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Thread: Open Carry at "Join the Impact" Rally and March on 11/15/08

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    As everyone well knows, I generally open carry at GLBT related events, such as Pride.

    The recent passage of Proposition 8 in California by a 4 percent margin sparked nationwide protest rallies and marches last saturday. I was one of 6000 marchers against Proposition 8 here in Seattle area, and I attended both the beginning and end rallies at Volunteer and Westlake Parks respectively.

    Not surprising, though, I was open carrying the entire time. The last time I went to Volunteer Park in Pride 2007, I was hassled and harassed by ignorant Seattle PD who threatened to arrest me, stranding my partner who had to go to work later that day (he doesn't have a drivers license) if I didn't leave due to their preempted park ordinance. I left because I couldn't afford to strand him.

    Not so this time around....

    I arrived at Volunteer Park around 12:20. I was mostly hanging out near the back because there was around 5000 people at Volunteer Park. It also had lots of speakers. I was speaking with a few people at a table (who finally noticed I had my pistol on my right hip after a few minutes of talking to them). Very interesting to say the least.

    That being said, while talking with them, I happened to notice Mayor Greg Nickels walking by me! :what:

    What's surprising is the way he walked by me, he didn't notice my pistol at all (walking by my left side). I will say this: For a bunch of general people on the "left side" of the political equations, when I pointed out that Nickels walked by, they were not too happy. They think he's a opportunist, and I will quote "He's a giant ********* who will say anything to get elected, whether it be saying that he's for gay marriage or anything else". Too true.

    There was a significant police presence there both at the rallies and during the march between Volunteer Park and Westlake Park. I marched in the parade as an individual, I was open carrying with my brothers and sisters in the battle, educated a CRAP load of people on open carry and gun carry in general, and got the "Pink Panthers" label from a few people (variant of the Black Panthers). I stated "Nah, more like the Deacons of Defense and Justice". Funnily enough, most of the people got the reference (they were pretty historically educated people on that subject).

    Not ONE police contact. I had the training bulletins ready to hit them with, but they didn't stop me.

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    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    I support your right to get gay married...


    Evangelical lessons are provided upon request. Anyone wishing to meet Jesus can just kick in my door.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    TechnoWeenie wrote:
    I support your right to get gay married...

    Hey, we have the right to be as MISERABLE.

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    Good story, though I confess I'm not sure of the point of a Seattle rally against a CA state matter...

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    kparker wrote:
    Good story, though I confess I'm not sure of the point of a Seattle rally against a CA state matter...
    People did the same thing during the civil rights movement. I feel like the general public is going to look back at all these bans and feel the same way they do today about how they treated African Americans years ago.

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    Funny you should mention Join The Impact as the web hosting company I help run, hostdango.com, has work done for us by Amy so we offered to host jointheimpact.com for her.
    "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."

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    I was actually on the opposite side of the fence OC'ing at the City Hall in Olympia. I had more responses for being pro prop-8 then OC'ing.



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    Could it be people are getting less and less weirded out over OC?

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    sv_libertarian wrote:
    Could it be people are getting less and less weirded out over OC?
    That could be part of it. The other part of it could still be people's own complacency or their own ignorance. I think we shall never know either way for sure.

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    Or they never noticed at all
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

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    Jeeze man, you gotta start lettin' me know when you're up to this stuff... I'm more then happy to come stand by ya, or at least shoot some video, if I've got the time! I'll even OC too.

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    Too bad Nickels didn't spot your sidearm.



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    So was the mayor speaking out against Prop-8? Also, people may not have cared that you were OC'ing because they thought you were undercover cops. After the rioting in San Fran, oyu can imagine there were probably a few in the crowd...

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    Regular Member gsx1138's Avatar
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    I would really hope that activist groups would stop jumping on bandwagons and support the 2A. I never understood wanting to stand up for your rights while at the same time denying others theirs. As far as gay marriage, have at it. Why should I give a sh!t. I will tell you, more homosexuals get armed and less will get beaten. Kill a few ignorant ******** and watch the assault rate drop.

    Anyway, good to see you are standing up for everyone's rights. Not just those that are convenient.
    "Think lightly of yourself and deeply of the world." ~ Musashi

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    gsx1138 wrote:
    I would really hope that activist groups would stop jumping on bandwagons and support the 2A. I never understood wanting to stand up for your rights while at the same time denying others theirs. As far as gay marriage, have at it. Why should I give a sh!t. I will tell you, more homosexuals get armed and less will get beaten. Kill a few ignorant @#$%s and watch the assault rate drop.

    Anyway, good to see you are standing up for everyone's rights. Not just those that are convenient.
    Well, I'm actually standing up for my own rights. I was actually planning on getting hitched in California until this whole Prop 8 bother occured.

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    Why would people who favor gay rights, protest in WASHINGTON about a proposition that was passed in the State of CALIFORNIA by voters?

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    Regular Member gsx1138's Avatar
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    44Brent wrote:
    Why would people who favor gay rights, protest in WASHINGTON about a proposition that was passed in the State of CALIFORNIA by voters?
    For the same reason we should've been protesting the handgun ban in D.C. When rights are limited or taken away in one area it's only a matter of time before they work their way to where you live.
    "Think lightly of yourself and deeply of the world." ~ Musashi

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    gsx1138 wrote:
    When rights are limited or taken away in one area it's only a matter of time before they work their way to where you live.
    Of course you are assuming that this is a matter of rights. At the risk of taking this thread off OC topic, the argument here is not about equal rights but rather about a redefinition of the word marriage. Gays currently have the same rights (which I fully support) as everyone else in every area. The fact that there are neanderthals who choose to beat up or kill someone based on their choice of partners is both outrageous and illegal. When it comes to marriage, however, gays have the same right as heterosexuals, to marry someone of the opposite sex. Everyone is equally restricted under the definition of a marriage. What the GLTB lobby wants to do here is change the definition.

