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Thread: Seattle Parks Gun Ban

  1. #1
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    Saw the sign in the attached image at Westlake park.

    Looked up SMC 18.12, found this:

    SMC 18.12.140 - Firearms prohibited; exceptions

    It is unlawful to carry a firearm in any park; provided, that this
    section shall not apply to police officers or to Department of Parks
    and Recreation employees acting pursuant to and in accordance with
    rules and regulations of the Superintendent; and provided further,
    that this section shall not apply at shooting, trap-shooting and
    skeet-shooting ranges.

  2. #2
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    Of course it is preempted by state law. Why would this be any different than any other city, county, municipality law anywhere else in the state?

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    Look at the bottom of the sign. I would be of the mind to follow their directions and "Call 911" to report the illegal activity of the city violating preemption.

    -adamsesq

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    adamsesq wrote:
    Look at the bottom of the sign. I would be of the mind to follow their directions and "Call 911" to report the illegal activity of the city violating preemption.

    -adamsesq
    this would be awesome. I would totally do this.

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    this would be awesome. I would totally do this.
    It would only serve to cause trouble, and probably trouble for you. The appropriate place to handle this is with the city attorney. I would immediately put him and other top city officials on notice that this is illegal and, as a citizen, you demand accountability in government, and what, exactly, are they doing to correct this?

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    tricityguy wrote:
    this would be awesome. I would totally do this.
    It would only serve to cause trouble, and probably trouble for you. The appropriate place to handle this is with the city attorney. I would immediately put him and other top city officials on notice that this is illegal and, as a citizen, you demand accountability in government, and what, exactly, are they doing to correct this?
    Sadly this is the best course of action. However if I were bored, and had the money/balls to pull it off it would be humorous.

  7. #7
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    Unfortunately I'm not a citizen (resident of Oregon on long-term work assignment in Seattle), so don't have the power of threatening to pull my vote (for whatever that's worth).


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    grishnav wrote:
    Unfortunately I'm not a citizen (resident of Oregon on long-term work assignment in Seattle), so don't have the power of threatening to pull my vote (for whatever that's worth).
    True, but they have no way of knowing that.
    CZ 75B 9mm, Ruger P94 .40 S&W, Bersa Thunder .380, AR-15 Homebuild

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    Bear 45/70 wrote:
    Of course it is preempted by state law. Why would this be any different than any other city, county, municipality law anywhere else in the state?
    That's what I thought, but I'm not nearly as familiar with WA law as with Oregon.

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    OC picnic time? They can't arrest over 10 people with one squad car, and if they did, that would be a HUGE lawsuit w/ plenty of media attention.

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    grishnav wrote:
    Bear 45/70 wrote:
    Of course it is preempted by state law. Why would this be any different than any other city, county, municipality law anywhere else in the state?
    That's what I thought, but I'm not nearly as familiar with WA law as with Oregon.
    Washington law is better than Oregon's preemption. We don't allow anyone to exceed state law. They can have no discharge zones, but they can restrict carry past state law.

  12. #12
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    Ugh. It's preemempted.

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    Bear 45/70 wrote:
    grishnav wrote
    We don't allow anyone to exceed state law.
    Not totally true. The convention center CPL thing is kinda similar to the county/city CHL thing.

    But I'm nitpicking, and I agree with you. WAs is better and more comprehensive, even including the convention center thing.

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    sv_libertarian wrote:
    Ugh. It's preemempted.
    So how do we go about getting it removed from the books and signage?

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    grishnav wrote:
    sv_libertarian wrote:
    Ugh. It's preemempted.
    So how do we go about getting it removed from the books and signage?
    Write and complain? I don't live in Seattle anymore, I hate to say it, but it is off my radar for the most part. IIRC someone wrote to the parks department there before, and they responded with they are old signs, etc...

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    grishnav wrote:
    Bear 45/70 wrote:
    grishnav wrote
    We don't allow anyone to exceed state law.
    Not totally true. The convention center CPL thing is kinda similar to the county/city CHL thing.

    But I'm nitpicking, and I agree with you. WAs is better and more comprehensive, even including the convention center thing.
    Sorry that is part of state law.

  17. #17
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    http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Read.aspx?ID=4212

    Attorney General says basically that anything not in State Law does not count. Since ONLY State Law can regulate firearms as is written in... State Law... And since the parks are public property they(county/city) can't regulate firearms on them because they do not have the power to do so. It's like when Seattle city mayor did that anti cc thing basically all they could do was ask you to leave the premises or charge you with trespassing. Since there was no actual LAW against it they couldn't charge you with anything. So all in all the only thing cops can do in this case would be to ask you to leave the park.

