sure why (a)-(j) should be cut out.

    Maybe I'm just misreading this.

    as for 46.02, I'm all for the modifications as they are.
    The elements of 46.035b-j are assimilated into 46.02.

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    tico wrote:
    by the way, is it possible to post copies of these changes either in HTML or PDF (not Microsoft Word) so they're easier to read on public computers in coffeeshops, libraries, et cetera?
    Yeah, pending any germane comments, this will be pdfed in the next day or two and then an alert will go out so folks can email their reps and sens and gov. perry, pointing to the draft bill.

    And once again, we are not going to make our bill a christmas tree to change all sorts of things in the Texas Code and derogate the common law of Texas. This is a simple but audacious commando raid with one objective in mind - to liberate the right of open carry in Texas.

    I know some people are still concerned about whether a particular type of holster (e.g., flap orIWB ("In the Wasteband") might me considered "concealed" by a trier of fact - but beside that issue being very unlikley to be decided in somthing other that the same manner as sister state courts, most everybody who is going to be open carrying is also going to have the CHL (and so the objection is moot), or in their own vehicle (again, mooting the objection as no CHL is needed to conceal in any vehicle you own or control).

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    Fantastic!

    Keep up the great work!

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    Thanks Very Much, MIKE, guess I misunderstood the content last night. Thank You Very Much and do have a good day!

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    You guys have to get rid of that stuff about not being able to carry at churches, government meetings, college games, establishments that serve alcohol, etc.

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    Should (3) be added here?

    § 46.02[0]. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. (a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun,[/b] or,[/b] an illegal knife, an[/b] illegal[/b] club, or a concealed handgun[/b] if the person is not:

    (1) on the person's own premises or premises under the person's control; or

    (2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control.

    (3) a holder of a validConcealed Handgun License
    The thing about common sense is....it ain't too common.
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    JUMPMASTER wrote:
    You guys have to get rid of that stuff about not being able to carry at churches, government meetings, college games, establishments that serve alcohol, etc.
    I think that is probably on the way. Rick Perry has made the statement that he wants us to be able to carry "everywhere", courthouses, bars, churches, and he made it veryclear that he meant "everywhere".
    The thing about common sense is....it ain't too common.
    Will Rogers

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    JUMPMASTER wrote:
    You guys have to get rid of that stuff about not being able to carry at churches, government meetings, college games, establishments that serve alcohol, etc.
    Not our bill.

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    rodbender wrote:
    Should (3) be added here?

    § 46.02[0]. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. (a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun,[/b] or,[/b] an illegal knife, an[/b] illegal[/b] club, or a concealed handgun[/b] if the person is not:

    (1) on the person's own premises or premises under the person's control; or

    (2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control.

    (3) a holder of a validConcealed Handgun License
    well, that element is no there now - like many states, the permit scheme is set forth in another Section of code. Also, if we do as you say above, CHL holders could openly carry "illegal knives"

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    And that is bad how? I'd like to be able to carry a switchblade or other spring blade knife as a back up





    The thing about common sense is....it ain't too common.
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    Why? Only an idiot would bring a knife to a Gun Fight! No offence intended.

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    rodbender wrote:
    And that is bad how? I'd like to be able to carry a switchblade or other spring blade knife as a back up




    Read it all this time.
    The thing about common sense is....it ain't too common.
    Will Rogers

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    Did, but I think the best way to travel this journey is one step at a time. This is my observation and I do know that "OPEN CARRY" may possibly engulf that topic as well, who knows. I for one would carry anopther "POCKET GUN" for a back-up. This way I don't have get "Up Close and personal". Now back to the topic!!

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    here

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    Cowboy_Rick wrote:
    Did, but I think the best way to travel this journey is one step at a time. This is my observation and I do know that "OPEN CARRY" may possibly engulf that topic as well, who knows. I for one would carry anopther "POCKET GUN" for a back-up. This way I don't have get "Up Close and personal". Now back to the topic!!
    I do carry a BUG. But I would rather be ready for any scenario. Such as winding up on the ground with my BUG spinning across the parking lot and some BG trying to kick the crap out of meand not being able to use both hands to open a knife. Now can we stop with the insults? If you think itcan't happen to you, then you are mistaken.
    The thing about common sense is....it ain't too common.
    Will Rogers

