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Thread: Star-Telegram Sports Writer thinks he knows when you have enough gun rights - opposed open carry

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    Sport guy confused - thinks we ONLY want license holders to have open carry rights.

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    http://www.star-telegram.com/329/story/1073685.html

    Plaxico Burress is no Roy Rogers

    By JIM REEVES
    revo@star-telegram.com



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    There was a time in my life when I was absolutely sure I’d grow up to be Roy Rogers.For those of you too young to know who I’m talking about, Roy was a 1950s movie cowboy who wore two pistols on his hips, but generally whipped up on the bad guys without actually killing anybody. He just winged them.

    Or at least that’s the way it looked to my wide 6-year-old eyes in the darkness of the Cactus Theater in Carlsbad, N.M.

    And when Roy did shoot somebody, we never saw blood or gore, or the painful aftermath. Things were so much simpler then, if overly-sanitized for that era’s consumption.

    Thing are a bit more complicated now. Ask New York Giants receiver Plaxico Burress, who just threw away a career and millions of dollars when he illegally carried a 9-millimeter Glock into a Manhattan nightclub last week, and then managed to shoot himself in the leg with it.

    I say all this as a prelude to a confession: I own a handgun. It’s just a .22-caliber revolver, but it’s still a gun and still deadly. I couldn’t tell you the last time I actually picked it up, but it’s there, put away in a case in the house.

    I bought it for snakes and varmints back when I was a hunter years ago, not that I could have hit one if I’d tried. Then, when I lived in the country for more than a decade, I kept it around for that, and to have a firearm my wife could actually handle when I was traveling. You know, just in case.

    That’s the way we are in this country, especially out here in the West. Our history was changed forever by the advent of the Colt .45 and its colorful and bloody tradition spawned a whole movie industry. Even today, the Roy Rogers in me still inspires me to be first in line when a good Western flick, such as the recent Appaloosa[/i], shows up in theaters.

    We still think we have to be prepared in case there’s an Indian uprising on the reservation.

    I’ve been slow to understand that life really isn’t like the movies. I don’t need to be Roy Rogers. We pay taxes for law enforcement folks to be our heroes.

    That’s why I shuddered earlier this week when I saw that the gun lobby intends to focus on Texas in trying to turn us into an "open carry" state. That means those who have permits to carry a concealed weapon will be able to walk the streets with the big iron on their hips.

    That leaves the rest of us to wonder whether they think they’re Roy Rogers, or Dirty Harry or Charles Whitman.

    What I know for sure is that I don’t want to saunter into a McDonald’s with my granddaughters and have them sitting in a booth next to a guy carrying a .357 Magnum, but not a badge. If they’re packing, I’d just as soon be blissfully ignorant of that fact.

    It’s ironic that the "open carry" story should hit on the Monday after Burress, who had an expired weapons permit from Florida, plugged himself in the thigh after strolling into the Latin Quarter nightclub with a Glock in his waistband the previous Friday night.

    This was a guy who, at one time, had a licensed permit to carry his weapon in Florida. Doesn’t that license require some sort of training and gun education before it’s issued? Yet, Burress didn’t even know how to work the safety on his pistol.

    The wonder is that he only shot himself, fortunately not seriously, and not some innocent bystander.

    Yet, Burress felt like he needed the protection while he partied — on an already injured leg, mind you — because of his expensive jewelry and the wads of cash he carried.

    I have to agree with Fox’s Tony Siragusa, a former NFL player, who noted during Sunday’s Redskins-Giants game, "If you go to a place that you feel you need to carry a gun, the best thing is stay home."

    Ah, but that would be the logical, smart thing to do and those attributes are exceedingly rare among professional athletes.

    And if they can’t force themselves to stay home, use some of that cash to hire a couple of bodyguards. Of course, sometimes even that doesn’t keep a player out of trouble, as Jerry Jones recently learned.

    At least then, though, there’s someone else to pin the blame on if things go bad.

    Burress picked up his Glock and his permit in Florida, where the gun laws are notoriously weak. In this year alone, Florida gun permit holders have been charged in two murders and a manslaughter.

    But the Giants receiver, who just signed a $35 million contract after helping his team win a Super Bowl last year, brought his weapon to New Jersey, where he lives, and from there to New York, two of the toughest gun law states in the country.

