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Thread: Medical Questionnaires

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    Regular Member SFCRetired's Avatar
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    "Happiness is a warm shotgun!!"
    "I am neither a pessimist nor a cynic. I am, rather, a realist."
    "The most dangerous things I've ever encountered were a Second Lieutenant with a map and a compass and a Private who was bored and had time on his hands."

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    Regular Member Decoligny's Avatar
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    SFCRetired wrote:
    Seeing the thread, "Doctors vs Gunowners" brought to mind a visit I made to a civilian (as opposed to the military doctors I normally see)doctor some time back. On the questionnaire they had, the questions were asked as to whether I owned any guns, how many, and where they were stored. I absolutely refused to answer those questions.

    Has anyone else had that sort of experience? What was the doctor's reaction to your refusal to answer (mine got irate)?

    For the record, I told the good doctor that whether or not I owned guns, how many, or where they were kept was not relevant to my medical treatment and therefore was none of her business. That was after she tried to chew me out for not answering.
    Just answer as follows:

    1. Yes

    2. 4,852

    3. Various Underground Caches hidden throughout the State.



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    wtf kind of medical questionnaire is that? I recently (well, relatively recently) changed doctors and there was nothing of the sort on the questionnaire. What does that have to do with your health? Were you seeing your general practitioner or checking into a psych ward?

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    I think that type of question is when you take your child for a check-up. I took my 5 year old about 2 months ago to the doctor and I had the same question on the form. I also would not answer it. I told my doctoer it had nothing to do with a check-up for my daughter.

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    Regular Member VAopencarry's Avatar
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    It's a questionnaire the AMA is telling their Dr's to use.

    If my doctor even gave me that questionnaire it would be the last time they saw me. If they got irate at me, well there would be a scene.
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson

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    AMA? Is that the Assinie Meddlers Association?

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    Very good! But Assistant Meddler's Association, assistant to the Obamination (once the looney-left).

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    Joxer wrote:
    I think that type of question is when you take your child for a check-up. I took my 5 year old about 2 months ago to the doctor and I had the same question on the form. I also would not answer it. I told my doctoer it had nothing to do with a check-up for my daughter.


    Ahhhh, that makes sense. I still wouldn't answer, but at least I can see some sort of a purpose.

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    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    AWDstylez wrote:
    Ahhhh, that makes sense. I still wouldn't answer, but at least I can see some sort of a purpose.
    What is the purpose?

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    buster81 wrote:
    What is the purpose?
    More 'karma' since there is no credibility.

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    buster81 wrote:
    AWDstylez wrote:
    Ahhhh, that makes sense. I still wouldn't answer, but at least I can see some sort of a purpose.
    What is the purpose?


    From there point of view, obviously it's to see if the child is in any danger. Do you realize how many irresponisble idiots there are out there? If they're truely that stupid, maybe they're stupid enough to tell people how stupid they are on a survey.

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Given that many more children die in car accidents and from drowning wouldn't it make more sense (assuming the AMA didn't have an agenda and they do) to ask:

    Do you have any standing water 3" or deeper anywhere in our around your home?

    Do you ever transport your child in a motorized vehicle and if so do you use car seats and other child specific safety devices?
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    VAopencarry wrote:
    It's a questionnaire the AMA is telling their Dr's to use.

    If my doctor even gave me that questionnaire it would be the last time they saw me. If they got irate at me, well there would be a scene.
    That is exactly right.

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    deepdiver wrote:
    Given that many more children die in car accidents and from drowning wouldn't it make more sense (assuming the AMA didn't have an agenda and they do) to ask:

    Do you have any standing water 3" or deeper anywhere in our around your home?

    Do you ever transport your child in a motorized vehicle and if so do you use car seats and other child specific safety devices?
    You are right.

    Here are the states for the latest accidental deathsfor children, for 2005 (most current data) for children 0-14

    Accidental Discharge of firearm 75

    Falls 82

    Poison 92

    Drowning 810

    Fire 1,270

    Transportation 2,340

    Also I include those for assaults, (though not an accident) 1,022


    http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/deaths.htm

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    Well, if you have the gun shoved up a cavity, I guess it could be a relavent question.
    After all if she removed the glock, and didn't know about the s&w also stuffed
    back there it might mess up the MRI machine. Liabilty is the evil to of us all.

