Why do you open carry? - Mumbai

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GWbiker wrote:

I don't agree though, that all our laws are correct and just either, I believe there's alot of innocent people in there for no real reason at all, they were framed. And the only people who would know about that is the person who got framed and the person who framed the other. Just something to think about,hmmm

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I can see you never worked in law enforcement, bro.

Those convicted felons are INNOCENT of any crime. They were ALL FRAMED. Just ask them!

There are very few guilty people in our prisons.

I met a "lifer" who readily admitted to murdering his wife and her lover.

I had more respect for lifers who admitted their guilt than the whiners who claimed to be innocent and framed by Police or by unknown persons.

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now now, bro, your taking what I said out of context, misconscrewing my words and saying things that are way off from what I'm saying. And no I haven't never worked in any type of law enforcement, but I did serve my country in the Army for along time and I'm a war veteran of Iraq, so I do believe I have a little room to speak on this subject, don't you.

Now that being said, what I was really trying to say,so that you can understand me better was not everyone in prisons and jail are guilty, I have a lot of friends who were LEO's and corrections officers and they told me a lot of what goes on, and I respect the job. But don't agree everyone should have to serve time in the big pin for little minor crimes, there's gotta be a better way, like community service, plus weekends in jails and stuff of that nature. I'm not going to give a percentage on how many people I think are innocent in prison , but I wouldn't say its to many, I believe most of them in prison ARE guilty, do I believe a unarmed robber that robs a gas stations belongs in the same place with killers,rapist,muggers and so on, absolutely not. But that's the way things are until we can convince intelligent people that all don't belong in the same place. Remember my user name" Mr. Advocate" I'm here for everyone in some form or fashion, they are still human beings first, before they are criminals and depending on there crime, they should be separated from others inside or outside of the prison based on there crime. The yards should not be filled with criminals of all different natures, that's how non violent , or less crime committed criminals get killed in the system. And you said you was a correction officer for along time so I know you've seen a lot, and you know what I'm talking about.

When the state/gov. takes someone in on charges and puts them behind bars it is the responsibility of that facility and staff to protect each and every criminal behind bars, so that way they can serve there time like there suppose to and live to get out and have a second chance to redeem themselves to all of us out here, to see if there worthy of gaining there freedom back. Wouldn't you agree? Just something to think about:question:Also somethings else, once a convicted felon, not always a convicted felon, I think once you have served the time for the crime, and you get out and have proven yourself to the community during what is called the probation period, I'd say in about a years time frame, Depending on your crime of course, that you should be able to go back and apply to get your firearm rights restored and the convicted felon title removed from your name. See the thing is, I seem to change in people, that some actually will change and do change when they get out, I honestly believe people can change, now I know your shaken your head and saying stuff like , this guys crazy or completely wrong, but I'm about helping people if they want help and need it. I don't believe in condemning people for life for what they did one time. Give them a second chance to succeed in life, whats so wrong with that. I don't know what your religious view points are, But thank goodness that God has unconditional love for all of us, and its outa the pure grace of God that we have a chance to go to heaven. Or else almost all of us on earth would be going to hell.

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When I did my field training... 'had occaision to go to the MD State Pen... the old one, downtown. More like an insane asylum. There's people (I use that term generically) in there who should NEVER be allowed anywhere near civilized human beings... ever!

To err is human... to forgive ain't in my job description. I have no compassion, empathy or warm fuzzies for none of 'em. They need killin'. 'Advocate' knows nothing of the nature of the beasts he'd coddle.

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Sonora Rebel wrote:

When I did my field training... 'had occaision to go to the MD State Pen... the old one, downtown. More like an insane asylum. There's people (I use that term generically) in there who should NEVER be allowed anywhere near civilized human beings... ever!

To err is human... to forgive ain't in my job description. I have no compassion, empathy or warm fuzzies for none of 'em. They need killin'. 'Advocate' knows nothing of the nature of the beasts he'd coddle.

