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Thread: Self not defense

  1. #1
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    What is with standing around to be shot?
    A single shot .22 rifle, gee he just shot my friend, i'll wait for reloading to find
    out if it was an accident. I'm shure there would be no where you could
    place the kid that you couldn't stop him after first shot. So how do you get two
    bodies? This story makes no sense unless they were both sheep, and were
    busy dialing 911 insted of protecting themselves.

    Or do we finaly have a second magic bullet here?


  2. #2
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    uhh whiskey tango fox-trot???

    link please

  3. #3
    Lone Star Veteran Gator5713's Avatar
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    r6-rider wrote:
    uhh whiskey tango fox-trot???

    link please
    Ditto!

  4. #4
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    http://www.startribune.com/nation/34...:DW3ckUiacyKUU

    end of last week I heard it was a single shot 22. No mag / no tube. So he would
    have to hand load it.

  5. #5
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    "I'm not accusing anybody of anything at this point," he said Saturday. "But we're certainly going to look at the abuse part of this. He's 8 years old. He just doesn't decide one day that he's going to shoot his father and shoot his father's friend for no reason. Something led up to this."

    that was my first guess as well

  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    "Prosecutors said the boy was systematic and precise in killing his father and their lodger. He reloaded the .22-caliber rifle after each shot and fired at least 8 shots. Investigators suspected the boy may have suffered some form of abuse from his father but so far, they could turn up nothing to suggest a motive for the murders."

    Wow ... :shock:

    http://celebgalz.com/vincent-romero-...killed-by-boy/

    And now there is a gag order:
    http://www.kpho.com/news/17946277/de...o&psp=news


    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

  7. #7
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    video just came out of the interrogation the boy never admitted he did it in the video like the little tyrants said he did.

    to serve and protect

  8. #8
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    mrbiggles wrote:
    video just came out of the interrogation the boy never admitted he did it in the video like the little tyrants said he did.

    to serve and protect
    link?

    Edit:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OuZ0AkqSILM

    OK, WTF is going on here. The kid didn't confess, he said he came home and found them that way. :shock:

  9. #9
    Regular Member VAopencarry's Avatar
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    He confessed after several hours of interrogation, without an adult or a lawyer. It was pretty sad the way they kept hammering him, eventually, I think the kid told them what they wanted to hear.Maybe it was after the part when they told him someone 'might' have seen him do it. Saw it on CNN.

    BTW, WTF? you are in Californie now?!
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson

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    From what I've seen (clips on the evening news), the "interviewers" were very good at their jobs.

    Their job is not to get the truth. Their job is not to find the killer. Their job is to get a confession, and they were very good at their job.

    Not that an 8 year old is much of a challenge. Ignore his pleas of innocence and tell him that everyone in that room promises to tell the truth, then LIE to him to get his confession. I heard the portion where they told him something like "what if we told you someone saw you do it?" Confuse his young mind, already in shock from finding his father dead. Get the confession. He MUST be guilty, or he wouldn't be in your interrog-er, I mean "interview" room, now would he?

    Everything's easier with a confession. That way the police don't have to do their jobs and investigate any more. That way the prosecutor doesn't have to prove anything beyond a reasonable doubt.

    Sorry, but I saw this on the news last night and it instantly pissed me off that the interrogators questioned that boy for hours, told him everyone needed to tell the truth, then when they didn't get their confession, they started lying to him...

    ...Orygunner...



  11. #11
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    Man....We do NOT know what happened........YET.

  12. #12
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    Nope, we sure don't know what happened, but this BS confession they obtained, and the subsequent "Case is solved!" announcement undermines the investigation and brings a lot of doubt into my mind that justice is really going to be served.

    Since they have their confession, do you really think they're going to investigate anything other than evidence to prosecute the boy?

    I wish I could find the tape I saw on the news last night. It specifically shows the police asking him if they can all tell the truth, then they later lie to the boy, telling him "what if we told you someone SAW you do it?" and the boy's story started changing after that, with "I thinks" and "maybes"...

    If the boy is innocent or guilty? The evidence will tell. Are the police still investigating any other suspects? Probably not, they have their confession! At least I can't find any news articles stating they're still looking for other suspects.