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    Mike wrote:
    I know some people are still concerned about whether a particular type of holster (e.g., flap orIWB ("In the Wasteband") might me considered "concealed" by a trier of fact - but beside that issue being very unlikley to be decided in somthing other that the same manner as sister state courts, most everybody who is going to be open carrying is also going to have the CHL (and so the objection is moot), or in their own vehicle (again, mooting the objection as no CHL is needed to conceal in any vehicle you own or control).
    I would bet there is plenty of TX case law on just what it takes to be concealed. All them guys worried about "printing" and all. The proposed change cleverly does not legalize open carry. What it does is decriminalize any handgun carrybut concealed carry, which is probably well defined.

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    Rodbender, didn't mean it as an insult, if taken that way I apologize, the SwitchBlade knife would still require a Class 3 license and they have become rather expensive-but yeah why not!It's been a long time since I've had a Class 3 with TAX STAMP so things may have changed-but please check.

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    Mike!

    In Texas it is LEGAL to carry in churches, synagogues, hospitals, nursing homes, amusement parks, government meetings. If you read the end of UNLAWFUL CARRYING BY A LICENSE HOLDER: it states that those prohibitions for the above mentioned places ONLY apply if there is a sign posted in accordance with 30.06. - that is a specific sign that is used in Texas....

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    In other words you struck line (i) out of the Unlawful Carrying by a license holder and just created a bunch of extra places off limit. In Texas we regularly carry at government meetings, including in the Capitol building where I testified on behalf of carrying with no license inside your vehicle, while I was armed and several of the members of the Law Enforcement Committee of the House of Reps were armed, too!

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    Mike!

    Which legislator will carry the bill? Did you speak to anyone yet? I may be able to get co-sponsors to the bill, depending on who you have in mind to carry the bill! I will be down in Austin during the legislative session to help when needed! I can tell you right now that the TSRA WILL NOT HELP ON THIS ISSUE this time around. I had several conversations with Alice Tripp and Jim Dark and they want to save their political capital for more stringent issues, such as legalizing carry on campus. As a first step do you just want to take away the requirement to conceal for permit holders or you just want to dive in head first with the real deal and see what happens?

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    Count wrote:
    Mike!

    Which legislator will carry the bill? Did you speak to anyone yet? I may be able to get co-sponsors to the bill, depending on who you have in mind to carry the bill! I will be down in Austin during the legislative session to help when needed! I can tell you right now that the TSRA WILL NOT HELP ON THIS ISSUE this time around. I had several conversations with Alice Tripp and Jim Dark and they want to save their political capital for more stringent issues, such as legalizing carry on campus. As a first step do you just want to take away the requirement to conceal for permit holders or you just want to dive in head first with the real deal and see what happens?
    Count - Help in Austin would be appreciated - obviously we need to get a core group of legislators ready to sponsor and co-sponsor the bill. I might be able to swing down there in Jan or Feb to check on my house in Texcas and attend some hearings

    I am about to post an alert message for folks to email their legislators - there have been some low key discussions betoween some of our members and legislators, no names releaseable yet. So far, no legislator has siad "no," and they are quite amazed that Texas is one of only 6 states banning Open Carry and that most states require no license to open carry - it makes them speechless and these points resonate very well.

    Our bill as you see above seeks to restore the right to open carry and not tie it to any licensing scheme - others can introduce weaker bills or compromises if they want, but I see no reason to do so - after all, Texas law, incredibly, requires no license to **conceal** in a vehicle one owns or controls - most states regulate both concealing and car carry more than on-foot carry!

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    Count wrote:
    Mike!

    In Texas it is LEGAL to carry in churches, synagogues, hospitals, nursing homes, amusement parks, government meetings. If you read the end of UNLAWFUL CARRYING BY A LICENSE HOLDER: it states that those prohibitions for the above mentioned places ONLY apply if there is a sign posted in accordance with 30.06. - that is a specific sign that is used in Texas....
    Count - I (almost fully) copied the 30.06 triggering requirement, but just forgot to ensure it covered the public meetings carry ban too.

    So, I fixed it: "(g) Subsections (b)(4-7) do not apply if the actor was not given effective notice under Section 30.06." See the attached doc and confirm that this corrects what you were concerned about.

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