Hope is Not Lost !

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The Donkey:

"...there are a significant minority of pro-gun dems who must be considered on substantive gun control measures (like our Boucher).In the Senate,it matters less who is "in charge."But eliminate the pro gun dems in the Senate now and you wouldhave the filibuster proof block of anti-gunners that many on this site fear."

I believe you have a good point here. Not allDemocrats are interested in gun control. The sticker, however, for many on this site and, I confess, for myself to a somewhat lesser degree, is this quote buried in the first page:

DonTreadOnMe wrote:

At the end of the day, I dont trust any Dem to not side with the party over support of the second amendment.

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For a long time party politics has ruled the day. Do we need to get past that? Yes. Will the Democrats who profess to be pro-gun side with their party in a legislative battle...? I don't have an answer at this time...but history is not reassuring on this point.

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I don't know what you guys are worried about. Democrats are going to be non partisan from now on. Even Obama is going to reach accross the aisle. Look, he's appointing :quirky... Never mind.

Besides we don't need to worry as much about the next Congressional race. It will not feature the star power of the Messiah, the ones that wanted to feel like they were a part of something feel justified, the usual voters during these elections are more informed, and the sheeple have eased their warm and fuzzies because they brought change to Washington and that is all that they needed to do.

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I don't know what you guys are worried about. Democrats are going to be non partisan from now on. Even Obama is going to reach accross the aisle. Look, he's appointing :quirky... Never mind.

Besides we don't need to worry as much about the next Congressional race. It will not feature the star power of the Messiah, the ones that wanted to feel like they were a part of something feel justified, the usual voters during these elections are more informed, and the sheeple have eased their warm and fuzzies because they brought change to Washington and that is all that they needed to do.

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It's not the end of the world folks. No matter what happens, life will go on. I don't think this country is ready to hand over all its freedoms just yet. Let's see how things are in 2012 and just deal with this transition as best we can. Like others have stated, be vigilant and keep pushing our cause to our representatives, and everything will be ok. Even if Obama reinstates the assault weapons ban, you can still carry your sidearm CC or OC according the the state in which you live.

It is highly unlikely that the house and senate will be able to push through any significant legislation that will actually effect your main means of self defense with a firearm, which constitutes carrying a semiautomatic handgun. It would be political suicide for any politician to significantly alter the gun culture in this country with over 80 million gun owners who would love to vote them out of office for trying.

The fact of the matter is this: It is what it is. What has happened has happened. There is nothing you can say or do to change the fact the Barack Obama is our future President and Commander N Chief or our armed forces. All we can do is urge our representatives to vote our way on the gun issues. It will either fail, or it will succeed. If it succeeds, then we are joyful. If it fails, then we just deal with it the best we can. There is little else we can do other than this and continue to be peaceful society.

Besides, we all know how this history ends. Armegeddon has to some about somehow. This is the time in history where the shee is going to hit the fan sooner or later. It is only a matter of time. Whether it's 4 years or 8 years or 12 years out in the future, you can bet that it's coming one way or another. It is inevitable.

I personally believe that gun owernship in this country will never be significantly called into question, because my theory on what sets off the world-altering events is the formation of the One-World order and the eventual attack on Isreal that will pull the USA into a mideast conflict after 7 years of peace in the region. All of the other countries in the "world order" will cower and refuse to enter the conflict to protect Isreal. The United States will, once again, stand alone and rush to help Isreal push back it's agressors. It will be the bloodiest and most contested war in all of history and will usher in the end of days as we know it. Well, most of you know the rest of the story after that. Of course, this is all just my opinion and completely open to attack and disagreement from many many people, both pro and anti-gun. Last I checked, I had a right to an opinion too.

Kevin

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Taking care of business at home (read: worry more about your local elections..) is of vital importance. Obama won't be able to do significant damage to our 2nd amendment rights without a House and Senate passed bill that reaches his desk. Please be vigilant and write your Represenatives and Governors, etc. Be involved and informed about your locality and the issues of your state, and that of your country.

If you are not part of any pro-gun organizations, then please join one. Our strength is in numbers and the louder that voice is, the better off we are going to be.

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hlh wrote:

LoveshisXD45: I can tell you know your Bible prophecy!

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Aye, and it is unfortunate how accurate those prophecies are turning out to be. It doesn't give us much to look forward to.

Kevin

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smccomas wrote:

Tess wrote:

smccomas wrote:

+1 I am in Va we do not have anything going on in 2010, I could help out MD or NC.
"Its the Neighborly thing to do"

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But it is NOT too early in Virginia to start identifying those to challenge Webb and Warner in 4-6 years.  These guys are NOT our friends, despite their questionnaire responses.  Webb no sooner got in to office than he said "My party knows I'm not a maverick" (or something very close to that).   He's about the cheesiest "friend" of a gun owner we could have sent.

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So true, need to find a classic conservative or a true liberal. I am of the opinion its time to get some new blood some one who hasn't been in politics. Example a CEO of a company that is one of our clients was working late and he and I got into a discussion that related to election procedures. We were debating and I missed a finer point his response was " I am not sure about that I left my copy of the constitution at home let me look it up on line" needless to say I was incorrect and humbled. I think he would be a good candidate.


