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Thread: Banks & Feds

  1. #1
    State Researcher Bill Starks's Avatar
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    Now that the feds are bailing out a bunch of the banks will they fall under USC title 18 as to the carry of weapons?

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    Doubt it. I don't think the feds are actually getting an ownership interest in the banks, are they?

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    I think that's a valid question that need to be addressed. They are taking partial ownership. 49% in some cases. Very pointed observation!

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    Since the government is buying stock in banks, they will definitely have partial ownership. I don't know what this means in terms of where we can carry though.

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    thewise1 wrote:
    Since the government is buying stock in banks, they will definitely have partial ownership. I don't know what this means in terms of where we can carry though.
    Owning stocks is not the same as owning a property. It is merely an interest in the companies business. For example, the Green Bay Packers are a publicly held corporation. Although buying a share of Packer stock gives me an ownership interest in the team I still don't have a right to walk in and take a seat in the stadium during a game or wander around the facility. The Green Bay Packers still own and control the property.

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    Owning stocks is not the same as owning a property.
    Right, that's exactly what I was getting at. It's still private property owned by the banks. The law should only come into play if the physical property itself were seized and placed under control of the federal government, making it effectively the same as a federal building or post office. I doubt that is happening.


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    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Ownership of stock (Non-Voting stock at that) makes the Government as much an owner of the Bank and it's Property as you are an owner of a Boeing Factory just because you own Boeing Stock.

    Stock ownership merely means you own a piece of the company's profits which are paid in the form of Dividends (if any).
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

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    Regular Member TFred's Avatar
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    This and several other posts have caught me by surprise... In my Virginia CCW class earlier this summer, the instructor specifically said that one could not carry on Federal property, which extended to federally insured institutions, which would include FDIC and NCSIF insured banks and credit unions.

    It would appear that this is not correct... Needless to say, it is somewhat disappointing to discover that such material learned in my class is incorrect.

    Any comments/confirmations/denials?

    TFred

    P.S. Ooops, just realized this was in the Washington State forum! Indiscriminate use of the SEARCH command is not always good! I suppose the question still stands, however...


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    TFred wrote:
    In my Virginia CCW class earlier this summer, the instructor specifically said...
    In my experience this usually means that there is a 50% chance of it being right. It's right up there with the letter that often comes with CCW permits from the local leo (which is maybe 50% right,) again, in my experience.

    This is a great place to START getting information but it is up to every carrier (open or concealed) to have satisfied themselves that they know the law in their jurisdiction(s) and "My CCW instructor told me" "The LEO I talked to said..." and "Some guy said it on the internet" are not exactly the best sources.

    -adamsesq



  10. #10
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    TFred wrote:
    This and several other posts have caught me by surprise... In my Virginia CCW class earlier this summer, the instructor specifically said that one could not carry on Federal property, which extended to federally insured institutions, which would include FDIC and NCSIF insured banks and credit unions.
    I have never seen this in any law that I have read or in any bulletin or website regarding federal firearms laws. Rather than try to prove a negative, however, I suggest you contact the company that put on the CCW class you took and ask them to provide a source for their claim. This is probably an easier way to find the answer. Either they have a source (which no one else has ever heard of) or they are wrong and they should acknowledge that fact. (And change their class)

  11. #11
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    TFred wrote:
    This and several other posts have caught me by surprise... In my Virginia CCW class earlier this summer, the instructor specifically said that one could not carry on Federal property, which extended to federally insured institutions, which would include FDIC and NCSIF insured banks and credit unions.
    Just because the Fedsinsure banks, don't mean they own it. If thatwere the case, your car is not yours but the insurance companies. It is amazing the crap instructors out there still sellingto their students. Ask for a cite of what law says this. He will be SOL as there isn't one.



  12. #12
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Bear 45/70 wrote:
    It is amazing the crap instructors out there still sellingto their students.
    They do it because there is no "Standard" for instruction in the field of Firearms Training and they continue because nobody has sued their shorts off for providing faulty information.

    Most instructors teach what they "feel" is the law rather than taking time to learn what it actually is. I ask "Just how many instructors that are currently teaching in Washington State know that Open Carry is legal. I know of three that actually tell their students it is illegal and falls under RCW 9.41.270.

    As for Banks, one might use a little judgement if they choose to open carry. Maybe only do so where you are KNOWN as a customer and make sure that none of your actions can be misunderstood.
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

  13. #13
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    Be nice to come up with a standardized curiculum and market that to firearms instructors. Of course the ones who "know better" will keep teaching the same garbage.

  14. #14
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    amlevin wrote:
    Bear 45/70 wrote:
    It is amazing the crap instructors out there still sellingto their students.
    They do it because there is no "Standard" for instruction in the field of Firearms Training and they continue because nobody has sued their shorts off for providing faulty information.

    Most instructors teach what they "feel" is the law rather than taking time to learn what it actually is. I ask "Just how many instructors that are currently teaching in Washington State know that Open Carry is legal. I know of three that actually tell their students it is illegal and falls under RCW 9.41.270.

    As for Banks, one might use a little judgement if they choose to open carry. Maybe only do so where you are KNOWN as a customer and make sure that none of your actions can be misunderstood.
    A bit by way of a different direction here: About the end of last June I had an encounter with local management of the Ferndale branch of Key Bank. The Assistant Manager tried to claim banks were on the no-firearms list under the law. I presented them with a print-out of the RCW and they ran it up to corporate security, and the answer a few days later was that OC is OK in their branches. (Cf the discussion:

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum55/3630-10.html

    I never followed up on this and I never got it in writing, but I think Key Bank should be put on the Good Guys list. Would I need to get something in writing on this?

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