    Seem to recall a female prisoneer shooting herself while pulling her well hidden gun,
    while in lock up.

    But have never seen that one yet myself, if in a good mood I might answer
    a howitzer burried in the schoolbus in the back yard.
    Maybe ask for clarification if I need to include my plastic explosives?:celebrate:celebrate

    It might just be for future revenue collection, when you don't pay your bill.
    Yes i'm shure it is just for inocent revenue streams for collection purposes.


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    When my kids were young, similar questions were on the child safety questionaire. However, overall, the questions made sense.

    There were simple questions about carseats, smoking, poisons & chemicals stored in the home, and child safety locks. Not only did they ask about firearms,butreloading as well.

    These were all just questions to invoke discussion about how to keep the kids safe. Yes, we smoked, but always did it outside the home and away from kids. Yes, we had cleaning chemicals in low cabinets, but all the cabinets had child locks. Yes we had an appropriate carseat, etc. etc.

    I asked him about the firearms questions, and he replied it's simply to open discussion about safe firearm storage around the kids, and the reloading question was specifically about the potential for lead exposure. With shooting and reloading, to make sure to wash hands thoroughly before handling the kids, etc. etc.

    So I think the question "do you own any firearms" is just as appropriate as any other safety question for a pediatrician to ask and discuss, and it's also within our right to refuse to answer, or givea minimumamount ofinformation.

    If this is the only question they're asking, I'd call their professionalism into question, but if it's included in a battery of other safety-related questions, probably they do have your child's safety in mind.

    This can also give opportunity to set straight any misconceptions or misinformation and be a good ambassador for firearms owners, rather than get snippy and secretive. Your pediatrician doesn't work for the government, y'know.

    ...Orygunner...

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    Safety is the first act of security theater and the tyrant's tool because no one can be against safety.

    I hope your kid is not liable to eat bullets like those with Blood Lead Level ingest lead based paint etc. Sad hysteria.

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    Yes, there was a question about how old our house was, too, in regards to the possibility of there being lead paint on the walls/trim. I think they also asked about fishing and lead weights.

    I agree that safety is a tyrant's tool, but should that mean we also throw out legitimate safety discussions, and eye every mention of "safety" and "firearms" in the same sentence as tyrannical?

    We certainly have a right to question when such things are asked. "Why do you want to know?" "Is this a survey?" "Will this information be given to anyone else?" And respond to the answers accordingly. A knee-jerk reaction of "It's none of your damn business and I'm finding another doctor" if any question about firearms comes up is pretty short-sighted and does nothing to help further a positive view of firearms owners, and makes us look like paranoid gun-nuts.

    Not to say that's not an appropriate response depending on the circumstances. If the Dr. is obviously a rabid anti-gun freak or some sort of government informantpredominantly focused onwhether or not you have guns so he can try to talk you into getting rid of them, sure, tell them to sit and spin and go find another doctor. However,I would see this as an opportunity for a positive discussion to throw some real facts their way and see if they're really as intelligent as the diploma on the wall claims they are.

    I was forewarned (read it on the Internet!) about these "surveys" and was prepared to ask the Dr. why when it came up.After determining no malice in the question, we had a brief discussion withabout the same duration and intent as discussing the fish pond in our backyard and drowning risks for little ones.

    ...Orygunner...

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    Firearms safety should be foremost in the mind of EVERY gun owner whenever they are around firearms.

    However, it should NEVER be mandated by government. It rather should be policed by gun owners themselves. I.e., if you see someone doing something unsafe with a gun, correct them (constructively).

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    Some of us do have an agenda!

    The following is from Doctors For Sensible Gun Laws


    Risk Management Advice to Physicians and their Insurers:
    Don't Borrow Trouble


    By Joe Horn


    Since retiring and leaving Law Enforcement, I have been active in Risk Management consulting, a field that has grown rapidly throughout every industry over the past 20 years. Some of the companies I have consulted to for risk management include IBM, Gates Lear jet, National Semiconductor, and Pinkerton International Protection Services.