    As one New York columnist pointed out, if Burress had ridden the subway to the Latin Quarter, instead of taking a limo, he’d have had a hard time missing the signs that are posted everywhere: "1 gun = 3 1/2 years."

    That’s 3 1/2 years minimum prison time for carrying a weapon into a nightclub. Guaranteed. And New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg has made it clear he expects the law to play no favorites just because Burress is an NFL star.

    The Giants already have suspended Burress for the remainder of the season and the chances that he’ll ever play for them again are remote. Essentially, that was a $35 million bullet Burress fired through his thigh.

    He thought he might have to thwart some bad guy who could try to rob him of his bling. Now, he might have to hock all that jewelry just to pay his legal fees.

    It’s a painful lesson, especially for Burress, but one we all need to learn.

    Roy Rogers doesn’t live here any more.

    Jim Reeves, 817-390-7760

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    I hope he knows more about sports than he knows about guns and the people who own them.:P

    I think he sums up hisview of the worldbest when he says "I’d just as soon be blissfully ignorant of that fact." It is obviousthat he is "blissfully ignorant" of many facts.



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    Yet, Burress didn’t even know how to work the safety on his pistol.
    Since when has a glock had a safety to work?


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    If they’re packing, I’d just as soon be blissfully ignorant of that fact.
    I think this ill-though statement sums up his lack of understanding of the issue.

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    I think his whole article could have been a better example of a forum post. Op-ed is Op-ed, not exactly factual basis for something.

    I AM glad that people have opinions. It is good, it means they're thinking -- or at least, thinking enough to have an opinion -- but sometimes not critically.

    Let's be logical about this: If he's happy and doesn't care that someone is carrying a firearm, why should it matter if it's concealed or not? There is no reduction of risk of mishandling whether the firearm is visible or not. The only difference is a person's emotional reaction to seeing the gun. An assailant's emotional reaction will be to move on, the threat of life or limb is not worth it. Coming from his era of good 'ol cowboys and indians, WW1 and WW2 movies of granduer, glory days of neigh... Why would seeing a gun be something so frightful?

    I understand the statement that "this is not the wild west!". True, it's the decrepit west, where crime is abound, people care not to help another in need and society has become so morally displaced that even if you were being assaulted, the most you would get is an anonymous call to the police... Which they also have no obligation to help you, should they find the time.

    It's not the wild west, here. It's the land of self-made men and those who can fend for thesmelves.
    Gun control isn't about guns -- it is about control.

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    demnogis wrote:
    I think his whole article could have been a better example of a forum post. Op-ed is Op-ed, not exactly factual basis for something.

    I AM glad that people have opinions. It is good, it means they're thinking -- or at least, thinking enough to have an opinion -- but sometimes not critically.

    Let's be logical about this: If he's happy and doesn't care that someone is carrying a firearm, why should it matter if it's concealed or not? There is no reduction of risk of mishandling whether the firearm is visible or not. The only difference is a person's emotional reaction to seeing the gun. An assailant's emotional reaction will be to move on, the threat of life or limb is not worth it. Coming from his era of good 'ol cowboys and indians, WW1 and WW2 movies of granduer, glory days of neigh... Why would seeing a gun be something so frightful?

    I understand the statement that "this is not the wild west!". True, it's the decrepit west, where crime is abound, people care not to help another in need and society has become so morally displaced that even if you were being assaulted, the most you would get is an anonymous call to the police... Which they also have no obligation to help you, should they find the time.

    It's not the wild west, here. It's the land of self-made men and those who can fend for thesmelves.
    Amen Brother preach it!!!!!!!!

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    And let's not forget Yukon Cornelius, http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum65/19123.html

    He carries a revolver everywhere, even into Santa's Workshop! Oh, the horror!

    I wonder if his grandchildren watched "Rudolph" on ABC last night.
    A law-abiding citizen should be able to carry his personal protection firearm anywhere that an armed criminal might go.

    Member VCDL, NRA

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    The Star Tell It All is a liberal rag anyway. I ignore what they write about gun rights because it is usually wrong!

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    I'm sorry..I just had to laugh when I read this..

    "Burress picked up his Glock and his permit in Florida, where the gun laws are notoriously weak. In this year alone, Florida gun permit holders have been charged in two murders and a manslaughter."