    (By State I mean Washington State)

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    shakul wrote:
    http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Read.aspx?ID=4212

    Attorney General says basically that anything not in State Law does not count. Since ONLY State Law can regulate firearms as is written in... State Law... And since the parks are public property they(county/city) can't regulate firearms on them because they do not have the power to do so. It's like when Seattle city mayor did that anti cc thing basically all they could do was ask you to leave the premises or charge you with trespassing. Since there was no actual LAW against it they couldn't charge you with anything. So all in all the only thing cops can do in this case would be to ask you to leave the park.

    (By State I mean Washington State)
    How the hell can they ask you to leave for not breaking any laws? The government can not trespass you for doing legal things.

  19. #19
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    shakul wrote:
    http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Read.aspx?ID=4212

    Attorney General says basically that anything not in State Law does not count. Since ONLY State Law can regulate firearms as is written in... State Law... And since the parks are public property they(county/city) can't regulate firearms on them because they do not have the power to do so. It's like when Seattle city mayor did that anti cc thing basically all they could do was ask you to leave the premises or charge you with trespassing. Since there was no actual LAW against it they couldn't charge you with anything. So all in all the only thing cops can do in this case would be to ask you to leave the park.

    (By State I mean Washington State)
    SEATTLE DID NOT HAVE A GUN BAN. PERIOD. IT NEVER HAPPENED. IT WAS ONLY PROPOSED.

  20. #20
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    hmmm last thursday (Oct 16) I was asked by two Seattle PD officers to leave the park near Pike Place Market because it was against Seattle Ordnance.
    Events:
    I was drawing people in the park, practicing some of my figure drawing. Which also happend to include this family; I think they were turists since they had the cameras and binoculars and stuff, the husband had a fanny pack so for all I know he could have been ccing ("maybe"). Anyways after about 5 minutes of sitting on the grass, it started to poke through my pants (seattle park grass is spiky i guess lol) anyways I took my jacket off to sit on and by doing so I revealed my holster on the right side and a two mag holder on the left. Not even a minute or two had passed after I took off the jacket I had to SPD guys (one behind me and one infront of me) asking to show some ID and a permit. I showed him my ID (which had expired) along w. my passport and CPL (so for all intents and purposes I had a governemnt issue ID and nothing was wrong w. that) The cops told me suggested (this sound more like an order though) that I should get my ID revalidated; However becasue of a new ordnance I had to leave the park becasue fire arms were not allowed. Instead of arguing I just put my jacket back on picke dup my bag and left...

    And if the ordnance is not even in effect then the cops were out of line...

  21. #21
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    shakul wrote:
    hmmm last thursday (Oct 16) I was asked by two Seattle PD officers to leave the park near Pike Place Market because it was against Seattle Ordnance.
    Events:
    I was drawing people in the park, practicing some of my figure drawing. Which also happend to include this family; I think they were turists since they had the cameras and binoculars and stuff, the husband had a fanny pack so for all I know he could have been ccing ("maybe"). Anyways after about 5 minutes of sitting on the grass, it started to poke through my pants (seattle park grass is spiky i guess lol) anyways I took my jacket off to sit on and by doing so I revealed my holster on the right side and a two mag holder on the left. Not even a minute or two had passed after I took off the jacket I had to SPD guys (one behind me and one infront of me) asking to show some ID and a permit. I showed him my ID (which had expired) along w. my passport and CPL (so for all intents and purposes I had a governemnt issue ID and nothing was wrong w. that) The cops told me suggested (this sound more like an order though) that I should get my ID revalidated; However becasue of a new ordnance I had to leave the park becasue fire arms were not allowed. Instead of arguing I just put my jacket back on picke dup my bag and left...

    And if the ordnance is not even in effect then the cops were out of line...
    They were way out of line and breaking state law. Did you get their names? You may be able to find out who they were through other means. This is cause for a complaint at the very least.

  22. #22
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    I would have written their info down and stuff but I had read an article a while back in the NRA ILA talking about this so i thought they were giving me a break. I was kinda freaked to tell you the truth.

  23. #23
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    The NRA was talking about the PROPOSED ban. The cops lied.

  24. #24
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    Well thanks for the info... I didn't know...

  25. #25
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    So here's a question: How do you deal with the cops in that situation? Do you refuse to leave? Leave and file a complaint later? Something else?

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