    One of the best games in town is litigation, and litigating against physicians is even more popular than suing gun manufacturers. Physicians and their malpractice insurance carriers are well aware that litigators are constantly looking for new opportunities to sue. Let's talk about one of those new areas of exposure.


    Nowadays, many physicians and other health care providers are engaging in the very risky, well intentioned, but naive and politically inspired business of asking their patients about ownership, maintenance and storage of firearms in the home. Some could argue that this is a "boundary violation," and it probably is, but there is another very valid reason why these professionals should NOT engage in this practice -- MASSIVE LIABILITY.


    Physicians are licensed and certified in the practice of medicine, the treatment of illnesses and injuries, and in preventative activities. They may advise or answer questions about those issues. However, when physicians give advice about firearms safety in the home, without certification in that field, and without physically INSPECTING that particular home and those particular firearms, they are functioning outside the practice of medicine. Furthermore, if they fail to review the gamut of safety issues in the home, such as those relating to electricity, drains, disposals, compactors, garage doors, driveway safety, pool safety, pool fence codes and special locks for pool gates, auto safety, gas, broken glass, stored cleaning chemicals, buckets, toilets, sharp objects, garden tools, home tools, power tools, lawnmowers, lawn chemicals, scissors, needles, forks, knives, and on and on, well, you get the drift. A litigator could easily accuse that physician of being NEGLIGENT for not covering whichever one of those things that ultimately led to the death or injury of a child or any one in the family or even a visitor to the patient's home.


    To engage in Home Safety Counseling without certification, license or formal training in Risk Management and to concentrate on one small politically correct area, i.e., firearms to the neglect of ALL of the other safety issues in the modern home, is to invite a lawsuit because the safety counselor Knew, Could have known or SHOULD have known that there were other dangers to the occupants of that house more immediate than firearms. Things like swimming pools, buckets of water, and chemicals in homes are involved in the death or injury of many more children than accidental firearms discharge [ Source: CDC.] Firearms are a statistically small, nearly negligible fraction of the items involved in home injuries. Physicians SHOULD know that. So, why all of a sudden do some physicians consider themselves to be firearms safety experts? Where is their concern for all the other safety issues that they DON'T cover with their patients?


    Once physicians start down this path of home safety counseling, they are completely on their own. A review of their medical malpractice insurance will reveal that if they engage in an activity for which they are not certified, the carrier will not cover them if (or when) they get sued.


    Consider a physician asking the following questions of his or her malpractice insurance carrier:



    1. One of my patients is suing me for NOT warning them that furniture polish was poisonous and their child drank it and died. I only warned them about firearms, drugs and alcohol. Am I covered for counseling patients about firearms safety while not mentioning and giving preventative advice about all the other dangers in the home, and doing so without formal training or certification in any aspect of home safety risk management? You know their answer.



    2. How much training and certification do I need to become a Home Safety Expert Doctor? They will tell you that you are either a pediatrician or you are the National Safety Council. But, you don't have certification to do the National Safety Council's job for them.

    Homeowners and parents are civilly or criminally responsible for the safety or lack thereof in their homes. My advice to physicians is to not borrow trouble by presuming to be able to dispense safety advice outside your area of expertise: the practice of medicine. Your insurance carrier will love you if you simply treat injuries and illnesses, dispense advice on how to care for sick or injured persons, manage sanitation problems and try to prevent disease, but stay out of the Risk Management business unless you are trained and certified to do it.