    So...a whole THREE legal gun carriers in the the entire state of Florida allegedly did something foolish?

    Shocking I tells ya! Shocking!


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    Miracle wrote:
    I'm sorry..I just had to laugh when I read this..

    "Burress picked up his Glock and his permit in Florida, where the gun laws are notoriously weak. In this year alone, Florida gun permit holders have been charged in two murders and a manslaughter."


    So...a whole THREE legal gun carriers in the the entire state of Florida allegedly did something foolish?

    Shocking I tells ya! Shocking!
    the guy was a concealed carrier - open carriers get much more scrutiny and they know it and I think are far less likley to have negligent discharges.

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    Miracle wrote:
    I'm sorry..I just had to laugh when I read this..

    "Burress picked up his Glock and his permit in Florida, where the gun laws are notoriously weak. In this year alone, Florida gun permit holders have been charged in two murders and a manslaughter."


    So...a whole THREE legal gun carriers in the the entire state of Florida allegedly did something foolish?

    Shocking I tells ya! Shocking!
    the guy was a concealed carrier - open carriers get much more scrutiny and they know it and I think are far less likley to have negligent discharges.

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    "Burress picked up his Glock and his permit in Florida, where the gun laws are notoriously weak. In this year alone, Florida gun permit holders have been charged in two murders and a manslaughter."
    Just thinking cold, hard numbers here. Three murders? THREE!?

    In 2007, there were 1,202 murders in Florida, 825 of which involved firearms. So you're telling me that 3 of those were by people with concealed permits? Man it sounds like Flordia has a serious problem with its concealed carriers. They're committing all of the crimes, aren't they? Stupid writer. If you're going to pull numbers, at least include the important context. People want the truth, not your biased opinion. Most of us know that permit holders are far less likely to commit crimes of any sort, and much, much, much less likely to commit murder.

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    I noticed on his Florida comment, there were 2 CHARGES for murder and 1 for manslaughter. No convictions? Hmmmmm

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    Notso wrote:
    I noticed on his Florida comment, there were 2 CHARGES for murder and 1 for manslaughter. No convictions? Hmmmmm
    that's not surprising considering how slow the judicial process goes. But still...THREE?? Talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill.

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    Pretty bold for the guy to put a phone number on a rag like that.....I'd expect he's getting a few phone calls.

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    Anyone else tired of how ignorant the liberal media is?

    And being charged with something means nothing without a conviction.

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    He knows less about guns, than he does sports. I will be cancelling my subscription today.

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    Deleted: I didn't read the whole thread and someone beat me to it.

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    mark edward marchiafava wrote:
    After reading this "tripe," I emailed Jim, actually got a prompt reply !!! It was hilarious, I forwarded it to Doug Huffman, he can post it if he chooses.
    aw! no reply to me yet. /cry

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    okay..got my reply.

    " Appreciate the note. Thanks for weighing in with your opinion. I never doubted that there are far more responsible gun owners (I'm one myself) and permit holders than fools like Burress. But it only takes one to kill some innocent bystander.
    Thanks again,
    jr
    fwst"




    So...his nonsense about Florida's gun laws and a whopping THREE permit holding gun owners being accused of committing a crime...?


    Perhaps it is a requirement to check one's brain at the door when you write for a paper?





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    Sarcasm on:

    Does Jim Reeves have permit for his keyboard? I would submit he has negligently discharged his writing responsibilities. Shouldn't he lose his job and do some jail time? How uninformed(of facts) can he be? Words are dangerous things I tell you. They scare and offend people all the time. I'd feel a lot better if he kept his opinions to himself.

    Oh, what's that you say? He must not know about the 2nd Amendment to the CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA (that comes right after the 1st Amendment)? He does? Uhhh, Uh,...

    Upon further review, sorry Jim, you're right, all the infringing stuff only applies to the 2nd Amendment, not the 1st. It says it right there in the 2nd Amendment that no one except Law Enforcement officers can Keep and BEAR arms. My mistake.

    The question I always ask the Jim Reeves of the world is "Where do you get your Crystal Balls? I want one so that I can stop needing to be concerned about my or my wife's protection. I guess the world really is a safe place. No one really ever gets hurt by bad guys.

    Sarcasm off.