The clown that was put into office is not a liberal he is a socialist / communist
(Please read definition  lifted from wikki)

Classical liberalism (also known as traditional liberalism[1][/sup], laissez-faire liberalism[2][/sup], market liberalism[3][/sup] or, in much of the world, simply liberalism) is a doctrine stressing individual freedom and limited government. This includes the importance of human rationality, individual property rights, natural rights, the protection of civil liberties, constitutional limitation of government, free markets, and individual freedom from restraint.

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This is what I always say. American politics originated from classical liberalism, and it is only due to the efforts of the statist Democratic and Republican Parties that "conservatism" has become anti-conservative, non-classically-liberal, "neo-conservatism", and "liberalism" has become pseudo-liberal "progressivism".

Our politics today would be far less divided over issues of big government were it not for this insidious redefinition of terms.

The sad thing is most psuedo-liberals want government out of their lives too, they've just been convinced that the way to achieve that is to elect Democrats who will regulate everybody else's life to that end. Sort of the way conservatives have been convinced that a vote for McCain was a vote to keep government out of the home.

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DonTreadOnMe wrote:

The Donkey wrote:

Republicanism is not synonymous with 'pro gun.'

Wouldn't you rather have a solidly pro gun democrat like Warner, Webb, Casey or Tester than a luke warm independent/republican like Jeffords or Snowe?

Failing to recognize that there are "good" democrats will only serve to alienate them, like the NRA did to Webb during his 2006 senate campaign.

If we treat Democrats like the plague, we cannot expect them to carry our water for us.

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speaking of a plague

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The man actually makes an excellent point, making your post little better than trolling.

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LovesHisXD45 wrote:

Besides, we all know how this history ends. Armegeddon has to some about somehow. This is the time in history where the shee is going to hit the fan sooner or later. It is only a matter of time. Whether it's 4 years or 8 years or 12 years out in the future, you can bet that it's coming one way or another. It is inevitable.

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By this logic, it should have already happened.

Oh, and thanks for making this site look bad. :X

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marshaul wrote:

DonTreadOnMe wrote:

The Donkey wrote:

Republicanism is not synonymous with 'pro gun.'

Wouldn't you rather have a solidly pro gun democrat like Warner, Webb, Casey or Tester than a luke warm independent/republican like Jeffords or Snowe?

Failing to recognize that there are "good" democrats will only serve to alienate them, like the NRA did to Webb during his2006 senate campaign.

If we treat Democrats like the plague, we cannot expect them to carry our water for us.

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speaking of a plague

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The man actually makes an excellent point, making your post little better than trolling.

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He is welcome to his opinion that Obama is best thing since sliced bread and I am welcome to my opinion on Obama apologists.

I make no bones that I have contempt for apologists for gun grabbers/banners.

I am not the one on a gun rights website supporting anti-gun rights candidates and party. If I was posting against Donkey on the daily kos....then I would be the troll. If you don't get the difference, I really don't care.

Have a nice day!

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DonTreadOnMe wrote:

marshaul wrote:

DonTreadOnMe wrote:

The Donkey wrote:

Republicanism is not synonymous with 'pro gun.'

Wouldn't you rather have a solidly pro gun democrat like Warner, Webb, Casey or Tester than a luke warm independent/republican like Jeffords or Snowe?

Failing to recognize that there are "good" democrats will only serve to alienate them, like the NRA did to Webb during his 2006 senate campaign.

If we treat Democrats like the plague, we cannot expect them to carry our water for us.

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speaking of a plague

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The man actually makes an excellent point, making your post little better than trolling.

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He is welcome to his opinion that Obama is best thing since sliced bread and I am welcome to my opinion on Obama apologists.

I make no bones that I have contempt for apologists for gun grabbers/banners.

I am not the one on a gun rights website supporting anti-gun rights candidates and party.  If I was posting against Donkey on the daily kos....then I would be the troll.  If you don't get the difference, I really don't care.

Have a nice day!

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The problem is that you can't get past being "against Donkey". I disagree with Donkey's support for Obama, but the post in question has nothing whatever to do with Obama. And I felt he made a valid point, not in defending Democrats (which I will never agree with), but in his criticism of Republicans (which I did agree with).

It's not about what opinions you have and what site you're posting them on -- this isn't a one-opinion site, it's one-issue; outside that issue, our opinions may differ greatly. It's about whether you take the time to respond to what's written, or post irrelevant and inflammatory remarks simply because you don't like the person. That's why I thought you were perilously close to trolling.

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hlh wrote:

marshaul wrote:

LovesHisXD45 wrote:

Besides, we all know how this history ends. Armegeddon has to some about somehow. This is the time in history where the shee is going to hit the fan sooner or later. It is only a matter of time. Whether it's 4 years or 8 years or 12 years out in the future, you can bet that it's coming one way or another. It is inevitable.

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By this logic, it should have already happened.

Oh, and thanks for making this site look bad. :X

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In your opinion... 

