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Thread: Russian Analyst Predicts Breakup of USA

  1. #1
    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Not necessarilyOC related but the articleis pertinent to healthy discussion of potential civil unrest scenariosand brewingfactions of resistance due to tremendouseconomic turmoil.

    Sounds outlandish, but what is your opinion?

    My opinion is that thisis a typical foreign observation from a political analyst of an unfriendly country and he fails to understand thecontinuity and patriotism of our people and that something like his theorywould only occur as an absolutely last resort after all other efforts to reapir our country have failed.

    I also LOL at the concept of Russia "claiming" Alaska as they ceded it to us per a purchase treaty for 7.2 million dollars in 1867. It was not leased...

    http://www.bartleby.com/43/43.html



    http://www.drudgereport.com/flashrur.htm

    RUSSIAN ANALYST PREDICTS DECLINE AND BREAKUP OF USA
    Tue Nov 25 2008 09:04:22 ET

    A leading Russian political analyst has said the economic turmoil in the United States has confirmed his long-held view that the country is heading for collapse, and will divide into separate parts.

    Professor Igor Panarin said in an interview with the respected daily IZVESTIA published on Monday: "The dollar is not secured by anything. The country's foreign debt has grown like an avalanche, even though in the early 1980s there was no debt. By 1998, when I first made my prediction, it had exceeded $2 trillion. Now it is more than 11 trillion. This is a pyramid that can only collapse."

    The paper said Panarin's dire predictions for the U.S. economy, initially made at an international conference in Australia 10 years ago at a time when the economy appeared strong, have been given more credence by this year's events.

    When asked when the U.S. economy would collapse, Panarin said: "It is already collapsing. Due to the financial crisis, three of the largest and oldest five banks on Wall Street have already ceased to exist, and two are barely surviving. Their losses are the biggest in history. Now what we will see is a change in the regulatory system on a global financial scale: America will no longer be the world's financial regulator."

    When asked who would replace the U.S. in regulating world markets, he said: "Two countries could assume this role: China, with its vast reserves, and Russia, which could play the role of a regulator in Eurasia."

    Asked why he expected the U.S. to break up into separate parts, he said: "A whole range of reasons. Firstly, the financial problems in the U.S. will get worse. Millions of citizens there have lost their savings. Prices and unemployment are on the rise. General Motors and Ford are on the verge of collapse, and this means that whole cities will be left without work. Governors are already insistently demanding money from the federal center. Dissatisfaction is growing, and at the moment it is only being held back by the elections and the hope that Obama can work miracles. But by spring, it will be clear that there are no miracles."

    He also cited the "vulnerable political setup", "lack of unified national laws", and "divisions among the elite, which have become clear in these crisis conditions."

    He predicted that the U.S. will break up into six parts - the Pacific coast, with its growing Chinese population; the South, with its Hispanics; Texas, where independence movements are on the rise; the Atlantic coast, with its distinct and separate mentality; five of the poorer central states with their large Native American populations; and the northern states, where the influence from Canada is strong.

    He even suggested that "we could claim Alaska - it was only granted on lease, after all." Panarin, 60, is a professor at the Diplomatic Academy of the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs, and has authored several books on information warfare.

    Developing...


    Peace through superior firepower

    Luke 11:21
    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

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    The "respected daily" Izvestia was the other Party apparatus besides Pravda back in the Union days, so consider the source, perhaps. As for not having debt in the 80s, I don't think that's correct. In my lifetime, we've had balanced budgets under Nixon and Clinton, IIRC, but that didn't do away with the accumulated aggregate debt.

    Most Americans don't havesavings to lose, but those who do are insured and are not getting cleaned out. Bank savings accounts are about the only safe place to have money at present, in fact. Other so-called "securities" are another matter...

    This predicted Balkanization is likewise fanciful. I live in a northern state, and I have no idea what "Canadian influence" he's talking about. Maybe Celine Dion is on tour here. I wouldn't know.

    Yes, the supposed Alaskan lease agreement is pretty funny as well.

    The irony is that if any of this civil unrest comes to pass, I can thank the old Communist regime for meeting at least some of my personal security needs with their hardware, and not this guy.

    -ljp

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    If it does come to pass then remember on whose watch it happened.

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    The entire prediction shows an utter lack of understanding of how America functions and the social/regional divisions in the nation. He argues we will divide into Chinese, Hispanic, Texan, Atlantic Seaboard, Native American and Canadian regions. That doesn't make any sense whatsoever on numerous levels. Most of his "analysis" shows an utter lack of understanding of US demographics, US legal system, and even a fair ignorance of the basis of and operation of our system of government. It also thoroughly ignores that most of the divisions in this nation (as can be seen by looking at the red/blue divides within states) are along urban/rural lines rather than regional lines. Lastly, his comments about Alaska show a willful denial of historical reality.