    Here in CA. the son of recently retired Speaker of the Assembly, Fabian Nunez, was arrested for murder. The charge is that he and 3 buddies did a lot drinking one evening and decided to go out and "gang up" on somebody and do them some harm. They found some guys, started a fight and knifed them all. 1 of the knifed victims died of a knife wound to the heart. Esteban Nunez allegedly said prior to the event that he would take the rap and that his father would hopefully get him off if need be.

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    David817 wrote:
    He knows less about guns, than he does sports. I will be cancelling my subscription today.
    Good move on your part. Did you let them know? Makes me wish i lived there and had the subscription i would follow suit.

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    whiskaz_55 wrote:
    Yet, Burress didn’t even know how to work the safety on his pistol.
    Since when has a glock had a safety to work?
    My thoughts exactly. I carry a glock exclusively and never had an accidental discharge. I think that I will take the time to look once more for the safety that he is referring to.

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    Itis oft stated that "The pen is mightier than the sword". This principle only holds true when the pen holds intelligible "INK". Opinionated "slobber" constitutes a poor susbstitute for ink on any parchment. This SPORTS writer has the 1A right to wade into the public forum and express his personal belief, feeling, philospohy, point of view (whatever). Were he to approach the sports issue with the same degree of ignorance - he would undoubtedly find himself at McDonalds flipping burgers.

    I am tempted to offer the same quarter to the excercise of his 1Aprotected rights - as he affords the citizens of Texas in the excercise of their 2A protected right. The utter insanity of declaring the 2A de facto null & void ( because guns are deadly weapons designed to inflict deadly injury) is a facet of "progressive" philosophy -AKA the US Constitutionis no longerin effect.If the "progressives" were to succeed in trampling the 2A into paper mulch(they won't)- The demise of Mr Reeve's precious IA will be next -

    Mr Reeves, your demonstrated lack of respect for the US Constitution is precisely WHY more citizens need to excercise their right to arm themselves in defense of their persons - just as you so freely excercise your right to expose your ignorance, and pathetic naivete.People like myself havepreviously not forcefully countered thepoint of view you hold-as our neighborhoods, parking lots, and streets have increasingly become the "turf" of violent, predatory criminals. Those days are over.

    The bodies of innocentvictims pile up on the streets and in the fields while law enforcement agencies that we fund admit they do not have the means, inclination , fortitude,nor any legal responsibilty to preemptively protect individuals. Remain a "sheep", Mr Reeves -I pray that you will never NEED that .22 revolver that you have so "safely" stored away in its case.

    The right to be armed in defense of one's person is not subject to a "license" anymore than your right to disseminate stupidity is regulated by a "license" (unfortunately). Butthe sowing of yourseeds of stupidity on the pages of the Star Telegram is your RIGHT - protected by the same Constitution that protectsmy right to wear a firearm openly (or concealed for that matter) as provision for defense against criminal confrontation.OH - and PLEEASE spare us the "no right is absolute" CROCK - that dribbleslikespittle from the lips of tyrannts and their pathetic servants! MY RIGHT to keep and bear armsthat "shall (no longer) be infringed" - is most certainly ABSOLUTE !

    I resent Mr Reeve's hi-jacking the "sports page" of the Star Telegram to lobby for my wife and daughters to be rendered defenseless. Fortunately my loved ones and I will excercise our rights as we deem it necessary inspite of your opposition or any unconstitutional "law" on the books in Texas or any otherjurisdiction.

    Perhaps Mr Reeves will "hang-in" here for a time and expose himself to aalternative view-point...... and exchange his .22 in-the-box in for a holstered .45 ???


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    I wrote this e-mail; dunno if it'll get read but it highlights the more egregious demonstrations of ignorance.

    First let me say that Plaxico screwed up royally, and will pay the price for it. Even in Texas and Florida, it is illegal to carry a gun into a bar or nightclub, even if you have a permit to carry concealed. Yes, gun laws are far tougher in New York and New Jersey (so tough in fact that few if any people own guns; it's too difficult to get Statepermission to buy and own one), but I bet you anything that if the same situation had happened to Terrell Owens here in Texas, the DPD would have matched the response time of NYC's finest.