    Whereas the Second Amendment is a right guaranteed by the Constitution.

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    44Brent wrote:
    Why would people who favor gay rights, protest in WASHINGTON about a proposition that was passed in the State of CALIFORNIA by voters?
    People like protesting.

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    vote_no wrote:
    44Brent wrote:
    Why would people who favor gay rights, protest in WASHINGTON about a proposition that was passed in the State of CALIFORNIA by voters?
    People like protesting.
    I think there is more to it than that,gay marriagein California was a big thing for alot of people and to have prop 8 pass and turn that around has made alot of people angry.

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    Regular Member gsx1138's Avatar
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    heresolong wrote:
    gsx1138 wrote:
    When rights are limited or taken away in one area it's only a matter of time before they work their way to where you live.
    Of course you are assuming that this is a matter of rights. At the risk of taking this thread off OC topic, the argument here is not about equal rights but rather about a redefinition of the word marriage. Gays currently have the same rights (which I fully support) as everyone else in every area. The fact that there are neanderthals who choose to beat up or kill someone based on their choice of partners is both outrageous and illegal. When it comes to marriage, however, gays have the same right as heterosexuals, to marry someone of the opposite sex. Everyone is equally restricted under the definition of a marriage. What the GLTB lobby wants to do here is change the definition.

    Whereas the Second Amendment is a right guaranteed by the Constitution.
    Well, I see it as an issue of equality. Heterosexual couple's are afforded more rights and priviledges when married. We may all be equal in that we have to marry someone of the opposite sex but the desire to do so is different for gays. You're telling them, be like us and we won't have a problem. Separate but equal doesn't work.

    My personal opinion, government should get out of the marriage business altogether. It is a religious practice and should not be legislated in any way. Everyone should have to get a civil union if they want tax breaks and insurance rights. Take everyone with a current marriage license and roll it into a civil union. After that, all business partnerships (what marriage is all about these days) must be done through a civil union contract. You want to get married without a civil union? Fine, just don't expect the same rights and priviledges as those with one. For those that don't support gay marriage you can do two things now. 1. Don't become gay. 2. Go to a church that doesn't practice gay marriages.
    "Think lightly of yourself and deeply of the world." ~ Musashi

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    heresolong wrot
    Of course you are assuming that this is a matter of rights. At the risk of taking this thread off OC topic, the argument here is not about equal rights but rather about a redefinition of the word marriage. Gays currently have the same rights (which I fully support) as everyone else in every area.
    This is demonstratably false.

    GAO Report on the Effects of the Federal DOMA law

    My domestic partnership here in Washington is not recognized universally across this country. Essentially, in order to fully protect my partner's interest in next of kin, and hospital visitation, and other issues, we have to draw up paperwork, which means complying with the probate, proxy laws, and such for FOURTY NINE other states. Meaning, that in order to have the proper paperwork compatible with all states, I would need to consult attorneys in all states that I can or ever possibly travel in, at the cost of untold amounts of money, and if there's a sudden change of law in one state, and I happen to be traveling in it, and I get injured, incapacitated, or anything else, the hospital will not even talk to Bill (my partner's name) without calling my parents. Bill's parents I can trust to honor my role in his life, but I don't trust mine to do the right thing, or honor my wishes.

    Whereas for $50 or so dollars, most of you can get married in a courthouse, in a church, or other holy place, by a priest, justice of the peace (a state job), or hell, in a drive through wedding chapel by "Elvis" in Las Vegas (sanctity of marriage my ass), have it universally recognized throughout the entire country, with NO QUESTIONING AT ALL. I can only think of one situation where the role of spouse as next of kin has been vigorously challenged, and that was in the Terry Schindler-Shiavo case. Just one. I can give dozens of stories of real people in my particular situation who had their parents dishonor their wishes after death, ban their partners from their funerals, boot them from the house that they both own, etc. The inhumanity of how our relationships have been treated in our day to day lives should give any person, who talks anything about freedom and liberty in our day, a bit of pause.

    Freedom and liberty isn't just limited to what's specifically stated in the US constitution. This is why we have equal protection, and this is why we have the 9th amendment. This has nothing to do with "redefining marriage". It has everything to do with majoritorian tyrranny.

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    Regular Member Cremator75's Avatar
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    bigazn13 wrote:
    I think there is more to it than that,gay marriagein California was a big thing for a lot of people and to have prop 8 pass and turn that around has made a lot of people angry.
    I don't care what people do in their own life's, but the vote passed. Majority rules, until the minority complains. Now days with all the PC crap we have to piss of the majority of people to please the minority of people. Leave it until the next voting cycle like we have to do with the president. Deal with it and get more people on your side next time, no matter what the vote is for, ie. person or proposition.

    Just my 2ยข


    Edited for grammar

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Obviously Prop 8 is much debated and it was even much debated among people we know in FL a few weeks ago when I was there getting married. My uncle who is not gay and lives in CA was a strong NO vote on Prop 8. His best friend who also lives in CA and is openly gay, was a strong YES voter on Prop 8.

    I think the important issue here for OCDO is that Lonnie and VoiceinShelton were on opposite sides of the issue, both joined in the protests regarding Prop 8, and both legally and peacefully asserted and exercised their 2A right to OC while partaking in their peaceful respective protests.

    While we can disagree on the more vague constitutional matters, we do all agree on the clearly enumerated constitutional protections such as the uninfringed right to keep and bear arms.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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