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Thread: Anti Open Carry/VCDL article in Virginian Pilot

  1. #1
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    After reading this trash...do us all a favor and visit the VP and share your comments - it only takes a few seconds of your time. I am responding right now.

    --------------------------------------------------------

    Public safety loses in gun right protests

    The Virginian-Pilot
    © October 11, 2008

    There are rights, and there are responsibilities that accompany each right.
    The classic and well-worn illustration is that it is irresponsible - not to mention illegal - to shout "Fire!" in a crowded theater, though the right to free speech is one of America's most cherished. The reason for the prohibition is that people might be hurt in a stampede to escape.

    So while members of the Virginia Citizens Defense League have the right to carry guns on their hips as they strut our streets, thanks to the Second Amendment to the Constitution and Virginia's legislature, their intentional provocation of Norfolk police officers does not make city streets any safer. That's irresponsible.

    The VCDL, with a mailing address in Northern Virginia, lately seems to believe its mission is to transform the government and police department of the city of Norfolk, to make our community a friendlier place for its members and their campaign for displayed weapons.

    Luckily for the VCDL, those same members get to go home when they're done making trouble in Norfolk. They don't have to rely on Norfolk officers who might understandably hesitate when dispatched by 911 to figure out why somebody is walking down the street with a weapon, or lingering in front of an ATM.

    The VCDL wants to normalize displayed guns in a community that has paid far too high a price for gun violence.

    The organization wants to make it commonplace for people - law abiding and not - to walk down the streets of Norfolk with a gun in a holster.

    If the VCDL gets to raise its profile and fatten its coffers in the bargain, all the better. Most of Norfolk has no interest in what the VCDL is selling and frowns on guns in playgrounds and restaurants and City Hall and festivals, all places where VCDL advocates wearing weapons.

    Members intentionally provoke a public reaction, then are outraged when law-abiding citizens call the police about an armed stranger, or when police aren't sufficiently deferential to their Second Amendment rights.

    Norfolk's citizens want a strong police force to help prevent violence in the city. We want them to respect the rights of everyone, of course, but first we want them to make sure an armed man, in a public place, means us no harm.

    And now, thanks to the hassling presence of VCDL members, thanks to a campaign to cow the police, thanks to pandering lawmakers in Richmond, Norfolk officers may hesitate the next time they're faced with an armed person who may or may not intend violence.

    For a group that professes a proud allegiance to the principles of law and order, it is a discordant result that calls into question their tactics, their intentions, and quite possibly their motives.

    Edit - add url: http://tinyurl.com/4bh4s5



  2. #2
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    Renegade wrote:
    After reading this trash...do us all a favor and visit the VP and share your comments - it only takes a few seconds of your time. I am responding right now.

    --------------------------------------------------------

    Public safety loses in gun right protests

    The Virginian-Pilot
    © October 11, 2008

    There are rights, and there are responsibilities that accompany each right.
    The classic and well-worn illustration is that it is irresponsible - not to mention illegal - to shout "Fire!" in a crowded theater, though the right to free speech is one of America's most cherished. The reason for the prohibition is that people might be hurt in a stampede to escape.

    So while members of the Virginia Citizens Defense League have the right to carry guns on their hips as they strut our streets, thanks to the Second Amendment to the Constitution and Virginia's legislature, their intentional provocation of Norfolk police officers does not make city streets any safer. That's irresponsible.

    The VCDL, with a mailing address in Northern Virginia, lately seems to believe its mission is to transform the government and police department of the city of Norfolk, to make our community a friendlier place for its members and their campaign for displayed weapons.

    Luckily for the VCDL, those same members get to go home when they're done making trouble in Norfolk. They don't have to rely on Norfolk officers who might understandably hesitate when dispatched by 911 to figure out why somebody is walking down the street with a weapon, or lingering in front of an ATM.

    The VCDL wants to normalize displayed guns in a community that has paid far too high a price for gun violence.

    The organization wants to make it commonplace for people - law abiding and not - to walk down the streets of Norfolk with a gun in a holster.

    If the VCDL gets to raise its profile and fatten its coffers in the bargain, all the better. Most of Norfolk has no interest in what the VCDL is selling and frowns on guns in playgrounds and restaurants and City Hall and festivals, all places where VCDL advocates wearing weapons.

