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Thread: Legal Carry at a Gun Banned employer

  1. #1
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    Well, my employer forbids guns at work, so, it is a pain to go the range after work.

    I could have sworn that a Michigan Judge ruled, this spring ('08),that the rules of management stops at my locked car, providing that I follow the law of the municipality?


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    AAMitch wrote:
    Well, my employer forbids guns at work, so, it is a pain to go the range after work.

    I could have sworn that a Michigan Judge ruled, this spring ('08),that the rules of management stops at my locked car, providing that I follow the law of the municipality?
    As far as I know, that's not true. If your employee has a policy prohibiting firearms on their property, then that means no firearms on their property, assuming it's private property you're parked on.

    As far as legality, even if you carried it in to work, you would not be breaking any firearm laws, but you may be open for trespassing charges, and of course being fired.

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    Regular Member JeffSayers's Avatar
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    I heard something to that affect as well as it should be. However, don't forget the definition of "at will employment".
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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    You gotta make up your own mind, but a lot of people would say better to be judged by 12, or fired by 1, then to be carried by 6.

    Although to be fair, I can't remember the last time I actually feared for my safety in Ann Arbor.
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    Michigan Moderator Big Gay Al's Avatar
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    What it comes down to is this. IF you carry at work, and your employer forbids it, and finds out. Chances are likely that you will not be arrested, or charged with a crime, but you will most likely be out of a job. And, you may be denied unemployment benefits as well.

    Now, the question arises, do you park your car on your employer's property, or on public property? If you don't park on property controlled by your employer, then you're safe. If you park on your employer's property, he can ask to look in your car at any time, and you can of course, refuse. But then you'll probably be looking for another job.

    Your choice, essentially.
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    How does your employer forbiding the posession of weapons on the property fare when the employer is municipal? Does such a rule collide with Michigan's pre-emption law?

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    Dan F. wrote:
    How does your employer forbiding the posession of weapons on the property fare when the employer is municipal?* Does such a rule collide with Michigan's pre-emption law?*
    AFAIK, there are only two explicit exemptions given by the state from the preemption law, and one of them's my employer. That's to U of M, and MSU.

    Everything else is pre-empted, save court rooms. But if it's private property, you're at the mercy of the owner of said property.


    Edit: I should add that you may not want to piss off your employer....

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    I am not looking to carry at work just lawfully to work, so I can shoot clays afterwords.

    I do notfeel threatened in Plymouth either. However, it is very ominous when you come out of work and notice 4 news coppers (buzzards)in the air.Everyone from the surrounding businesses standing around looking lost. Because, some dumb broken hearted fool took his life as well as his ex-whatever.

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    Michigan Moderator Big Gay Al's Avatar
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    AAMitch wrote:
    I am not looking to carry at work just lawfully to work, so I can shoot clays afterwords.
    That's what the second part of my previous message covers.
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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    AFAIK, there are only two explicit exemptions given by the state from the preemption law, and one of them's my employer. That's to U of M, and MSU.
    Where does it say that? I had been hoping that some student of a state college would have the balls to take them on and OC with a CPL. I'm gonna be bummed out if they made a law against that.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

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    Michigan Moderator Big Gay Al's Avatar
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    Michigander wrote:
    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    AFAIK, there are only two explicit exemptions given by the state from the preemption law, and one of them's my employer. That's to U of M, and MSU.
    Where does it say that? I had been hoping that some student of a state college would have the balls to take them on and OC with a CPL. I'm gonna be bummed out if they made a law against that.
    I believe partly, it comes from the following section of the act, dealing with definitions.

    123.1101 Definitions.
    Sec. 1. As used in this act:
    (a) “Local unit of government” means a city, village, township, or county.
    (b) “Pistol” means that term as defined in section 222 of the Michigan penal code, Act No. 328 of the Public Acts of 1931, being section 750.222 of the Michigan Compiled Laws.

    Typically, those laws that include colleges and universities will include a line stating so. The firearm pre-emption law contains no such line, there by allowing colleges and universities to make their own gun laws.

    To get these entities to fall in line behind the rest of the state, we would need to amend the pre-emption law to include them.

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    Big Gay Al
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  12. #12
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    AAMitch wrote:
    Well, my employer forbids guns at work, so, it is a pain to go the range after work.

    I could have sworn that a Michigan Judge ruled, this spring ('08),that the rules of management stops at my locked car, providing that I follow the law of the municipality?
    Per MCRGO FAQ's:

    I work for a major Auto Company and shoot at a range next to the plant. It would be convenient for me to leave my pistol locked in my trunk during the day and shoot after work. The plant has a sign in
    the parking lot that says no guns allowed. Am I risking my job if I leave my pistol locked in my car?


    A:
    The short answer is “Yes.” The complete answer is more complex. Michigan law allows a person to carry a concealed pistol “anywhere in this state.” This would seem to cover your employer’s parking lot. But there is an exception found in section 5n(b) which allows an employer to prohibit, “… an employee from carrying a concealed pistol in the course of his or her employment with that employer.” The phrase “in the course of” is not defined in the statute,
    but the workers compensation statute contains identical wording. That statute has been interpreted by the courts as, “…the concept of course of employment was formulated to encompass activity falling within the normal
    sphere of employee activity associated with the work routine.” Parking your car in the employer’s lot would be within the normal sphere of employee activity associated with the work routine. Michigan courts have almost universally found an employee to be in the course of employment while in the
    parking lot or crossing the street between the parking lot and workstation.
    Obviously, you are not carrying the pistol while at your workstation, but you would have to “carry” it into and out of the parking lot. You as an employee have a duty to obey legal rules. Unless somehow modified by a collective bargaining agreement, your employer would be justified in firing you if it
    discovered that you had a gun in your car.

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