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Well said Rebel, but do know actually about the nature of the beast though, and I completely agree with you that some people should Never be allowed anywhere close to any human beings, I agree with that, that's a very true statement. But your talking about maximum security prisons level 5 right? Like the most ruthless people in existence right? Those beast should actually be in the insane asylum though, cause they have some really serious issue's. A padded room, white light on all the time, and in one of those vest, the name slipped my mind, but its one of those vest that locks in the back of the person. Oh yeah they need to given shots of whatever they give those people there as well, cause those type that your talking about are on the helpless list. But that's a holenother issue, than what I'm talking about

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41mag wrote:

I counsel felons that are on probation, many of them are repeat offenders. Recently one of them was dying from cancer, told me he had planned on going to Phoenix where he was first arrested and kill as many honkies as he could find at the mall. He then confessed when he saw quiet a few people at the mall where OC armed he decided he wasnt ready to be gunned down by some shopper. He died shortly there after of pancreatic cancer. He also admitted that if he had not seen anybody armed he would have opened fire on people coming out of the food mart. He figured he could have killed as many as he had ammo. He did not disclose his weapon of choice.

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Wow. Wish I could confirm that story. It would be great to use in arguments over this issue.

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when the state/gov. takes someone in on charges and puts them behind bars it is the responsibility of that facility and staff to protect each and every criminal behind bars, so that way they can serve there time like there suppose to and live to get out and have a second chance to redeem themselves to all of us out here, to see if there worthy of gaining there freedom back. Wouldn't you agree? Just something to think about:question:Also somethings else, once a convicted felon, not always a convicted felon, I think once you have served the time for the crime, and you get out and have proven yourself to the community during what is called the probation period, I'd say in about a years time frame, Depending on your crime of course, that you should be able to go back and apply to get your firearm rights restored and the convicted felon title removed from your name. See the thing is, I seem to change in people, that some actually will change and do change when they get out, I honestly believe people can change, now I know your shaken your head and saying stuff like , this guys crazy or completely wrong, but I'm about helping people if they want help and need it. I don't believe in condemning people for life for what they did one time. Give them a second chance to succeed in life, whats so wrong with that. I don't know what your religious view points are, But thank goodness that God has unconditional love for all of us, and its outa the pure grace of God that we have a chance to go to heaven. Or else almost all of us on earth would be going to hell.

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If you sincerely believe all that nonsense you tapped out, then apply for a counselor position at one of your state correction institution. Assuming you are of age. Drug/alcohol, mental health, anger management, sexual abuse counselors are always needed and the pay is quite good.

While on your quest to change the attitudes of habitual offenders and thus make the world a better/safer place to live in, first spend a few years in one of society's junkyards before you spout off more liberal nonsense.

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While on your quest to change the attitudes of habitual offenders and thus make the world a better/safer place to live in, first spend a few years in one of society's junkyards before you spout off more liberal nonsense.

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Look guy, I'm not on no quest like that, and I sure as "F" ain't no liberal, I hate liberals, I just believe some of the laws are bs, and some of the people put in those society junkyards don't really belong there, I believe also some good decent people in there change once there in behind bars so they can fit in and not get killed, cause the correction officers are sittin on there fat cans eating food in there little safe heaven while new fresh meats coming in and getting a** raped. Or some guy who's minding his own business in there gets shanked to death while he was trying to serve his time, and now he's dead by a already muli-life sentenced murderer and has nothing to lose, all because that correction officer is doing nothing except collecting a free government check and not doing there job your dickhead. I don't give a flying crap what you think Buddie , think what you want , its your opinion and your entitled to it unfortunately, but don't come bringing that big smelly bucket of cow crap my way, cause I ain't smelling it.

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Well I feel very good about the ones I put inside. Some on death row but most on extended vacations at taxpayer expense for periods ranging from 25 years to life without parole.

I have not lost one nights sleep about the ones on death row. All but one of those guys went up for multiple murders. If it offends anyone that I put them there or that I don't feel bad about it I am afraid I will just have to say too bad. I would do it over again in a half a new york second.

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All but one of those guys went up for multiple murders. If it offends anyone that I put them there or that I don't feel bad about it I am afraid I will just have to say too bad. I would do it over again in a half a new york second.