    ...One suspect is probably all they need...
    ...Orygunner...

  13. #13
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    I guess they've run out of adults, who now know to keep their mouths shut when talkign to the plice. The JBTs have to go after kids to make their jobs easier...

    And frankly, if he did do it, I bet he's got a damn justifiable reason. Maybe not in the eyes of the law, but we see how the law behaves, and I don't grant it much merit in right or wrong anymore.

    Either way, nice shots kid! Too bad he didn't shoot the cops!
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    I still don't know what really happened, but my gut has this terrible feeling that they want to make this kid, guilty or innocent, into a scape goat. Hold him up as an example of how terrible it is for a father to teach a young boy to shoot and how just having these evil guns in that child's hands turned him into a killer.

    If they were able to spin Obama into a viable presidential candidate, they can spin this thing into the mother of all anti gun poster children. :what:

    I so hope I am wrong.

  15. #15
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    The timing is pretty convenient for doing exactly that with it...
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    I can see the argument now. . .

    "We understand the boy may have been sexually abused by his father and his friend, but that is no reason to grab a gun, and this 8 year-old boy should have known it. Yes, sexually abusing a child is wrong, but see what happens when there are guns involved? Now an otherwise innocent boy is going to go on trial for murder, just because his father taught him how to shoot a gun."

    Don't pay attention to the fact that THEY MAY HAVE ABUSED THE BOY! How about you catch the abusers and send them to where they need to be instead of picking on an 8 yo boy? Remarkable.

    And no, we don't know what is going on, but can anyone tell me 1 good reason OTHER than to pressure him to confess why he was not given a lawyer before questioning? Someone to serve the best interest of the child?

  17. #17
    Regular Member LovesHisXD45's Avatar
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    The cops aren't going to win this one without forensic evidence directly linking the boy to the shooting. Did they test under his fingernails for GSW? Did they check the brass or the gun for finger prints? If they did, were his prints on the gun but not the brass? Does an 8-year-old have the intellect to wipe the prints from each round or wear gloves during the shooting?

    The mere fact that this boy was not provided legal representation during his interrogation is a travisty that will not go unnoticed in a court of law. Any attempt to prosecute this boy, considering the circumstances based on a coerced confession and lack of forensic evidence, will be futile at best.

    The proverbial S*%$ is going to hit the fan on this one if they prosecute. I, personally, would like to see those ******** try this publicity stunt. Not only should the charges be thrown out, but there should be a counter suit against the department for their conduct.

    Those pathetic bastards!!!!!

    Kevin


    If it isn't broke, then don't fix it, or you'll fix it until it's broke.

  18. #18
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Let them have enough rope to hang themselves.

    Too bad it's only figurative... And that with the courts so often in the clutches of the Political Left, it isn't far fetched that a conviction is already written, just waiting for the song and dance to create the illusion of a 'system.'
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

  19. #19
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    "We understand the boy may have been sexually abused by his father and his friend, but that is no reason to grab a gun, and this 8 year-old boy should have known it. Yes, sexually abusing a child is wrong, but see what happens when there are guns involved? Now an otherwise innocent boy is going to go on trial for murder, just because his father taught him how to shoot a gun."
    Actually, it probably is a reason. I have no sympathy at all for child abuse and especially if it is sexual abuse. Obviously, nobody knows the actual circumstances yet but if it turns out that the boy was sexually abused as far as I'm concerned it is a justified shoot. State law actually allows deadly force to stop a rape or child mollestation in progress assuming such force is necessary to stop the rapist/mollester. Our society has gotten way too tolerant of this crap. A dad or mom who would sexually abuse an eight-year-old child at the very least should have their kids taken away from them and locked up for a very long time and at best be returned to their maker. In most cases I am someone who believes you do whatever is necessary to stop a threat but without going overboard. However, when it comes to rape, mollestation, and torture especially when it involves helpless victims such as children and the elderly, itshould involve executing the perpetrator. If it does come to light that the father and roomate were sexually abusing the kid, good riddance to them and let it be a message to the rest of the deadbeatparents out there that sooner or later it will come back to them.