    Members intentionally provoke a public reaction, then are outraged when law-abiding citizens call the police about an armed stranger, or when police aren't sufficiently deferential to their Second Amendment rights.

    Norfolk's citizens want a strong police force to help prevent violence in the city. We want them to respect the rights of everyone, of course, but first we want them to make sure an armed man, in a public place, means us no harm.


    And now, thanks to the hassling presence of VCDL members, thanks to a campaign to cow the police, thanks to pandering lawmakers in Richmond, Norfolk officers may hesitate the next time they're faced with an armed person who may or may not intend violence.

    For a group that professes a proud allegiance to the principles of law and order, it is a discordant result that calls into question their tactics, their intentions, and quite possibly their motives
    I see no issue with that, but there is a difference in responding to a call and seeing nothing is wrong and not bothering the citizen. Compared to arresting them, harassing them, and trashing their civil rights.

    Another brain dead liberal editorial

  3. #3
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    There's no point in arguing with people like the writer of this article. They are the ones who have sinister motives. They are the ones who want to disarm free people.

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    The Pilot has gone from red to blue over the 15 yrs. I have been here. I hope the buyer of this for-sale paper fires all the liberals that have taken over the editorialwriting and most of the columnists as well, but not Kerry Dougherty.

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    Unfortunately Norfolk does not make the rules. Virginia does. Unless Norfolk wants to secede from the Commonwealth and fund themselves with only their own taxes I think it would be best that they urge their law enforcement to enforce the LAW not offensive people. Should we start harrasing people of Islamic faith because some people are frightened of them? NO! Should we harrass thug wannabes because we feel they may be drug dealers or gang bangers? No! This is called PROFILING and is not tolerated in any sector of society that I am aware of EXCEPT for people who want to protect themselves by taking advantage of the 2nd Amendment.

    These people don't like the idea of proactively protecting the country (because they were not effected by 9/11) but when it becomes PERSONAL then they expect our government to proactively target people who aren't even really a threat.

    And again, what is up with people so offended by people OPEN carrying a gun but not CONCEALED carrying? What's the difference in regards to the "safety" that they are suddenly so concerned about?


    All in all....I think this article is a good thing. It shows that you guys are a threat to the antis and that you guys are making a difference. Everyone here should print this out, frame it and consider it a trophy for your hard work and passion for the Constitution.

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    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
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    "carry guns on their hips as they strut our streets..."

    Y'all gotta come up with a 'walk'... 'The Norfolk strut...' :quirky

    Whoever wrote this crap is a leftoid moonbat.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    I am a Virginia Pilot and I like the VCDL


    Carry On.

    Ed

    VirginiaOpenCarry.Org (Coins, Shirts and Patches)
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    For VA Open Carry Cards send a S.A.2S.E. to: Ed's OC cards, Box 16143, Wash DC 20041-6143 (they are free but some folks enclose a couple bucks too)

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    Regular Member ProShooter's Avatar
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    I wouldnt expect a pro-gun article to come from the Virginia Pilot. It is not a surprise.


    James Reynolds

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    Here's an anti-anti-va pilot vcdl article:

    well after stumbling upon this site, through another, and taking in all the info I could, I purchased my first personal-defense firearm in July... I am now looking to a 10/22 sa for me and my son to enjoy at the range together. Today, at the Va Beach gun show, I saw the VCDL booth and immediately joined! Funny thing was, they started some sort of pitch as to why, I simply stated I've been on OCDO and I wanted to join, no more, no less. Needless to say I am awaiting my card but was issued a temporary one in the meantime. Now if I could only manage to tackle the wal-mart at nimmo and get it out of the way.



    edited for typo

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    carry guns on their hips as they strut our streets...Y'all gotta come up with a 'walk'... 'The Norfolk strut...
    Some pictures please, so we can walk the "Norfolk Strut" in Arizona.

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    The Virginia-Pilot wrote:
    Public safety loses in gun right protests
    And now, thanks to the hassling presence of VCDL members, thanks to a campaign to cow the police, thanks to pandering lawmakers in Richmond, Norfolk officers may hesitate the next time they're faced with an armed person who may or may not intend violence.


    This is the weakest and most challengeable point in the article.