    I find it interesting that he focuses on the economic collapses within the US and replacement by China or Russia as a superpower when while the US has lost about 50% of it's value in this crisis, Russia has lost about 75% and China about 80%. The crisis has hit them much harder in the big economic picture than it has hit the US. That may certainly change quickly in the near future, but today, it shows a lot of chutzpah to make the argument.

    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    deepdiver wrote:
    SNIP...it shows a lot of chutzpah to make the argument.


    Even money on it being a planted story.

    Hopefully, the right people on our team will be looking around to see what they're up to.

    The part about respected Isvestia was the give-away. I had the exact same thought Legba opened his post with above.


    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Lone Star Veteran Gator5713's Avatar
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    I think that Alaska will choose to join Texas! Then there will be no doubt about who has the oil!!!

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    I don't trust any news agency or agent thereof from the former Soviet Republic.I still remember a Soviet documentary crew coming to Kansas City to do a story on "average American people in an average American city". When they finished, all that they showed were the poor neighborhoods, the homeless, and crime. In one shot you could clearly see the Capitol Building in the background (the U.S. Capitol Building). I lived in the area the whole time that I was growing up, don't remember seeing that view.

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    Campaign Veteran Nelson_Muntz's Avatar
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    As Illustrated by Glenn Beck:



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    Flintlock wrote:
    A leading Russian political analyst
    I stopped after that.

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    Lone Star Veteran Gator5713's Avatar
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    I'm just glad that everybody understands that us Texans will remain Texans!

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    Gator5713 wrote:
    I'm just glad that everybody understands that us Texans will remain Texans!

    Really? I stopped after I happen to catch a glimpse of a link to the drudge report. :quirky

    Only that joke of a propaganda site would post an article so ridiculous. Stirring the fanatical right-wing pot FTL.

    Break up of America coming? Sure. Definitely nothing like he described. We're going to cut and paste the center of the country onto the moon and bring the coasts together. That will improveAmerican societyand simutantiously raise the national average IQ.

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    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    AWDstylez wrote:
    Gator5713 wrote:
    I'm just glad that everybody understands that us Texans will remain Texans!

    Really? I stopped after I happen to catch a glimpse of a link to the drudge report. :quirky

    Only that joke of a propaganda site would post an article so ridiculous. Stirring the fanatical right-wing pot FTL.

    Break up of America coming? Sure. Definitely nothing like he described. We're going to cut and paste the center of the country onto the moon and bring the coasts together. That will improveAmerican societyand simutantiously raise the national average IQ.
    I had forgotten that you were the forum authroity on all subjects and I should have checked with you first to see if it was suitable material...

    Do you ever have anything nice to say? Nobody forces you to read this material, much less poor out your negative commentary on a regular basis.Sarcasm is not always necessary to make your point.
    Peace through superior firepower

    Luke 11:21
    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

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    Gator5713 wrote:
    I'm just glad that everybody understands that us Texans will remain Texans!
    Got room for a transplant? If it all goes to hell I'm thinking Texas or Alaska.

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    Campaign Veteran Nelson_Muntz's Avatar
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    If you do head to Alaska, Smash, be sure you bring enough ammo to assist in fending off the Russians per the scenario discussed by the economist.

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    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    smash29 wrote:
    Gator5713 wrote:
    I'm just glad that everybody understands that us Texans will remain Texans!
    Got room for a transplant? If it all goes to hell I'm thinking Texas or Alaska.
    Come to Alaska.. We have a lot less people and we have open carry and concealed carry without a permit. Plus, too hot and dry in Texas andwe also have muchbetter fishing.
    Peace through superior firepower

    Luke 11:21
    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Legba wrote:
    This predicted Balkanization is likewise fanciful.* I live in a northern state, and I have no idea what "Canadian influence" he's talking about.* Maybe Celine Dion is on tour here.* I wouldn't know.
    Yeah, leave it to the Russians to view Russia as a microcosm for the whole world. :quirky

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    Thanks for the invite Flintlock, I'll definitelythink aboutit.

    After 30 years in CTfollowed by7 in GA I thought I had sworn off the cold forever but I find myself reconsidering ever since I visited AK in May. If I'm going "cold" then I'm going all the way andheading to Alaska.

    And yes Nelson, if I do head up there I'll do my part for the defense effort.

