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UW-Whitewater student arrested on gun charges

M

Mike

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Shotgun wrote:
This might be interesting in light of my exchange in August with the Jefferson County DA who is supportive of charging disorderly conduct for open carry. I asked him how he would successfully prosecute people for concealed carry if open carry is not left as the [per Wis. Supreme Court] required practical manner of exercising their right to bear arms. The case could be interesting additionally insofar as the police state they believe the individual carried his firearm for the purpose of security--- hmmm... that sound like a word that appears in our state constitution.



WHITEWATER – University Police arrested Stephen D. Schuerr, 39, of Burlington on Tuesday morning on charges of carrying a concealed weapon and possessing a firearm in a state building.
The arrest took place on the University of Wisconsin-Whitewater campus without incident just after 8 a.m.
Schuerr is a student at UW-Whitewater and came to the attention of University Police after they received information that Schuerr had been carrying a weapon in a backpack that he also brought to campus. The University Police followed up on the information and were able to detain Schuerr before he went to class on Tuesday morning.
UW-Whitewater Police Chief Matt Kiederlen said Schuerr was carrying a loaded 45-caliber pistol. Schuerr made no threats to anyone or any institution, Kiederlen said. It is not believed that Schuerr intended to harm anyone and was carrying the weapon for his own personal protection.
“Thanks to the initial information provided by the community and the city of Whitewater Police Department contact, our officers, specifically Officer Mike Sacco and Officer Nicolas Thompson, were able to conduct a detailed investigation which led to the arrest of an individual possessing a firearm on campus,” Kiederlen said. “While we have no evidence to believe his intentions were anything other than personal protection, we are glad to remove a weapon which was inappropriately being carried on our campus. This incident is an example of how community involvement and interdepartmental cooperation can protect our citizens. My thanks go out to those who were willing to become involved.”
Kiederlen said his office is in contact with the Jefferson County District Attorney’s Office concerning filing charges against Schuerr.
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This guy's only hope is if the police did not have probable cause to search his backpack.
 
D

Doug Huffman

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Mike wrote:
Oops, now I think I might have miss-spoke - I thought for sure we had WI coded for OC allowed on campus - maybe it is the buiolding ban that caused us to code WI red.

Is OC in all state buildings banned in WI?
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941.235 Carrying firearm in public building.

941.235(1)
(1) Any person who goes armed with a firearm in any building owned or leased by the state or any political subdivision of the state is guilty of a Class A misdemeanor.
 
pkbites

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Shotgun wrote:
I personally know a number of die-hard liberals that are supportive of gun rights. Public examples in Wisconsin are Sen. Feingold
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Huh? Feingolds support of gun rights is luke warm at best.

Some of the pro-gun legislation he voted for and the ant-gun legislation he voted against had more to do with other provisions that were tacked onto it.

While he has taken some pro-gun stances, overall I would not put him on our side!!
 
S

smithman

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Mike wrote:

This guy's only hope is if the police did not have probable cause to search his backpack.
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This is true. We don't know if he consented to a search, or if the officers had probable cause, or a warrant, or just searched illegally.
 
L

Lou Sir

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Thanks for all the support. The reason they came to my class was that my ex employer, after firing me, decided to call the local police. I refused to give permission for the search but there was pretty good probable cause, I guess.
 
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Lou Sir

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The pistol was "invisible" on campus. Noone knew I had it. I took my backpack to work to do homework. A coworker saw it and told his brother, who worked there. Literally minutes later the whole plant knew. My supervisor came to me and escorted me to my car to put the backpack away. He never saw the gun. He, or someone at Generac, called the Whitewater police and they called university police.
 
C

Citizen

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Lou Sir wrote:
The pistol was "invisible" on campus. Noone knew I had it. I took my backpack to work to do homework. A coworker saw it and told his brother, who worked there. Literally minutes later the whole plant knew. My supervisor came to me and escorted me to my car to put the backpack away. He never saw the gun. He, or someone at Generac, called the Whitewater police and they called university police.
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Sounds kind of round-about. With some opportunities for you to have left the gun at home/not taken it to school. I'm not a lawyer, but I'd think the "probability" part of probable cause might be lacking.

I'd get a good criminal defense lawyer and find out if probable cause to search your back-pack without a warrant was lacking.

If it was, I'm thinking a court could/should/might throw out the evidence, which might take the rest of the case with it.

In Florida vs JL the Supreme Court spoke directly on the subject of a tip thata citizen was illegally carrying aconcealed handgun:

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/historics/USSC_CR_0529_0266_ZO.html
 
S

smithman

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..."and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched and the persons or things to be seized."

So basically it appears the tip to the police regarding the firearm was more hearsay as opposed to an oath or affirmation. I think the level of probable cause depends on who called the police and what they can testify to seeing or hearing. Good going though on refusing to search.

I suppose the legal way to carry a gun on campus is in a backpack, unloaded, in a carrying case. Pack a loaded magazine in your pocket and technically it is legal. It would only take an extra second or two after uncasing to throw in the mag and rack the slide.
 