    (c) 2000

    Joe Horn
    6th Mesa Risk Management,
    Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department, Retired





    Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
    http://www.dsgl.org/



    Mission Statement
    Our mission is to educate our fellow doctors and their patients, the public, about gun laws that are counterproductive and the deceitful tactics of those who advocate gun control. We offer a healthy dose of common sense to the national gun debate by shedding light on what gun laws are sensible, and which ones most certainly are not.
    Doctors:

    1. Need to know that their organizations do not speak for all of them.
    2. Need to know that support is available from their fellow doctors.
    3. Need to know that "junk science" is being used for political gain in many of their organizations.
    4. Need to be reminded of "boundary violations" that can occur for political reasons in their offices.
    5. Need to know the facts about firearms, self defense, the Constitution, freedom and liberty.
    Patients:
    1. Need to know about "boundary violations" by politically correct doctors.
    2. Need to know about good vs. junk science, and how the latter is used to drive politically correct programs that have serious unintended consequences.
    3. Need to know what to do if their physicians do commit boundary violations.
    4. Need to be reminded of the lessons of history.
    The doctors of DSGL will speak out whenever possible to expose the lies, distortions and coldly calculated propaganda tactics of those who ruthlessly attack the self-defense rights of the American people.




    "You do not examine legislation in light of the benefits it will convey if properly administered, but in light of the wrongs it would do and the harms it would cause if improperly administered."
    ~~ Lyndon B. Johnson



    Doctors for Sensible Gun LawsTM resulted from the collaboration of members of KeepAndBearArms.com.





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    Similar scenario a few years ago when "shopping" for a new doctor... First visit, a lot of paperwork, and many offensive questions includingthe gun questions, family history, which I understand the purpose, but still don't think they need to know until a particular problem comes into play....

    Add to that.. I refused to show ID and allow them to make a copy of my driver's license (which is in fact, illegal in Virginia), nor would I furnish them with my SSN. Obviously, my first visit was not going well and I hadn't even gotten past the front counter yet.

    Eventually, they bring me in to see the doc and he begins by questioning why I won't cooperate. I explain everything to him. He was not aware that it was illegal to copy a driver's license in Virginia. He was unaware (still not sure I believe this one), that the questionnaire included gun questions. His office manager runs the front office, and had obtained generic forms provided by the AMA.

    The Doc turned out to be pretty cool - former military guy, so I stuck with him. He had a new office manager by my second visit, and I've never been hasseled since.



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    Some years ago such a question was on a medical history intake form I filled out when selecting a new doctor after I'd moved. I just left it (and a few other questions) blank, and nothing was said.

    This was in Texas, so I would imagine that simply not answering was being extremely polite by local standards.

    I would also guess that for HMOs and like organizations (this was an HMO I was using), such questions come from bureaucrats in corporate HQ, and may or may not reflect an individual physician's ideas. I still won't answer such.

    regards,

    GR

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    Orygunner wrote:
    I agree that safety is a tyrant's tool, but should that mean we also throw out legitimate safety discussions, and eye every mention of "safety" and "firearms" in the same sentence as tyrannical?

    Exactly. Sometimes Doug gets a little wrapped up in his generalizing cliches. Just because safety can be used as a tool for control, doesn't mean we get rid of safety all together. As I said before, there are lots of irresponisble parents out there and just as many irresponsible gun owning parents. I can definitely see why they would have a question like that.

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    There are an infinite number of ways kids might get hurt. I've broken a lot of bones and spent quite a lot of time in hospitals for other things as well. I've never been shot, to date, so this "concern for childrens safety" is useless and intrusive.

    I've missed out on jobs because of my refusal to sign blanket releases for my medical and credit records. I called a corporate legal department once to remind them that their request for information regarding a recent medical exam was in violation of my HIPAA Act rights. They agreed, and then also agreed not to hire me, presumablybecause I was a troublemaker.

    -ljp

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    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    AWDstylez wrote:
    Orygunner wrote:
    I agree that safety is a tyrant's tool, but should that mean we also throw out legitimate safety discussions, and eye every mention of "safety" and "firearms" in the same sentence as tyrannical?

    Exactly. Sometimes Doug gets a little wrapped up in his generalizing cliches. Just because safety can be used as a tool for control, doesn't mean we get rid of safety all together. As I said before, there are lots of irresponisble parents out there and just as many irresponsible gun owning parents. I can definitely see why they would have a question like that.
    It's not the responsibility of the doctor to make your home "safe" and it certainly isn't their business whether or not you own any firearms.
    Peace through superior firepower

    Luke 11:21
    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

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