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There's the key sentence right there Mr. Hawk murders, serial killers, people that KILL AND MANGLE UP PEOPLE, so know I wouldn't lose one nights sleep over it either. I would be happy to do that job to, I would even lend a hand in on the execution. The only one's I wouldn't agree with is accidental murders, you know, someone killed someone and did not intentionally plan to kinda like what cops face everyday, that they might have to kill someone, but they don't drink there coffee and eat there eggs and say by honey, I'm going to kill someone today,lol, you know. Or lets say two guys are horse playing in the house upstairs and one kid pushes his friend into the stairs guardrail the rail breaks and the other kid goes falling to his death, thats called a accident. Or in my cause I , about a quarter of the year ride a motorcycle someone dumb ass that doesn't look twice pulls out immediately in front of me while I'm doing 45 maybe 50 down the road, I go flyin off my bike and slam into a tree, unfortunate, but its still considered a accident, those people do not belong on death row, now do they? Now I think what your talking about is planned murders, premeditated/serial killers, right? I hope your not just talk in about anyone who takes a life, that what be stupid to put the people I was talking about on death row. They should all be punished and spend sometime behind bars to think about what they did, but not like the serial killers, they can't learn, there hopeless.

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Granted I have no experience with prisons (never been in, never worked in one), but from many different sources about them I've been made aware of, there definitely needs to be some serious changes. I do believe that some people can be reformed while others cannot. The key to reform is to catch the problem before it becomes too serious. In other words, catch and reform a man who abuses women before it gets to the point where he rapes and kills them, catch a pickpocket or bike thief before he becomes an armed robber, etc. I think most of us know exactly what goes on in most of America's prisons. Criminals are thrown in with a certain sentence, given certain rules, etc. but ultimately there is no real "reform" program. They spend most of their time associating with each other which only encourages worse behavior when they get out. Serious criminals (killers, rapists, etc.) should not be allowed back into society but quite a few other types I do believe can be reformable. The problem is there is no functional reform system in place.

It cannot be denied that abuse does not take place. Inmates beat up, rape, and even kill each other, suicides happen, and even corrections officers sometimes are involved or cover up the abuse. Not that this is per se rampant in prisons but it does exist and if a "correctional" facility is so "secure" NONE of this should happen barring the very very rare occurance. While I'd have to double check my sources, I have read that the #1 crime that Americans are incarcerated in prison for is drug offenses be they dealing, trafficking, or simply posession. A real justice system would keep violent and harmful people out of society--not go after victimless crimes. Drugs are a commodity that people want just like McDonald's hamburgers or Calvin Klein jeans. If people want them, there will be a trade and an industry for them. More people are at risk health-wise from fast-food or cigarettes than recreational drugs yet those things are legal. As long as society is persecuting people who are not harming anyone but simply doing something culturally unacceptable, you are not going to fix the problems with crime. Some say that drugs, prostitution, etc. cause crime but the reason they cause crime is because they are illegal to begin with. Budweiser and Miller don't have gangs on our streets who take each other out to protect their respective brands because alcohol is LEGAL.

Anyway, I didn't mean to go on but the justice system is incredibly corrupt and a lot of honest decent Americans who may have just made a couple of mistakes are indeed suffering from it. Sure there are some good things with our system but a lot definitely needs to be improved. I actually have a close friend who had to spend time in prison for simply doing something stupid and being caught with illegal drugs. This person has to battle to get voting and firearm rights back. This person is not someone who is violent or harmful to society in any way. So much for the "land of the free." It is a crock of BS. In all fairness, we are better off than many other countries but we can strive to do better.

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I actually have a close friend who had to spend time in prison for simply doing something stupid and being caught with illegal drugs. This person has to battle to get voting and firearm rights back. This person is not someone who is violent or harmful to society in any way. So much for the "land of the free." It is a crock of BS. In all fairness, we are better off than many other countries but we can strive to do better.

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I agree completely protector, we do have it alot better than other countries, but like you said we can improve our parts of the system that are broken.

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Mr.Advocate wrote:

All but one of those guys went up for multiple murders. If it offends anyone that I put them there or that I don't feel bad about it I am afraid I will just have to say too bad. I would do it over again in a half a new york second.

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There's the key sentence right there Mr. Hawk murders, serial killers, people that KILL AND MANGLE UP PEOPLE, so know I wouldn't lose one nights sleep over it either. I would be happy to do that job to,

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SNIP...