C

Citizen

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smithman wrote:
SNIP ..."and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched and the persons or things to be seized."
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Oh, hey!

That reminds me of something I came across the other day.

Very cool info on unreasonable searches and seizures, and warrants.

Let me go find it on the web again.
 
C

Citizen

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Found it.

Its from the lecture notes oflaw professor and jurist St. George Tucker. Its what he, being alive at the Framing, thought about the 4th Amendment. Take very careful note of what he concludes about unreasonable searches and seizures:


[align=left]13. The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers & effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated –-- What shall be deemed unreasonable searches and seizures. The same article informs us, by declaring, “that no warrant shall issue, but first, upon probable cause –[/align]
Citation: David T. Hardy. 2008. "The Lecture Notes of St. George Tucker; A Framing Period View of the Bill of Rights" ExpressO
Available at: http://works.bepress.com/david_hardy/3

Its a .pdf you have to download, but its well worthit. The entire document is full ofvery interesting information.

Also, I recommend adding hisblog to your favorites. I regularly check it:

http://www.armsandthelaw.com
 
D

Doug Huffman

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Lou Sir wrote:
Thanks for all the support. The reason they came to my class was that my ex employer, after firing me, decided to call the local police. I refused to give permission for the search but there was pretty good probable cause, I guess.
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Welcome, Sir Lou, to OCDO and the Wisconsin sub-forum.

Please be careful because this is a public forum and some are here for their narrow personal benefit (profit). Not anyone that has contributed to this thread yet! Citizen is one of the best and Mr. Smith. Lammie's research is first rate. Becareful.

Believe nothing you read or hear without verifying it yourself unless it fits your pre-existing world view.
 
Shotgun

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smithman wrote:
I suppose the legal way to carry a gun on campus is in a backpack, unloaded, in a carrying case. Pack a loaded magazine in your pocket and technically it is legal. It would only take an extra second or two after uncasing to throw in the mag and rack the slide.
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One could legally carry on campus in a gun case or openly. Unfortunately, conduct rules would probably prohibit any enrolled student or campus employee from doing either one. Secondly, the only legal way to enter any of the campus buildings (i.e., state owned) with a firearm is to have permission to do so from an appropriate authority (probably the campus police chief), or, to be a cop. It's not much use to have a gun on campus if you are prohibited from entering the buildings.
 
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Lou Sir

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Sure I could have left it in my car or at home. It gets better. I walked up the stairs and saw three cops outside my classroom. It didn't even cross my mind that they were there for me. That's me.I was switching gears between just being called a loser by my wife and wiping the tears away as I drove to school. They never saw me until I walked past them. They were asking my prof some questions and I heard him say "I haven't seen him." I walked right past them and then it hit me. They were there for me. I should have turned around at the top of the stairs and stashed it in my car. It wasa nonissue for me by then. It never crossed my radar. Sad and stupid, but true.
 
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Lou Sir

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Is there a legal arm of this group? I could use a good lawyer, for cheap. I went to the public defenders office and they turned me down, due to the fact that the criteria for getting one "hasn't changed since 1980." I have no job, (school student, recently fired), my house is in forclosure, and I have 16,000 dollars in equity in my house. Nice system, eh?
 
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JoeSparky

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smithman wrote:
Mike wrote:

This guy's only hope is if the police did not have probable cause to search his backpack.
Click to expand...
This is true. We don't know if he consented to a search, or if the officers had probable cause, or a warrant, or just searched illegally.
Click to expand...


My Bad memory... different situation!


JoeSparky
 
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Support The 2nd

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Lou Sir wrote:
Is there a legal arm of this group? I could use a good lawyer, for cheap. I went to the public defenders office and they turned me down, due to the fact that the criteria for getting one "hasn't changed since 1980." I have no job, (school student, recently fired), my house is in forclosure[sic], and I have 16,000 dollars in equity in my house. Nice system, eh?
Click to expand...

First, you took a gun into your place of work and openly admit you new better and could have left it in the car. You bring a firearm into work, MOST employers fire you on the spot as they don't want the liability of what MIGHT happen if you go postal, that's why they have those policies.

Second, you now KNOW people KNOW there is a firearm in your back pack, that;s why you got fired. You leave work upset "wiping tears..." and head to the college. Someone called the police. My bet is it wasn't ANONYMOUS, but someone at your place of work. They say "we don't want another Virginia Tech or Northern Illinois campus shooting.

They will argue that had sufficient cause to detain, and once detained, the gun would have been discovered eventually. Your screwed buddy. In fact, I would suggest it irresponsible people like you, who give the anti's ammunition so to speak. Now they can refer to us as "...just like that guy at White Water..."

Your ignorance, lack of thought, whatever, has hurt the cause more than you can fathom. It's time to stand up, be a man, take responsibility for your actions, and show us all thatthat you know you were wrong.
 
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