    There is no substantiation whatsoever for it.

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    Regular Member sccrref's Avatar
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    Her is my thought on the matter:
    "Public safety loses in gun right protests." is absurd to say the least. If the Police are every 15 ft throughout a city, responsible and accoutable for the protection of individual citizens, then we would not have as many criminals as we do today. As this is not so, it is each individuals duty as a responsible citizen to protect themselves, their families and society. Public safety loses when gun control succedes. I am not currently a member of VCDL but I also consider it my mission to transform government and police departments of any city that violates people's rights in this country. You should be ashamed to do less. Your welcome for others and my military service that allows you the freedom to choose which rights a person in the land of the free gets to exercise.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    GWbiker wrote:
    carry guns on their hips as they strut our streets...Y'all gotta come up with a 'walk'... 'The Norfolk strut...
    Some pictures please, so we can walk the "Norfolk Strut" in Arizona.
    It very easy to do and requires little or no practice - simply OC your favorite self-defence tool and walk with your head held high!

    I guess I've been "strutting" all day.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    tripledipper wrote:
    The Pilot has gone from red to blue over the 15 yrs. I have been here. I hope the buyer of this for-sale paper fires all the liberals that have taken over the editorialwriting and most of the columnists as well, but not Kerry Dougherty.
    It has always been the Virginia Pravda.
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitableand let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come . PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    GWbiker wrote:
    Some pictures please, so we can walk the "Norfolk Strut" in Arizona.
    Prior to attempting the "Norfolk Strut" you must first pass the "Virginia Tuck" portion of training. I am confident you will do just fine!!!

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    I'm picturing the Chicken Dance and it's harming my psyche...

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    Tomahawk wrote:
    I'm picturing the Chicken Dance and it's harming my psyche...
    How can you tell? :P



    That it's not, say,some other dance?

  18. #18
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    GWbiker wrote:
    carry guns on their hips as they strut our streets...Y'all gotta come up with a 'walk'... 'The Norfolk strut...
    Some pictures please, so we can walk the "Norfolk Strut" in Arizona.
    There was a dance called the 'Stroll' back in the late '50's... I'm havin' visions of the 'Stroll'... gun side prominant... 'Sort'a put one foot forward, rock back, slide the other foot forward to the outside of that foot... while twistin' the upper body sideways. Repeat. Ya can't go fast... but style is everything. 'Bout a 3-3-4 beat I think will do it.

    (Somebody's gonna fall down doin' this... I just know it!)

  19. #19
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    Public safety loses in gun right protests

    The Virginian-Pilot
    © October 11, 2008

    There are rights, and there are responsibilities that accompany each right. -We want our right to carry anytime anyplace no questions asked. We want the city, state , and government to recognize this right as there responsibility.
    The classic and well-worn illustration is that it is irresponsible - not to mention illegal - to shout "Fire!" in a crowded theater, though the right to free speech is one of America's most cherished. The reason for the prohibition is that people might be hurt in a stampede to escape.

    So while members of the Virginia Citizens Defense League have the right to carry guns on their hips as they strut our streets, thanks to the Second Amendment to the Constitution and Virginia's legislature, their intentional provocation of Norfolk police officers does not make city streets any safer. That's irresponsible. -At least they recognize that right. I don't strut. I do more of a swagger.
    -If it was provocation we would call the PD and tell them where we are going as say "what are you going to do about it, Oh ya nothing because its within my rights". -Apparently having the PD around doesn't make the streets 100% safe either. Whats irresponsible is saying we are responsible for our own safety then telling us we can't protect ourselves.


    The VCDL, with a mailing address in Northern Virginia, lately seems to believe its mission is to transform the government and police department of the city of Norfolk, to make our community a friendlier place for its members and their campaign for displayed weapons. -Who cares what mailing address VCDL has or where the headquarters is located. We want the city and PD to stop harassing folks once they know we mean no harm and yesI do feel it makes the city a safer friendlier place.

    Luckily for the VCDL, those same members get to go home when they're done making trouble in Norfolk. They don't have to rely on Norfolk officers who might understandably hesitate when dispatched by 911 to figure out why somebody is walking down the street with a weapon, or lingering in front of an ATM.