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Well yes.

This is one of them.

Here is another.

I have only had one case where I had second thoughts, mostly because it was not a US case and the standards for conviction were not the same as ours. I am certain the guy was guilty, but under the system in that country the avenues of defense open to him were different than here. From the start of the trial until he was hanged was less than 2 months. THat system is too efficient for my tastes.

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There should be a gallowsin back of every courthouse. I'd stretch 'em same day 'n save the taxpayers money.

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There should be a gallowsin back of every courthouse. I'd stretch 'em same day 'n save the taxpayers money.

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Well hell Rebel, if your going back to hangings, well why the hell not go back to medieval days and use guillotines and swords we your at it, or lets go back alittle further, how bout stoning,hmmm. :question:

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Rope's cheap... 'n the Guillotine isn't medieval.

"Whiskey for my men... beer for the horses!"

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Well, it wasn't the hanging part I had a problem with.

The case was in another country, and their processes leave a little to be desired by American standards. I am a supporter of speedy trials, and swift justice, but two months from trial date to grave leaves a lot of room for error, and no time to fix it.

That said, I would agree that our system here has gone WAY too far the other way. When you have people on death row for 20 years, something is wrong with the system. The method of execution is irrelevant, if you never use it.

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We have too much Law 'n no 'nuff Justice. The appellate process is a joke.



There's only one cure for recetivism...

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SFCRetired wrote:

Sonora Rebel wrote:

'Too bad it wasn't flesh eatin' worms or somesuch. What's all this touchy-feely 'bout some perp who'd waste innocents? I'd feed 'em into a sausage grinder on pay-per- view 'n pass around the popcorn. I don't CARE what the anti's say... or think... or if they can say or think at all.

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You may not care what they say or think and you may not believe they think, but there are a lot of folks who are still on the fence who are listening to both sides. How do you think it makes our side look to make statements like you have just made?

It's not touchy-feely concern for any perp; it's about appearances and public relations. Both of those are critical right now if we are going to preserve our God-given rights. What I am trying to say with both my previous post and with this one is, "Don't give the enemy ammunition."

There's another thread on here that discusses the appropriateness of swastikas or pictures of naked women on our pistol grips as we open carry. Those things give the public a negative image just as comments like yours on a public forum can also give the public a negative image of us.

We just cannot afford to give the other side even a small advantage.

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SFCRetired You musta been in the rear with the gear. I was a combat arms trooper and in truth always spoke my mind. That Fella talking about killin as many honkies as he could really pissed me off. And as was said prior, I'm glad he saw he woulda been gunned down on the spot, and glad we're not wasting any more tax payers money feedin the sumbitch. It pisses me off to think that some people want to candy coat everything. We're not Kool-Aid drinkers here, we believe in the constitution and the Bill of Rights, including ALL of it. Now the socialists want to try and *SHUUUUSH* (in my best Pauly Shore imitation) the conservative talk radio hosts and take awy our right to hear the truth. Because they know if they do that we'll be fragmented in any kind of resistance to their self serving, self important, dragging us into socialism and the morass of the "Nanny State" Well,,I'm not havin any of it and not signing up for this lil dance. This ain't my first rodeo ya know.
You stay strong Sonora Gal
Keep your powder dry !
edited for SP fix

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KansasMustang wrote:

SFCRetired wrote:

Sonora Rebel wrote:

'Too bad it wasn't flesh eatin' worms or somesuch. What's all this touchy-feely 'bout some perp who'd waste innocents? I'd feed 'em into a sausage grinder on pay-per- view 'n pass around the popcorn. I don't CARE what the anti's say... or think... or if they can say or think at all.

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You may not care what they say or think and you may not believe they think, but there are a lot of folks who are still on the fence who are listening to both sides. How do you think it makes our side look to make statements like you have just made?

It's not touchy-feely concern for any perp; it's about appearances and public relations. Both of those are critical right now if we are going to preserve our God-given rights. What I am trying to say with both my previous post and with this one is, "Don't give the enemy ammunition."

There's another thread on here that discusses the appropriateness of swastikas or pictures of naked women on our pistol grips as we open carry. Those things give the public a negative image just as comments like yours on a public forum can also give the public a negative image of us.