    I however wish to comment on some blatantly uneducated statements you made in this column. First of all, Plaxico would have had to have been an absolute genius to be able to successfully "work the safety on his pistol". A Glock, after all, does not have a safety switch; its safety mechanisms are totally internal and cannot be actively engaged. The number-one safety system of any firearm is the shooter, specifically his or her adherence to the four rules of gun handling, the two applicable ones here being "treat every gun as if it were always loaded" and "keep your finger off the trigger until you wish to fire at a target". As far as how all this could have happened if Plax had a Florida concealed weapon permit, I can only assume Plax's blood alcohol level was highly contributory to the situation. It is a universal truth that guns and alcohol, just like guns and cars, do not mix.

    Second, you seem to think that the police exist to protect you. That is not the case and has not been for a long time. The Supreme Court has ruled many times that the police do not have any sworn duty to protect any one person. Their job is to keep the peace, and enforce the law. If you are shot by a burglar in your own home, you can't hold the police responsible for "failing to protect you". And at some level, you recognize this; you bought a .22 and kept it around for your wife's use, "just in case". You realize that the police cannot be everywhere all the time. Next time you're walking around downtown or in a shopping mall, keep your eyes peeled for police officers, and more specifically, keep track of the time in which an officer is NOT within sight. As long as you cannot actually see a police officer, the police will not be able to intervene quickly enough on your behalf to save you, or even catch the bad guy, should you be mugged, assaulted or shot. It's a sobering realization, and the reason that "gun lovers" carry however and wherever it is legal to do so.

    Third, the idea that Plaxico should have hired a couple of bodyguards if he felt he needed protection may be plausible, but your implication is that nobody needs a gun; we can all rely on a security guard (the overwhelming majority of which do not carry weapons) or a personal bodyguard. This appears to be a common thread among wealthy gun control advocates; stars like Oprah and Rosie have the gall to say that guns should be banned while being flanked by armed men.

    Fourth, your statistic of the Florida concealed weapon permittees' crime rate. You say that in the past 12 months, there were three unlawful killings for which permittees were convicted. The worst case scenario for my argument is that those three killings are the only homicides committed in Florida. If that were the case, the Attorney General would be getting a medal. Obviously it is not. I do not have accurate Florida crime data handy, but since you're equating the two states in terms of their lax gun laws, I do have data for Texas permittees. In 2006, the most recent year with complete data, CHL holders, who represent just over 1% of the population, were convicted of only two-tenths of a percent of all crimes committed in Texas. If CHLs were as crime prone as you infer, those numbers should at least match; one percent of Texas residents committing one percent of the crimes. In reality, the gun-carrying community as currently exists is four times LESS likely to commit ANY crime. The crime most CHLs were arrested for? I'm ashamed to say it, but it'sDUI. Even then, theoverall residentpopulation of Texas is arrested4 timesmore often for that same crime.

    You would argue that a CHL holder knows what he's doing; he's been through a class and a qualification. I agree, but that by no means infers that those who do not have a CHL do not know the same things. In fact,I would consider it a grave personalinsult. I am a responsible gun owner. I am well-versed in Texas gun law, basic tactics, conflict resolution, and practical ability. I could, right this moment, pass the written test and practical qualification (frankly, it's not difficult).I simply do not feel like paying the government around $250 (the highest overall cost of any state which issues concealed carry permits non-discretionally; so-called "shall-issue" policy) to get government permission to protect myself. So, I protect myself where I am allowed, and lobby to protect myself in more places without needing special permission.

    Lastly, if you'd rather be blissfully ignorant of the fact that any given person around you is a CHL holder, does that also mean you'd rather be blissfully ignorant of the man behind you in line who is concealing a weapon WITHOUT a permit because he's about to rob the store? Ignorance is not bliss; you have definitely demonstrated your ignorance of many things in this article, yet you do not seem to be blissful about it. Criminals conceal their weapons just as lawful CHL holder do. Why? Becauseaconvicted felon isnot supposed to have them, and because they're banking on the element of surprise to startle people into doing what they want. However, criminals also do not like a fair fight. If there is the possibility of resistance,someone intent on committing a crime will more often than not choose a different victim or locale.An openly carried weapondoesn't just present the possibility of resistance, it guarantees it. Such is the deterrent effect of an openly carried weapon, and whenever you see one you should feel very safe; at that moment, you are the least likely to be the victim of a crime that you will be in your life.

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