    The VCDL wants to normalize displayed guns in a community that has paid far too high a price for gun violence. -Only if your a law abiding citizen. The gun violence caused by the criminals not the law abiding citizen 98% of the time.

    The organization wants to make it commonplace for people - law abiding and not - to walk down the streets of Norfolk with a gun in a holster. -Not commonplace but recognized and excepted as a right. Law abiding yes, criminal or those unable to own a firearm no. Hello what makes them think we want the criminals to be able to carry as well. YesI want to be able to go about my daily tasks carrying in a holster of course.

    If the VCDL gets to raise its profile and fatten its coffers in the bargain, all the better. Most of Norfolk has no interest in what the VCDL is selling and frowns on guns in playgrounds and restaurants and City Hall and festivals, all places where VCDL advocates wearing weapons. -Seems to me that covers many of the places that crime happens. Gee wonder why I want to protect myself.

    Members intentionally provoke a public reaction, then are outraged when law-abiding citizens call the police about an armed stranger, or when police aren't sufficiently deferential to their Second Amendment rights. -The problem isn't with a citizen calling the PD. Its when the PD knows a carrier means no harm and they use continue to use there position and abuse of authority for intimidation.

    Norfolk's citizens want a strong police force to help prevent violence in the city. We want them to respect the rights of everyone, of course, but first we want them to make sure an armed man, in a public place, means us no harm. -As well as an unbiased and law abiding force.

    And now, thanks to the hassling presence of VCDL members, thanks to a campaign to cow the police, thanks to pandering lawmakers in Richmond, Norfolk officers may hesitate the next time they're faced with an armed person who may or may not intend violence. -criminals don't usually carry a firearm openly in a holster while dining out or shopping with the family.

    For a group that professes a proud allegiance to the principles of law and order, it is a discordant result that calls into question their tactics, their intentions, and quite possibly their their motives. -AllI want to do is be able to defend my family and myself anytime anyplace if I should have to. The factI have a gun doesn't make me a criminal or that I'm about to commit a crime. I just want my rights recognized and to not be herassed about it.
    AD1(AW) USN (ACT) 12/07/1997-10/02/2011
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Bullbuster wrote:
    Snip........
    For a group that professes a proud allegiance to the principles of law and order, it is a discordant result that calls into question their tactics, their intentions, and quite possibly their their motives. -AllI want to do is be able to defend my family and myself anytime anyplace if I should have to. The factI have a gun doesn't make me a criminal or that I'm about to commit a crime. I just want my rights recognized and to not be herassed about it.
    To paraphrase:

    For a newspaper that professes a proud allegiance to the principles of law and order, it is a discordant article that calls into question their tactics, their intentions, and quite possibly their their motives.

    It is the law and our right so to do - that's simple enough isn't it. You do support the laws of the Commonwealth of Virginia don't you?

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  21. #21
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    Sometimes I wonder if articles likethis oneare written by criminals as they would be the ones to best benefit from guns not being allowed.

  22. #22
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    darthmord wrote:
    Sometimes I wonder if articles likethis oneare written by criminals as they would be the ones to best benefit from guns not being allowed.
    And so it is with ALL attacks on the right to self-defense.

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Grapeshot wrote:
    Bullbuster wrote:
    Snip........
    For a group that professes a proud allegiance to the principles of law and order, it is a discordant result that calls into question their tactics, their intentions, and quite possibly their their motives. -AllI want to do is be able to defend my family and myself anytime anyplace if I should have to. The factI have a gun doesn't make me a criminal or that I'm about to commit a crime. I just want my rights recognized and to not be herassed about it.
    To paraphrase:

    For a newspaper that professes a proud allegiance to the principles of law and order, it is a discordant article that calls into question their tactics, their intentions, and quite possibly their their motives.

    It is the law and our right so to do - that's simple enough isn't it. You do support the laws of the Commonwealth of Virginia don't you?

    Yata hey
    GS

    I wish a was better with words like you are. For now I have to settle with my bad english. I too often type like I talk and as such don't go hand in hand.
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  24. #24
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Bullbuster wrote:
    GS

    I wish a was better with words like you are. For now I have to settle with my bad english. I too often type like I talk and as such don't go hand in hand.
    It takes many voices to make a choir - you're doing just fine!

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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