We just cannot afford to give the other side even a small advantage.

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SECRetired You musta been in the rear with the gear. I was a combat arms trooper and in truth always spoke my mind. That Fella talking about killin as many honkies as he could really pissed me off. And as was said prior, I'm glad he saw he woulda been gunned down on the spot, and glad we're not wasting any more tax payers money feedin the sumbitch. It pisses me off to think that some people want to candy coat everything. We're not Kool-Aid drinkers here, we believe in the constitution and the Bill of Rights, including ALL of it. Now the socialists want to try and *SHUUUUSH* (in my best Pauly Shore imitation) the conservative talk radio hosts and take awy our right to hear the truth. Because they know if they do that we'll be fragmented in any kind of resistance to their self serving, self important, dragging us into socialism and the morass of the "Nanny State" Well,,I'm not havin any of it and not signing up for this lil dance. This ain't my first rodeo ya know.
You stay strong Sonora Gal
Keep your powder dry !

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"GAL?" :what:Say whut?

I don't care what the libtards think... and I will not pretend to placate 'em. I will not 'shuddup' and be civil. I am not above punchin' a few lights out either to get my point across if necesssary. I will not aquiece. Iwould besocially unacceptablein many circles... thatI wouldn't want'a be part of anyway. I was also 'combat arms'. Maybe that's a common denominator. Among many of the REMF's it's just a regular 9 to 5 or so. More like civilians. I have no heartburn about killin'. In theNational Interest or for the Common Good. Unfortunately there's gonna be some collateral damage. It's not a sterile process.

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GWbiker wrote:

Has anyone here ever worked in a state maximum security prison, in a level five prison, in a "Capitol Case" housing unit (Death Row)?

I have and I retired after 20 years.

As a supervisor I read hundreds of case studies of inmates who committed the most horrific crimes on society's innocent people. Crimes ranging from child rape to multiple murder.

So I really don't give a rats a$$ if a locked up convicted felon dies from an incurable disease.

You want to impress an anti to join our side? Simply ask one to tour a maximum security prison during an open house for workers famlies, or to simply sit down to a conversation with a correction officer who works in society's garbage pit.

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Yes, I have. Maximum security, Indiana. Yes, more than one real scumbag there, though I would have to concede not EVERY inmate.

While I have no favorable remarks about those who have chosen to wantonly commit murder, etc. I would also have to agree that posting commentary to the effect of "...put 'em in a sausage grinder" is EXACTLY the sort of rhetoric those who would prefer to deny you of your rights WANT YOU to state.

Don't think for a moment that the "fanatical anti-gunners" don't come and check out this forum. And they're MORE THAN HAPPY to copy and past such commentary as "proof" that YOU are too vicious, hostile, and too uncaring of the human life of others to have the right to carry a lethal weapon and therefore MUST BE PROHIBITED from being able to do so.

With all due respect, such rhetoric only helps "prove" to the extreme anti-gun nuts that the person making such statements is a fanatical zealot willing to put people in a sausage grinder at the least provocation, and makes that person no better than the scumbag murderer. Not sure how that furthers the OC objective, honestly. Making "insane" (not MY perspective, the anti-gunners) statements just proves their point.

Just some thoughts. But irrational commentary on a forum available to ANY person from either side of the issue is perhaps irresponsible, regardless of what one's personal belief might be.

Like it or not, carrying OC (or even CC, for that matter) isn't the "norm" in our society, nor is carrying OC guaranteed in the Constitution. In fact, it's not even mentioned (neither is CC. Just the RKBA). RESPONSIBLE gun ownership and carry REQUIRES a responsible mindset, like it or not.

Just my opinion, but it's probably NOT a good idea to give anti-gunners more fuel for their fire. And they're chomping at the bit to yell "gun nut, GUN nut, GUN NUT!! Can't trust 'em with guns! See, we TOLD ya!"

Lastly, IF (god forbid), you ever DO get into a lethal encounter and have to shoot or worse, end the life of another person, you can rest assured that, should a Prosecutor decide to charge you, they'll most certainly locate and take such comments and use them against you as proof that you acted with malice aforethought.

Believe it.