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lol, fair enough. Just remember all gun owners (and thus potential OCers) aren't Christian, nor do all Christians believe an apocalypse is inevitable. Personally, I find the idea rather superstitious, and don't really think it has much place on a one-issue (that issue being OC) site. However, that is of course just my opinion. And we all know what opinions are like.

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As Donkey stated there are some Pro 2nd Amendment Democrats, not many but some. As Loveshis45XD said, and to which theocracy I subscribe, it's already written IF you take time to read. For myself I have watched, listened and have my own point of view. But in truth I will answer the call if it comes. As Charlton Hesston said "Out of my cold dead hands" But if they think I'm gonna go down easy.... Watch my friends, pay attention, maintain situational awareness. Be Prepared. And do not be "sheeple" Just me sayin it.

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marshaul wrote:

DonTreadOnMe wrote:

marshaul wrote:

DonTreadOnMe wrote:

The Donkey wrote:

Republicanism is not synonymous with 'pro gun.'

Wouldn't you rather have a solidly pro gun democrat like Warner, Webb, Casey or Tester than a luke warm independent/republican like Jeffords or Snowe?

Failing to recognize that there are "good" democrats will only serve to alienate them, like the NRA did to Webb during his2006 senate campaign.

If we treat Democrats like the plague, we cannot expect them to carry our water for us.

Click to expand...

speaking of a plague

Click to expand...

The man actually makes an excellent point, making your post little better than trolling.

Click to expand...

He is welcome to his opinion that Obama is best thing since sliced bread and I am welcome to my opinion on Obama apologists.

I make no bones that I have contempt for apologists for gun grabbers/banners.

I am not the one on a gun rights website supporting anti-gun rights candidates and party. If I was posting against Donkey on the daily kos....then I would be the troll. If you don't get the difference, I really don't care.

Have a nice day!

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The problem is that you can't get past being "against Donkey". I disagree with Donkey's support for Obama, but the post in question has nothing whatever to do with Obama. And I felt he made a valid point, not in defending Democrats (which I will never agree with), but in his criticism of Republicans (which I did agree with).

It's not about what opinions you have and what site you're posting them on -- this isn't a one-opinion site, it's one-issue; outside that issue, our opinions may differ greatly. It's about whether you take the time to respond to what's written, or post irrelevant and inflammatory remarks simply because you don't like the person. That's why I thought you were perilously close to trolling.

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Can't get passed being against Donkey? Please!

If he would post something other than apologistic crap for Dems I would respond differntly or leave it be. When I 'have a go' at him in a thread that has nothing to do with him supporting anti-gun rights candidates then perhaps you would have a point. As it is, your simply jumping to the defence of someone that is activly arguing for people that wish to take away our rights. So you will excuse me if I am unmoved.

Your right this is not a one opinion site, he has his and I have mine. Mine encludeds contempt for anti-gun rights apologits. If you think that I will not respond or express my dim views of anti-gun rights people or arguments your mistaken.


Cheers

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LovesHisXD45 wrote:

...Even if Obama reinstates the assault weapons ban, you can still carry your sidearm CC or OC...

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Wrong logic. You either believe/support the Second Amendment or you don't. Banning semi-autos, standard capacity mags, and other featuresshould not be tolerated. Never.

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I was just thinkin' (and it hurt, might not do it again for a while). But wouldn't an AWB be challenged immediately under various sections of the Heller decision? Its banning an entire class of weapons, 2nd Ammendment was found to refer specifically to military type weapons, etc.

They'll probably still try to pass it anyway and dare us to challenge it.

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Daddyo wrote:

They'll probably still pass it anyway and dare us to challenge it.

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Fixed.

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Daddyo wrote:

I was just thinkin' (and it hurt, might not do it again for a while). But wouldn't an AWB be challenged immediately under various sections of the Heller decision? Its banning an entire class of weapons, 2nd Ammendment was found to refer specifically to military type weapons, etc.

They'll probably still try to pass it anyway and dare us to challenge it.

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Challenge all you want, if it goes before the current Supreme Court we might get a win, wait until Obama appoints even a single justice and it could be completely different. Remember, Heller was 5-4. Trusting the Supreme Court to strike down a gun control law as unconstitutional is a dangerous strategy. Just look at some of the decisions they've made in the last few years concerning eminent domain and freedom of speech during a political campaign.

It was believed that the Supreme Court would strike down the unconstitutional parts of the Campaign Finance Reform Act (Incumbent Protection Act), even W. was surprised that they didn't fix the law that he knew was unconstitutional when he signed it.

We simply CAN NOTtrust the courts to side with us on gun control, especially once the new justices start getting appointed. Better to just prevent the law from ever passing in the first place.

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Gordie wrote:

Challenge all you want, if it goes before the current Supreme Court we might get a win, wait until Obama appoints even a single justice and it could be completely different. Remember, Heller was 5-4.

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I agree with the rest of your post, but remember: any justices Obama gets a chance to replace will probably come from the 4, not the 5.

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MetalChris wrote:

Daddyo wrote:

They'll probably still pass it anyway and dare us to challenge it.

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Fixed. 

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Thanks. (See, I told you it hurts when I think).