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    Flintlock wrote:
    I had forgotten that you were the forum authroity on all subjects and I should have checked with you first to see if it was suitable material...

    Do you ever have anything nice to say? Nobody forces you to read this material, much less poor out your negative commentary on a regular basis.Sarcasm is not always necessary to make your point.


    If someone here actually agreed with the article, I missed it. My "negativity" is simply me pointing out stupidity where I see it.

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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Nelson_Muntz wrote:
    As Illustrated by Glenn Beck:

    *
    Hahaha, that's all the proof I need that Glenn Beck is an idiot. WTF does he think he means by "distinct mentality coast"? Idiot. Some of our least-free states are on the east coast. California's gun laws, when compared to New York or New Jersey, are positively American. Yes, they need work, but comparing us to China while leaving NY as part of the "distinct mentality coast" (which also contains Virginia, home of the OC movement) is puerile.

    Edit: Never mind, I guess it's the Russian who's the idiot. I couldn't bring myself to actually read the article. Oh well.

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    marshaul wrote:
    Nelson_Muntz wrote:
    As Illustrated by Glenn Beck:

    Hahaha, that's all the proof I need that Glenn Beck is an idiot. WTF does he think he means by "distinct mentality coast"? Idiot. Some of our least-free states are on the east coast. California's gun laws, when compared to New York or New Jersey, are positively American. Yes, they need work, but comparing us to China while leaving NY as part of the "distinct mentality coast" is puerile.


    From Flintlock's post:

    He (The Russian analyst) predicted that the U.S. will break up into six parts - the Pacific coast, with its growing Chinese population; the South, with its Hispanics; Texas, where independence movements are on the rise; the Atlantic coast, with its distinct and separate mentality; five of the poorer central states with their large Native American populations; and the northern states, where the influence from Canada is strong.







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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Yeah, I only skimmed the article on first read. Obviously a bad move, but I couldn't bring myself to read the whole thing. It was too stupendously dumb.

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    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    AWDstylez wrote:
    If someone here actually agreed with the article, I missed it. My "negativity" is simply me pointing out stupidity where I see it.
    Not really sure what you are calling stupid... The fact that I posted this article, the fact that the Drudge Report posted this article on their site, or the Russian analyst.

    Your excessive critisisms of those that differ from your opinion combined with your consistent lambasting and hateful rhetoricof entire sections of the country that do not believe in your leftist version of how America should be, leaves you with little credibility and appears to be incessant trolling.

    When it comes right down to it, the version of America you wish for is not a lot different from Canada.Good luck with that wish, it doesn't seem like anything that I would think one would desire...

    By the way, for one that has such strong "opinion" on many subjects on an open carry of firearms and pro-2nd amendment forum, and for someone that speaks down to us, ridicules us, and criticizes us regularly for not only our opinions, but for even posting on a forum at all, I find itrather humerous that despite your self-appointed superiority, you post here often andadmittedly don't even open carry.

    Do you even support the practice? Do you believe in unregulated gun ownership?
    Peace through superior firepower

    Luke 11:21
    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

  23. #23
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    I have had in-depth discussion with AWDstylez, and I can answer those questions for him:

    1: Yes, in rural areas.

    2: No. Government needs to regulate human behavior.

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    Flintlock wrote:
    Not really sure what you are calling stupid... The fact that I posted this article, the fact that the Drudge Report posted this article on their site, or the Russian analyst.


    All three. I think it was pretty clear. The article is clearly worthless for anything other than a laugh (which isn't allowed here when off topic, which this is). Drudge posted it to stir up people that don't know better (i.e. almost everyone that reads that site), that much is obvious. Why the Russian wrote it or you bothered to repeat it is beyond me.



    Marshaul was close. I support the practice when done properly, meaning when done in such a way it does not bring ill-will and reflect poorly on the pro-gun community as a whole. Like it or not, people in the open carry movement aren't the only gun owners in the country and need to be mindful of how they reflect on the community as a whole (which they often aren't). As separate as you might want to be, the rest of the country sees open carriers and the rest of the gun owning community as one in the same. Every idiot cowboy that supports the negative stereotype the antis have created does the whole of us far more harm than good. I've discussed this a million and one times already.

    As for unregulated ownership, absolutely not. That would beone of those cases of you disagreeing with the Supreme Court based on your own opinions and nothing more. Goread the national park carry thread or the felons' rights thread if you really want my lengthy opinion on that matter.


    And I have to lol at my supposed "hate" of "entire areas of the country." If you can't take some stereotype jokes (that many people here prove true) then GTF off the internet. :quirky

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