  20. #20
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    I'm not sure I like the idea of allowing the state to execute anybody. Hypothetically, I think allowing the kid to legally claim self-defense is a better solution. Individuals are less likely to abuse this "power" than the government is to abuse its very real power of execution.

  21. #21
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    I watched the raw video of the police interview, and it was obvious to any parent that the "confession" was false. During the first 12 minute segment, he was matter-of-fact while reciting what he had done after getting off the bus, and the process of coming home and finding the bodies. Sometimes he paused to think, but he never went out of his way to convince anyone that he was telling the truth. He just said what he said and left it.

    As any parent of kids that age can tell you, the bigger the lie, the harder they try to sell it.

    And when the video resumed after a long period, "selling it" is what he was doing. The "confession" was exaggerated and fantastical, as if he was trying to convince the police that he really did do it.

    My (least) favorite part in the beginning, when the officer was admonishing him that he had to tell the truth: "We're not allowed to lie to you." Ummm, you just did, lady!



  22. #22
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Typical 'intervieing' techniques, straight out of the academy manual.

    Filth, they are.
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

  23. #23
    Regular Member MetalChris's Avatar
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    ixtow wrote:
    Typical 'intervieing' techniques, straight out of the academy manual.

    Filth, they are.
    Abso-frackin-lutely.

  24. #24
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    +1 to that.

  25. #25
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    Plea deal offered to 8-year-old murder suspect

    PHOENIX – Prosecutors have offered a plea deal to an 8-year-old boy charged with murder in the shooting deaths of his father and another man in their eastern Arizona home, court records show.

    Complete details of the offer weren't spelled out in a court filing posted Saturday on the Apache County Superior Court's Web site.

    But County Attorney Criss Candelaria wrote that he has "tendered a plea offer to the juvenile's attorneys that would resolve all the charges in the juvenile court contingent on the results of the mental health evaluations."

    Candelaria was responding to a defense motion seeking to block him from dropping one of two first-degree murder charges the boy faces in the deaths of his father, Vincent Romero, 29, and Timothy Romans, 39, earlier this month.

    Defense attorney Benjamin Brewer argued in a filing Tuesday that prosecutors wanted the charge dismissed so they could refile it when the boy was older and pursue case in adult court.

    Brewer said Saturday that the deal would resolve the case without it being transferred to adult court, but he declined to provide additional details. Although he is considering the offer, Brewer said he is unsure of his client's ability to understand the proceedings. At least two mental health evaluations are yet to be completed.

    The prosecutor explained in his response to Brewer's opposition filing that he wasn't trying to obtain an unfair advantage, but he pressed for the dismissal because the judicial system isn't equipped to deal with an 8-year-old charged with murder.
    "It is done to ensure that the juvenile and the two murder victims in this case do not fall through the cracks in the system that might occur if both charges remain in the pending delinquency petition," Candelaria wrote.

    Candelaria explained that the boy could be found incompetent to stand trial, and if that happened, the court's options would be limited.

    The court would be required to order efforts to restore the boy to competency, but if that couldn't be done within about eight months, the judge would be required by law to dismiss the criminal case and bar it from being refiled.

    The court would then be required to initiate civil commitment proceedings, Candelaria wrote. If the boy is found incompetent because of his age, he wouldn't fit the definition of a mentally disordered person and no treatment would be available.

    "Such a result denies the victims and public of any sense of justice for these heinous murders," Candelaria wrote. "It also denies the juvenile the rehabilitative services that he apparently needs to both deal with why he was capable of committing these murders and to assist him with the grief and remorse that he is probably feeling."
    Police in St. Johns found Romero and Romans shot to death after the boy ran to a neighbor's house on Nov. 5. The boy was questioned after Romans' wife raised suspicions about him the next day, and in a videotape released by prosecutors, he admits pulling the trigger. Both men were shot several times with a .22-caliber rifle.
    Romans worked with Romero and rented a room in his home.

    Police reports say the boy told a state Child Protective Services worker that his 1,000th spanking would be his last.

    The boy is being held in a county juvenile facility, although he was allowed to spend Thanksgiving with his mother.

    Brewer said the boy is back in custody. The next court hearing is set for Dec. 8.

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